The hilarious, the stupid, the frail and shallow... WOMEN! So why do TiM's want to "become" us so bad?

submitted by vitunrotta from (self.GenderCritical)

I live in a Southern European country, pretty macho although it tries to sell itself as "equal" (compared to other Southern European countries, that is). Anyway - sexism and misogyny is still rampant here and women are expected to look super feminine all the time: hair done, nail salon visits weekly, waxing off all of your body hair, looking tan, dressing "prettily" etc. (I won't mention "scantily" because when temperatures often reach over +35C [that's about a 100F for you fellow U.S. peeps!] at summer, one tends to wear as little as possible for obvious reasons.)

Anyway, that was just a bit of a background. When I first arrived here about a decade ago I recall there was this yearly "Carnival" thing (think of Mardi Gras) and people would put on a costume and get wasted - as one does. And what did guys dress up as? Women. No joke, almost all of them would dress up as women - or should I say, just slap on an ugly wig, a dress, and speak in a "womanly" high pitched, mocking voice (you know the type) whilst making fun of "feminine traits" (you can probably imagine this as well, the list is too long to write down...) And this was well before the current gender ideology had even been heard of here.

I found this completely bizarre at first, but very soon just thought it was really offensive. So this was the time of the year where you could dress up as Kermit the frog or Dracula or whatever... And you dress up as a terrible caricature of a woman and then mock the hell out of presumed feminine habits and manners. Coming from a prettttyyy equal Nordic country originally I found this behaviour odd to say the least. Why did men feel (and still do) the need to do this? To get in touch with their "feminine" side? Pfft, I think not. While the country itself is hellbent on being seen as some new flagship of equality, the regular Joe still thinks women are some idiotic, screeching make-up addicts who throw hissy fits because their spouse didn't get them the right coloured roses for anniversary etc. etc. etc. (I don't want to conflate the two but it's a little bit like every year all the white people would put on blackface and then merrily make fun of every stupid, horrible, racist stereotype they could come up with...)

Also, when I've been catcalled and then shouted back "bitch!" to the guy who leered at me, their instant reaction has been super aggressive - compared to when I just yell "shut up, moron" or something. Every time. Being a woman here is still kind of a semi-joke and being called a slur meant for women is the most terrible insult ever. (I could almost see their ballsacks shrivel when I hurl these kinds of words back at them...) Once I also called an ex-boyfriend "a fancy lady" because he was lying on the couch looking like Rose "FrEnCh giRL" from goddamn Titanic, and I thought it was funny looking... And he dared to start yelling at me for INSULTING HIM. After the initial shock I gave him a lengthy, heated lecture of how much that reaction actually insulted me - like me calling him a "lady" was such a terrible, awful, soul-ripping slur! As if being a woman, or being called one, was the most fucking offensive thing he had ever heard! Jesus wept.

So - I would like to hear more from women and men who are from countries that are infamous for their inherent misogyny. Does this happen everywhere? Is it the same e.g. in Latin America? What are your thoughts on why this still happens so much? What are the root causes and is there any real hope for future generations (of men) to be less misogynistic? What the hell is going on? Even after a decade I am baffled and although I do have some guesses/theories, they are a bit shallow as I haven't lived most of my life in this country - and I don't want to start making uninformed guesses.

This is especially curious to me nowadays when the supposed "womanhood" (or rather, creating a disgusting caricature of it - talking about TiM's) is now something guys WANT to be. WTF! Wasn't it supposed to be the worst? Or is this whole gender circus happening mainly in countries that are less "traditional" (read: less conservative and more equal)? Is this "I feel like a woman" shit some weird pushback towards societies where women are suddenly no more in such a weak position - and guys who feel insecure/personally attacked by this then try to colonize the entire womanhood as they cannot actually handle being equals?

Bit of a ramble, hope I managed to make some sense. Thanks in advance to anyone who had the patience to read and/or reply :)

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[–]Literallyawoman 30 insightful - 1 fun30 insightful - 0 fun31 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Just personal experience in the US, the trans women I know irl are all very skinny and androgynous, not stereotypically masculine at all, and two are really toxic people-controlling and needy.

