GC (but anyone can comment): Why are women more supportive of trans rights than men?

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[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (23 children)

There’s so much incel speak, misogyny, racism, rape apologia, and homophobia rampant amongst TRAs and QT.

And there is so much racism, sexism, homophobia and incel speak amongst GC.

  1. Take a look at this thread The idiots at GenCyn finally discover Ovarit. GC brought up that a GenCyn user is an Iranian trans man. One user wrote:

She gets so much attention from gencyn cuz she's the one WoC they actually have in their midst of privileged, white males.

The idea that trans people of color exist is news to GC. I've read GenCyn for many years and participated there sometimes. Not everyone there is a white male. But GC thinks everyone there is a white male. With that being said, being of a certain race doesn't mean you are required to have a certain opinion. You can be black, Hispanic, or whatever and GC, and QT as well. You can be a Mexican Trump supporter for all I care.

  1. I think both GC and QT enforce sexist stereotypes. QT enforces sex stereotypes to some extent in their definition of gender and somewhat of the idea that changing your gender identity means changing your clothes and outer appearance (i.e. dying hair). GC enforces stereotypes based on biological sex. I will talk about GC for now. They always talk about how people born female are so much nicer than people born male. While I do think socialization plays a part in how we act more than we think, not everything is the result of female socialization. On the other thread you said if you confided something to someone you thought was female but it turned out they weren't you wouldn't speak to them. Why? Why upon finding out someone's birth sex you view a person differently. That's sexist.

  2. GC is homophobic. They call trans gay men attracted to other men fujoshis. They were also upset when a trans man won a gay pageant in the UK. Some gays and lesbians are attracted to trans people of their gender, some people aren't. They are still gay and lesbian. People can’t control who they're attracted to and you can refuse a relationship and sex with someone for any reason.

  3. On the old GC sub there was a thread about women identifying as asexual. The thread read like an incel thread.

Eta- of course they won’t hear the gc arguments- they’ve been trained to tune it out because the arguments make sense and tras don’t want people to see that.

I think most likely they're genuine libfems though.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (21 children)

  1. Have not seen any racism, homophobia, or incel speak from GC. Please, elaborate? Please explain how someone pointing out that white people are capitalizing on poc is racist, not the white people who are using a poc as a poster child???

  2. GC’s whole point is that gender is a construct that we want dismantled. Please explain how saying men and women should be able to dress and present however they want is sexist? Examples?

  3. No GC person I know pretends women=nice and men= evil.if anything, the only person here saying men are beasts and evil is qt... Are there man hating feminists? I’m sure. Do men hating feminist equal gc? No. Someone can be gc and also hate men, GC as man haters is not a gc stance. Also- have you just missed all of the gc men? You’re once again, ill informed.

  4. I also explained that I’d feel more comfortable discussing certain things with a female. Because imo a female will understand and relate better to some things. If you don’t know specifically what I would take to a female that I wouldn’t to a male- you don’t get to judge. I would absolutely feel uncomfortable discussing my body and it’s functions with someone who wouldnt relate to and understand what I said. I also said there are some things I wouldn’t tell younger females... am I also being age-ist?

  5. I don’t even know wtf a fujoshi is- I call tm women. Period. Also- yeah it is unfair for a woman to win a contest for men. GC recongnjzing sex is kind of the point of gc. To try to say that recognizing that a man should be won that competition is pointless. Our whole point is that sex trumps gender. So explain how GC is wrong for supporting that idea, and how the very idea is incorrect.

  6. Can you please explain how saying homo=same sex, hetero= opposite sex, and bi= either/both sexes is homophobic, and people pressuring lesbians to sleep with males and straight men to sleep with males is not coercive and or homophobic?

  7. GC is the one saying that people don’t control who they are attracted to. QT is the one telling people that their sexuality is bigoted for not including trans people post or pre op. How is pressuring people to sleep with people their very sexuality rules out the right thing to do?

