Did Bread or Beer Create Civilization?

submitted by ruperttaylor from delishably.com

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[–]HugodeCrevellier 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Right, so, if you give some bread or beer to chimps, they become civilized!

But seriously, of course not.

This is materialist (Marxist-like) nonsense.

The brilliance of some people, who also happened to drink wine not beer, created civilization.

[–]jet199 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I think it's more the processes you have to go through to harvest wheat and brew beer which causes people to civilise.

[–]HugodeCrevellier 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Only that the civilizers, the Hellenes and Romans, happened to drink wine ... so beer has nothing to do with it.

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Greece wasn't a great civiliser.

They were great because they were a small nation who achieved a lot within their nation. Persia thought they were a minor nuisance.

But both existed many hundreds of years after the original civilisations.

[–]HugodeCrevellier 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Writing, which is an essential aspect of civilization, was indeed invented by the Sumerians well before 5th century BC Greece.

However, in terms of governance, the Persians and everybody else used the same system (government by some 'Alpha male', with perhaps some subservient allies) most commonly used in apes, including non-human ones, like chimps and gorillas.

Most peoples' instincts draw them to this so strongly that they'll invent some imaginary eternal alpha-male dictator/emperor/king/warlord/lord-deity to worship, lest, god forbid, they should find themselves without one.

What the Greek miracle achieved is to invent (besides philosophy/science, the Logos/logic, reason over superstition, medicine, etc.) politics, Democracy and everything else we consider truly civilized.

Basically, that you're not, today, the subservient bitch of some warlord or rabbinate (claiming to speak for some invisible supreme warlord in the sky) is thanks to some great thinkers in 5th century BC Greece.