GC: How do you feel about out trans people choosing to become parents?

submitted by worried19 from (self.GCdebatesQT)

So there was recently a thread on Ovarit where I tried to stick up for the rights of trans people to have their own kids, and my view was apparently very unpopular. I was called a "troll" and a "man" by a couple of aggressive posters and got downvoted to hell.

https://ovarit.com/o/GenderCritical/74540/the-rise-and-prevalence-of-pregnant-transmen-and-their-births-in-media-coverage

My view is that everyone should have the right to found a family, which is why sterilizing children who cannot give consent is such an ethical tragedy. In my book, we should not just care about saving the fertility of the ones who will eventually grow up and desist. We should care about saving the fertility of all of those children, including the ones who may grow up to identify as transgender in adulthood. All of those kids have the right to grow up to make their own reproductive choices. It doesn't only matter for the ones who are straight or non-trans. It matters for every single one of them.

While I do strongly agree that transitioning children is abusive, I do not believe that all transgender parents will try to transition their children. As far as teaching them gender ideology, a wrong belief does not an evil parent make. There are parents out there who teach their kids creationism or raise their kids in sexist religions. I think those beliefs are wrong, but it's not child abuse to have an incorrect belief system. As long as kids are kept physically and mentally safe, they can grow up and decide for themselves what to believe. Some may follow the ways of their parents, and others may not.

Other GC posters, how do you feel about it?

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[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I disagree intensely with the sentiment that everyone deserves a family. Plenty of people don’t.

I want to be fine with it, but the number of men who discuss their intentions to ‘breastfeed’, their rants over their existing childrens refusal to call them mum, and discuss having a child like it’s a pet have left me reserved.

Like all people, an aptitude for parenting is something that needs to be assessed case by case. Abusive people hide in every conceivable demographic.

[–]worried19[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't think everyone deserves a family, per se, but I do believe everyone should have the right to not be sterilized or prevented from having or keeping custody of their biological kids. We don't take people's kids away from them unless they've already proven themselves unfit.

Like all people, an aptitude for parenting is something that needs to be assessed case by case. Abusive people hide in every conceivable demographic.

That is true. I think everyone should be evaluated individually. There are certainly trans TRAs out there who would be terrible parents, but I don't think they're necessarily any worse than non-trans TRAs. After all, most of the cases of famous transitioned children come from married, heterosexual parents. I worry much more for Coy Mathis and Kai Shappley than I do for the children of Thomas Beatie, who seem to be living typical suburban lives.

[–]LemurLemur 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I'm not GC but...

I mean, there are Ovarit posts of GC people getting angry at the sight of trans people doing inane things like sitting in waiting rooms or shopping at stores. They get lathered up when trans people date, dye their hair, or mention feeling too good OR too bad about themselves or their bodies. People get downvoted for so much as saying "you can still be friends with someone who's trans."

I think in reality, most people suck. All parents make mistakes and have opinions that their children would be wise to scrutinize for whether or not it applies to themselves. I don't think a trans person would make a better parent than any other random member of any other demographic. I don't think they'd make a worse parent either, tho. As long as a child isn't isolated from the rest of the world, and can see what myriad different types of people are doing, and is allowed the freedom to explore these options with a sane amount of guidance, they'll likely have as much of a chance as anyone to turn out okay.

[–]SnowAssMan 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't think every man should have the "right" to reproduce, since that would require some form of surrogacy.

And, of course, not everyone has the right to adopt children.

Parent's can also get their children taken away from them, in cases where it is the best option for the child.

There are 4 different types of transgender people: straight & gay women, straight & gay men (even more if you consider those who medically transition vs those who don't). So, we'd have to consider each of the types separately. After thinking about it, I agree with you & don't think trans-identification alone, in any of the forms, should preclude someone from having children.

What I don't understand is why they think it's enough to simply "go off hormones" whenever they want to detrans for whatever the reason. I guess it's all part of the detransphobia. There is no help to try to "transition them back". In some cases the testosterone levels don't disappear for months (according accounts on r/detrans).

[–]peakingatthemomentTranssexual (natal male), HSTS 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you for defending trans people being parents! Sorry the people on Ovarit were so hostile to that.

I don’t think trans people are uniquely unfit to be parents or something like that. There are lot of non-trans people who aren’t great parents, but still have the right to reproduce if they choose to and trans people can be good parents. I made a thread about my own adoption stuff awhile ago that some interesting discussion in it I feel like.

https://saidit.net/s/GCdebatesQT/comments/77ke/both_disclosure_around_adoption/

It’s confusing about the sex dysphoria aspects with trans people who reproduce traditionally. I know it’s something I never could have done with my dysphoria (also orientation lol). Anyway, trans is broader now and doesn’t just include people with that dysphoria.

Hopefully we can get to a world where kids aren’t being sterilized. I’m not sure how much I feel like peoples autonomy should be restricted that way. Reproductive capability such an important thing and may not matter to you when you are young, but can mean a lot later. Assuming I had the ability before, I had a surgery when I was 18 that made it no longer possible and I feel like that wasn’t old enough to appreciate what that meant (even if it never would have worked for me, it’s sad to be a biological dead end). Kids would be even less likely to understand and, if you don’t experience puberty, I don’t even know if you fully develop a sexuality. We are still growing and the things we want can change. I don’t know the perfect solution. :(

[–]strictly 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Other GC posters, how do you feel about it?

I don't think fitness for parenthood should be determined by trans status, people should be treated as individuals.