  8. Oh you found one thread? One? Do you want to see how many abusive, sexist, racist, incel speak ridden, and homophobic threads i can find from tras and qt? You wanna play this game we can, you will lose. Horribly. There’s way to much evidence for how toxic tras are. Let’s compare links if you want. May take me a few days to fully compile what I’ve seen from your side tho. All you can show us is gc believing in basic biology and possibly being snarky about it- snark doesn’t erase truth tho

  9. They can be genuine libfems. They’re just also genuinely brainwashed, guilted, and gaslit. I’m sure their beliefs are genuine- but if they are anything like you I’m also certain that they don’t have their facts straight.

  10. Backtracking because I skipped it- no, no, no- gc does not think that all trans people are white or that trans poc don’t exist. We think the trans poc and the violence committed against them are being exploited by the white trans people. We think the white trans people are capitalizing on what is not even being done to them to gain sympathy. While they remain out of danger (obvi there are some cases, the poc cases are drastically higher.)

  11. Sounds like you don’t know shit about gc and our beliefs other than that transwomen are grossly misogynistic men and transmen are women. It’s odd that you tried to come at me with so much confidence while being so ignorant of what you’re debating. If this is confusing to you I’m more than happy to elaborate. Once again, you’ve made arguments that are based on falsehoods and an obviously lack of understanding.

  12. At the end of the day, you are fighting for mass conversion therapy, serial rape being acceptable practice for a select group of people, erasure of the female sex and the rights of females, sterilizing and stunting the mental and physical development of children, homophobia, gender stereotypes being reinforced, and mass compelled speech along with silencing those who hold different beliefs. And you’re proud of this?

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (20 children)

Have not seen any racism, homophobia, or incel speak from GC. Please, elaborate? Please explain how someone pointing out that white people are capitalizing on poc is racist, not the white people who are using a poc as a poster child???

I literally just pointed out GC racism, yet you’re still denying it. This case is not an example of white people capitalizing on POC. POC are participating in GenCyn threads, as is their right. Laverne Cox, Yance Ford, MJ Rodriguez, Indya Moore are all trans people of color. In this thread How are trans people oppressed?, a user complained her black and Latina friends cancelled her because she is GC. Are people of color who are trans or support the trans movement race traitors? GC has called trans men sex traitors.

GC’s whole point is that gender is a construct that we want dismantled. Please explain how saying men and women should be able to dress and present however they want is sexist?

Saying people should be able to dress and present how they want is not sexist. Saying “women act this way due to female socialization” or “the TIFs are so much nicer than the TIMs”.

No GC person I know pretends women=nice and men= evil.if anything, the only person here saying men are beasts and evil is qt... Are there man hating feminists? I’m sure. Do men hating feminist equal gc? No. Someone can be gc and also hate men, GC as man haters is not a gc stance. Also- have you just missed all of the gc men? You’re once again, ill informed.

GC says this all the time. They said it a few times in the old GC sub. But if QT said this, please link to posts.

I don’t even know wtf a fujoshi is- I call tm women. Period. Also- yeah it is unfair for a woman to win a contest for men. GC recongnjzing sex is kind of the point of gc. To try to say that recognizing that a man should be won that competition is pointless. Our whole point is that sex trumps gender. So explain how GC is wrong for supporting that idea, and how the very idea is incorrect.

Why do you care if a female won a competition made for men? Men are not oppressed.

Can you please explain how saying homo=same sex, hetero= opposite sex, and bi= either/both sexes is homophobic, and people pressuring lesbians to sleep with males and straight men to sleep with males is not coercive and or homophobic?

Some people are attracted to gender presentation and not sex. I know a trans women. Before she transitioned I was attracted to her. However she was asexual, if she wasn’t I would have asked her out. Now that she transitioned, although she doesn’t 100% pass, I am no longer attracted to her because she looks too feminine. However, I am attracted to trans men who are post op. I am attracted to men and trans men, not women and trans women. I’m straight.

