***REDDIT MELTDOWN WATCH*** ROE VS WADE ABOUT TO BE OVERTURNED

submitted by Tarrock from (self.MeanwhileOnReddit)

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[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (21 children)

Do you not see the problem with considering a person someone's property in the first place?

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (20 children)

'property' is not the issue. A fetus is part of the mother, part of her body.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

So we should just have a mater familias system where children are nothing more than an extension of their mother who owns them to the point of having the right to kill them?

[–]sproketboy 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

Stop asking u/socks hard questions! It's wacists!

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

work on your reading comprehension

[–]sproketboy 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

WACIST

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No, I'm stupidist.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

That's not related to my comment.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

Yes it is, because you are basically saying that a baby is just part of its mother and has no rights of its own.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

that's not what I wrote, nor is it implied in what I wrote

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

You said a fetus is part of the mother's body and therefore the mother can do whatever she wants with it.

[–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

No. I wrote:

Even if you wish to argue that an unborn first trimester fetus is 50% the property of a man (though it's not), the 50% ownership of the fetus by the mother would give her as much right to determine what is best for her and the fetus. Overturning RvW would remove that right from the woman in 22 states. The rights of the man would be greater than those of the mother. Moreover, one can easily show that the mother has much greater than 50% of the right to determine what is best for her and the fetus. Men who want to have children can make arrangements with women who want to have children. Men do not have the right to force women to have children, regardless of unethical laws in some states.

and then this:

'property' is not the issue. A fetus is part of the mother, part of her body.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

'property' is not the issue. A fetus is part of the mother, part of her body.

That's what I said you said. And it is a property issue, since you say a fetus belongs to the mother. But it is its own being. It moves on its own, grows its own brain, has its own senses, and its own heartbeat. That is not the same as an arm or a leg. Should a siamese twin be allowed to chop the other's head off because it's "part of their body"?

This is not a men vs women thing, this has nothing to do with men thinking they should have control over women. Men aren't even relevant here. But that's how the media portrays it to you. When seen from that angle, that being against abortion is meant to take away womens' rights, and ignoring the argument about life, being pro-choice makes sense. But that's fake news. Conservatives have genuinely cared about this for a very long time. They didn't actually become insane fascists until the middle of 2020, when the left was asking for it by burning down entire towns rioting and looting and false flagging as anarchists. Then they started being racist, sexist, alphabet-phobic, and obsessed with enforcing tradition and natural order and purging "degeneracy". The abortion battle has been raging for far longer than that, so it can't be rooted in their much more recent sexist beliefs.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

I see your point, but my argument is, as I've noted, that the fetus not be called 'property'; that the fetus is actually a part of the mother's body, specially in the first trimester, when significant portions of the brain have not developed. The mental independence of the fetus - its consciousness - does not develop until the period of weeks 12-16. In the first trimester, the womb and umbilical cord and mother are essentially the identity of the fetus, which - at 12 weeks - reaches only 5.4cm in length, weighing only 18 grams. At that stage, its identity is as an attachment to the mother. Individualized characteristics and consciousness develop thereafter.