Both are dating (this is harsh but true) insecure, overweight, submissive women, so when the transwomen wear flashy outfits and makeup while constantly shifting the conversation to themselves and their gender identity politics their girlfriends are “supportive” by being submissive to the point it made ME uncomfortable-just like seeing any emotionally abusive relationship out in public. It’s just so obviously an unequal partnership with lots of internalized misogyny from the women who make themselves so small for their men because they don’t love themselves or feel worthy of love and respect. Replace the stereotype of a wife-beater wearing a tank top throwing beer cans at his wife while screaming at her, with a transbian whipping her purse at her wife while screaming at her, that’s the vibe they give off....bc they’re abusive men.

And as for the transwomen/transbians they obviously are damaged from toxic masculinity and not living up to gender stereotypes for males so they go complete opposite-which is just a gender stereotype of females.

I also know a fair amount of gender fluid/queer people who are all “dating” each other but aren’t intimate romantically or sexually and essentially are forever alone roommates because again-instead of self love and respect they are cripplingly insecure and conflate love and acceptance from others with being tolerated and told they don’t have to change/work on themselves-they take so much fake pride in being overweight, or having mental health issues, as if that and their gender identity is what soley defines them as people.

And you know what, without having self esteem or putting themselves in uncomfortable situations to become healthier like getting therapy, or counting calories, or having a physical hobby, they really don’t have anything else.

They’re miserable together, constantly fighting amounts themselves and controlling each other with mental abuse like threatening suicide. It’s awful to witness and I stay tf away from them now. They're not representative of actual trans people but it seems they are the majority of the “movement” -just attention starved, emotionally stunted kids and young adults here.

[–]vitunrotta[S] 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh god, that was a pretty sad read. :/ Seems to me like pretty much all of these gender maniacs do indeed suffer from one or more mental issues that have never been properly addressed. And because this "I identify as such-and-such" is now conveniently sold as some kind of a cure-for-all - why would people even think that there's probably something else that may be wrong? Assessing one's own mental health is usually not easy (speaking of experience, heh) and it is definitely NOT easy to find out there's something wrong but... it's the first step towards healing.

I mean I don't know. Of course, we are speaking of a wide range of people and I don't want to generalize too much. However - as has been mentioned many times already - if a person suffering from anorexia would suddenly be told "YAY! Let's get skinnier! That really IS the solution!" it would be seen as horrible abuse and misunderstanding a very serious mental problem.

All of this is quite baffling. A lot of people also don't have the mental capacity/strength to say "look, I am a MAN who loves lipstick!" ...and so they just go for this gender-nonsense as it's easier. (I don't necessarily blame people who cannot muster the courage to step out as a proud DUDE who just so happens to like glitter nail polish but... the solution is also not taking over womanhood and trying to redefine it & biological facts.)

[–]PlayCardsNotPeople 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

From that same northern perspective:
The ones dressing up as women for the carnival and at other times feeling insulted be being called women: they've been brought up in that macho culture and have never even thought about it.
A nice mixture of homophobia and medley of stereotypes about women.
Having been brought up to "be a man" to be accepted by daddy.
And the women who spend their lives doing their nails aren't exactly making the guys think about it.
As to the TiMs. They pick one of the stereotypes and ignore the others. I mean, how often do you hear about a TiM aiming to become a grandma cooking, cleaning and doing laundry for the whole clan? That's not the stereotype they have in mind when they prance around doing their nails. I expect they manage to ignore other stereotypes that don't speak to them just as well. What I find curious are these TiMs who insist that now that they are "women", they are physically weak. That's a very specific stereotype that I don't see a lot of actual women glorifying. Or maybe I just don't mix in the right circles, heh.
So did your ex get it, when he got the lecture about why his reaction was so inappropiate?

[–]vitunrotta[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I am inclined to believe we DO have some women and/or men from aforementioned cultures. If I completely misread the whole Carnival "let's dress as women because it's super fun and offensive" -theme, then I would love to hear about it. No one here?

Nobody?

Hello?