GC is the one saying that people don’t control who they are attracted to. QT is the one telling people that their sexuality is bigoted for not including trans people post or pre op. How is pressuring people to sleep with people their very sexuality rules out the right thing to do?

QT, including myself, says people can sleep with whoever they want without pressure. On the old GCdebatesQt sub this was asked, QT unanimously responded you can sleep with whoever you want. Read this thread by GenCyn titled You're not transphobic if you don't want to date transwomen as a cis lesbian, you're only transphobic if you spew this rhetoric..

Oh you found one thread? One? Do you want to see how many abusive, sexist, racist, incel speak ridden, and homophobic threads i can find from tras and qt? You wanna play this game we can, you will lose. Horribly. There’s way to much evidence for how toxic tras are. Let’s compare links if you want. May take me a few days to fully compile what I’ve seen from your side tho. All you can show us is gc believing in basic biology and possibly being snarky about it- snark doesn’t erase truth tho

Then link these threads.

They can be genuine libfems. They’re just also genuinely brainwashed, guilted, and gaslit. I’m sure their beliefs are genuine- but if they are anything like you I’m also certain that they don’t have their facts straight.

I got all the facts straight. I read r/gendercritical, read and still read r/gendercynical and trans subs. I read Ovarit, GC blogs, s/gendercritical, etc. That’s where I base my opinions from.

Backtracking because I skipped it- no, no, no- gc does not think that all trans people are white or that trans poc don’t exist. We think the trans poc and the violence committed against them are being exploited by the white trans people. We think the white trans people are capitalizing on what is not even being done to them to gain sympathy. While they remain out of danger (obvi there are some cases, the poc cases are drastically higher.)

GC also capitalizes on trans men. For instance on Reddit a trans man complained some trans women are silencing trans men. GC in the old sub linked to the thread, said all trans women are like this, and said to the trans men men don’t care about them and to come back to their sisters. Though when trans men complain about GC silencing them GC says they will continue to say/do whatever they want. GC was using a trans man’s post to shit on trans women.

At the end of the day, you are fighting for mass conversion therapy, serial rape being acceptable practice for a select group of people, erasure of the female sex and the rights of females, sterilizing and stunting the mental and physical development of children, homophobia, gender stereotypes being reinforced, and mass compelled speech along with silencing those who hold different beliefs. And you’re proud of this?

In my posts I said a few times people should be raped and forced to be attracted to people they aren’t. Point out specific sentences though. I am of the female sex and trans people did not erase my rights. I’m somewhat against transitioning minors. Finally, Reddit banned all the GC subs. I’m not Reddit. GC created their own site and it’s not being taken down. They have a platform.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

  1. You didn’t point out racism tho... can you link an actual racist comment? There are plenty of poc gc people, myself included. No, poc who support trans people aren’t racist- because being trans is not related to race so I’m not sure why you’re even going there?

  2. You may have read, but you don’t seem to have understood because you’re repeating statements about gc that are incorrect.

  3. There are just as many qt saying the opposite of this. What gc is saying that sleep with who you want, but a male and female can’t equal a lesbian relationship definitively and that a male and male relationship is homosexual. We haven’t placed value on being gay or straight-qt does. Nowhere does gc say that people can’t be with who they want- we are saying that you don’t get to redefine sexuality to fit the box you want it to fit to preserve your own personal sense of self. Words have meanings. Including words meant to define and explain sexualities.

  4. I don’t deny that there are some qt who don’t pressure people to expand their dating pool to include trans people, it is odd that you deny that there are several qt who actively push TW on lesbians or straight men, and claim that you are bigoted if you don’t include them. This is fact, a fact that you continue to ignore. I would gladly link, but there’s so many that I may as well make a post for everyone to link them. That’s how many qt people are forcing the narrative that not including trans people in your dating pool is bigotry. That’s how many qt people advocate raping and murdering me and other gc women because we disagree with them.

