QT: Do women have a right to boundaries?

submitted by Penultimate_Penance from (self.GCdebatesQT)

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[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

Yeah that’s bs. Women go into men’s rooms all the time just to use the bathroom themselves if for some reason they can’t get to the women’s room. And you don’t have to go into the bathroom to hear someone getting harmed in there and call for help. And just because one man may beat you up doesn’t mean another won’t stop it or at least alert someone that there’s a problem.

It’s really odd that you’d claim that someone would help you anywhere else but the bathroom. That just doesn’t make sense.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (17 children)

No man will help a trans woman in trouble. Only men go into men’s rooms. It’s that simple.

And exactly how is someone outside the bathroom likely to notice a beating behind a closed door. Maybe if it’s very, very quiet out. At minimum the odds are much less.

I’m not saying bathrooms are the only place we could be attacked, it’s just difficult to escape, exposes us directly to those who would hurt us, isolates from those who might get help, and minimizes witnesses. It’s a near worst case scenario for a victim.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

And I’m just saying it’s bs to act like nobody would ever hear someone get beat up in a bathroom in a public space. I guess if the person getting beat up is completely silent as well as the person beating them up, it’s possible. But the attacker still runs the risk of someone walking in as they beat you up, and still has to deal with what could happen when you leave the bathroom. They have to deal with possible cameras near bathrooms, any one waiting in line to use the bathroom... there’s a lot they’d have to avoid to beat someone up and not be seen or heard

And it’s laughable to act like women don’t ever go into men’s rooms and that no man would ever help a TW when there are men who are allies ans even men who date them. I know plenty of women who have and will use the men’s room in a pinch as well as many male tras.

You don’t have to respond, you’re just gonna act like you speak for the actions of all humanity so you can present TW as perpetual victims that nobody will help and we all know that’s bull.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

And it would still be far easier than doing it in the open. Your denial that men’s bathrooms are dangerous for trans women is honestly boggling. I can’t tell if you are being disingenuous or not because it is just such common sense.

And no, I don’t believe for a second a man would help a trans women in trouble. And just because a guy is willing to have sex with a trans women doesn’t mean he actually cares or respects her.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

I didn’t say that men’s rooms weren’t potentially dangerous so don’t claim that I did.

What I said was, that it’s ridiculous to act like nobody would hear an attack and that absolutely no one would intervene ever in the men’s room, but that they would anywhere else.

It’s hilarious that the person who wants to pretend there’s some impenetrable fortress blocking anyone from hearing and helping a TW who’s getting attacked (but only in the men’s room 🙄), that no man on the planet would ever assist a TW, and that women don’t ever go into the men’s room is saying I lack common sense.

What about men who are in relationships with or marry TW? They don’t care or respect their “wives” or “girlfriends”?

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

It’s not impenetrable but I was in a mall bathroom when I was attacked and nobody seemed to notice. Beatings are not as loud as you seem to immagine they are. And there aren’t men in the women’s room so we wouldn’t be attacked by men there. That shouldn’t be controversial.

But no I don’t thigh that a man would ever help a trans woman being attacked.

And frankly I don’t trust a man that would be in a relationship with a trans woman anyway.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

I mean... apparently there are men in the women’s room, we just call them TW.

I never said you’d get attacked in the women’s room, this whole thread started with me pointing out that the women’s room doesn’t prevent anyone, woman or TW, from getting attacked outside of the women’s room in a public space.

And your experience doesn’t dictate all TW experiences and your self loathing doesn’t dictate how any man who dates a TW feels about that TW.

Did you not make any sound when you got attacked? Did you not ask to see surveillance footage?

I’m not asking to argue, I genuinely am just trying to understand what exactly happened to you because you mention it often.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

I mean... apparently there are men in the women’s room, we just call them TW.

Trans women aren’t men.

I never said you’d get attacked in the women’s room, this whole thread started with me pointing out that the women’s room doesn’t prevent anyone, woman or TW, from getting attacked outside of the women’s room in a public space.

You are the one who brought up the idea of the men’s room only as an impregnable fortress.

And your experience doesn’t dictate all TW experiences and your self loathing doesn’t dictate how any man who dates a TW feels about that TW.

I’m going to ask you a serious question. Why would anyone date one of us? If they just want dick they are a self loathing or in denial gay guy. If they are specifically in to trans women they are fetishizing our worst parts, and if they actually think of us and respect us as women, why would they settle for us if there wasn’t something horrifically wrong with them. A man who would date us is a man I would trust even less than most men.

Did you not make any sound when you got attacked? Did you not ask to see surveillance footage?

I curled into a ball and protected my face and hands because that’s how you take a beating. I don’t remember if I yelled or not. When they stopped and left I made sure I was okay to drive and left. No I don’t talk to security. Because safe odds as not I end up in the back of a cop car if security called them. Because that’s what police do to trans people in states like that. You don’t call the cops unless you find a body.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

  1. I disagree that TW aren’t men, but even if they aren’t, they are male. And women’s rooms are for females

  2. I literally didn’t bring up the men’s room being impenetrable lol. I’m the one who said that at any moment someone could walk in and see a TW being attacked, and that eventually the TW would exit the bathroom. That’s the opposite of what you’re saying I said. What I said was that your comments act as if the men’s room is impenetrable

  3. I don’t know why anyone would date a trans person, but I know that some people do, and that some people marry trans people. There are married TW on this sub, it’s pretty shitty of you to imply that their spouses don’t give a damn about them.

  4. So you can’t really say what would have been done had you gone to authorities... you just assumed worse case scenario and made your decisions around that. That’s your right, but my point is you can’t say with absolute certainty what would have been done because you didn’t seek help.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

  1. I know you do and it’s t or root of why we will never see eye to eye on anything. At root you think I am something I am not a want me treated based on your belief.

  2. You literally did

It’s hilarious that the person who wants to pretend there’s some impenetrable fortress blocking anyone from hearing and helping a TW who’s getting attacked (but only in the men’s room 🙄)

  1. She’s welcome to pipe in with something counter but I wouldn’t trust a cis person who would be in a relationship with one of us. We are the bottom of the barrel and anyone who would stoop to us has to have problems.

  2. I do know. At best I get laughed at at worst I end up in cuffs on some trumped up charge because they don’t like people like me. Trans people in red states stay away from Cops if they know what’s good for them.