  5. If you’re saying that gc reinforces gender stereotypes, is homophobic and racist- then you do not have your facts straight. There are lgb as well as t gc people. There are male and female gc people of all races. They all simply agree with sex trumping gender. You do not have your facts straight or you do and you’re just flat out misrepresenting them. I remember you saying that you struggle with comprehension at times. I honestly think you’re misunderstanding or are so indoctrinated into qt that you aren’t reading from a neutral space or an attempt to accurately comprehend- you’re reading to find ”Problematic” comments that you can point out while ignoring the whole picture. You’re so focused on everything but what gc actually stands for.

  6. Are you going to pretend that transwomen aren’t significantly more vocal and more of the center of attention with regards to gender and all that’s happening? GC isn’t wrong to think that TW are much more prevalent on media.

  7. GC supports tm because they are female. We don’t have to let them dictate how we speak and view sexual and gender to include them in supporting all females and our rights. We can support females as a whole without making allowances for females who happen to be trans.

  8. You keep focusing on comments and reddit threads and shit- GC is focused on what is actually happening in the world. Yes there are people on both sides who generalize and make rude comments - qt and tras are actively infringing on people’s rights, spaces, l‘language, etc. If both sides have rude people, it cancels itself out.

  9. Yes, gc has some platforms- but we can’t even say sex can’t be changed publicly even tho it’s true without facing repercussions. We can’t be openly gc without rape and death threats from your side. I love how you ignored so many things I pointed out, just didn’t even come close to addressing them. So you are fine with supporting racism, homophobia, sexism, appropriation, rape apologists, child abuse and so much more- but that’s okay because gc has a platform to oppose it? So it’s okay that me making a statement “transwomen are not women, they are transwomen and they deserve safety and equality” lead to me getting rape and death threats for months? Because at least I had a platform? You’re okay with a woman losing her job for setting sex can’t be changed, and another woman now being “canceled” and threatened, people burning her books and spreading misinformation about her, because at least she had a platform? It’s okay for a man to sue women for refusing to wax his balls at a female only facility, because those women have a platform to express their outrage? Having a platform hasn’t stopped females from having their rights undermined. What about all of the interviews of girls saying they don’t feel comfortable changing with boys or competing against boys just because those boys think they’re girls? Did that platform help them? Did that platform lead to them feeling safe changing in female spaces or them being allowed to compete without those boys? No. It didn’t. It lead to them being called bigots and misinformed. They didn’t need to be informed- they felt uncomfortable in spaces meant for them and in competitions intended for solely them. You’re a glorified men’s rights activist. And I’m sure you’ll come back with a response saying that you linked evidence that supports your claim- I read it, it doesn’t. If you bother to reply I’m certain it will be a convolute reach that ignored everything I’m pointing out because you, like so many qt/tras, are incapable of actually explaining anything you believe adequately. You can point out specific racist comments (you haven’t, but I’m sure they exist on both sides), you can say that sexuality is based on gender even tho it’s literally called SEXuality, but you can’t dismantle anything I’m saying or that anyone else gc has said.

  10. Every time a TW plays a female sport, that’s a female athlete that doesn’t get to play. Everytime a TW represents females politically- that’s a group of females who don’t get representation. Everytime a TW enters a female space, be it bathrooms, shelters, locker rooms or fucking prisons- that’s taking away the right for women to congregate and or be housed away from men. Everytime a TW is categorized and included with females, they are denying women the right to be grouped/classed without their oppressors. Every time a TW refers to themselves as a real woman for refers to women as “cis” they are saying that 1.womanhood is a mental state that men can opt into and 2. Women are women because they identify with the stereotypes men place on us and that we identify with our oppression. They are denying sex based oppression. You are wrong. And you haven’t even shown anything to indicate that you don’t believe you’re wrong, you just try to point out racist (or what you think is racist- tho you don’t seem to grasp what racism actually is) or mean. You seem to think that gc not including tm as men and TW as women is worth pointing out as an argument- when, duh. It’s not an argument, it’s one of gc’s points. So either point out how it’s actually wrong or admit that you can’t. But citing incidents were gc people stand by their beliefs is not an argument. It’s a given.

[–]ColoredTwiceIntersex female, medical malpractice victim, lesbian 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Everytime a TW represents females politically- that’s a group of females who don’t get representation.

It even worse, as they just can't understand women's needs and their own needs are absolutely different to ours, they do not have our experience, soxialization or fears. Even on simplest levels - we need different toilets with different comfort items for different reasons, drugs and smocking are viewed differently as well because of our reproductive system and possible childbirth, same abkut rape threats or attacks, walking streets witv kids, and so on. Everything is just different solely on biology. They can't represent us, they can't help us or design things for us.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

As far as links, I’m in the middle of homeschooling with my kid but I asked for links from others and will provide them myself when I’m done with my son

Eta- you can check the receipts provided by several people by clicking my profile. There’s a post in gc and lgbdropthet :)

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

You didn’t point out racism tho... can you link an actual racist comment? There are plenty of poc gc people, myself included. No, poc who support trans people aren’t racist- because being trans is not related to race so I’m not sure why you’re even going there?

I did point out racism. GC made a big deal of the fact that a TMOC is posting on GenCyn. Then they said "she's the one WoC they actually have in their midst of privileged, white males." Trans people and their supporters come from all backgrounds. I pointed out this isn't the case. GC has said a few times the trans ideology is a white male ideology.

u may have read, but you don’t seem to have understood because you’re repeating statements about gc that are incorrect.

Maybe. But I read Ovarit and this is how I interpret their content.

There are just as many qt saying the opposite of this. What gc is saying that sleep with who you want, but a male and female can’t equal a lesbian relationship definitively and that a male and male relationship is homosexual. We haven’t placed value on being gay or straight-qt does. Nowhere does gc say that people can’t be with who they want- we are saying that you don’t get to redefine sexuality to fit the box you want it to fit to preserve your own personal sense of self. Words have meanings. Including words meant to define and explain sexualities.

QT is saying many people are attracted to gender presentation, not sex. We define sexual orientation differently.

I don’t deny that there are some qt who don’t pressure people to expand their dating pool to include trans people, it is odd that you deny that there are several qt who actively push TW on lesbians or straight men, and claim that you are bigoted if you don’t include them. This is fact, a fact that you continue to ignore. I would gladly link, but there’s so many that I may as well make a post for everyone to link them. That’s how many qt people are forcing the narrative that not including trans people in your dating pool is bigotry. That’s how many qt people advocate raping and murdering me and other gc women because we disagree with them.

Most QT are against pressuring anyone. Yes, there are a few bad apples, and I will call them out.

If you’re saying that gc reinforces gender stereotypes, is homophobic and racist- then you do not have your facts straight. There are lgb as well as t gc people. There are male and female gc people of all races. They all simply agree with sex trumping gender. You do not have your facts straight or you do and you’re just flat out misrepresenting them. I remember you saying that you are autistic (or something similar, I apologize if that’s not what you said, but something similar was confirmed by you). I honestly think you’re misunderstanding or are so indoctrinated into qt that you aren’t reading from a neutral space or an attempt to accurately comprehend- you’re reading to find ”Problematic” comments that you can point out while ignoring the whole picture. You’re so focused on everything but what gc actually stands for.

I said GC reinforcing gender stereotypes is sexist, not racist or homophobic.

Are you going to pretend that transwomen aren’t significantly more vocal and more of the center of attention with regards to gender and all that’s happening? GC isn’t wrong to think that TW are much more prevalent on media.

And whose dictating and controlling the media? It's not trans women. Many trans people themselves don't like how they're portrayed in the media. What is GC doing to promote the voices of trans men?

GC supports tm because they are female. We don’t have to let them dictate how we speak and view sexual and gender to include them in supporting all females and our rights. We can support females as a whole without making allowances for females who happen to be trans.

In the thread I mentioned GC linked a thread by a trans men who was complain about some trans women silencing him and one person said "TIW: men do not give a fuck about you. Please come back to your sisters who love you." When trans women speak over trans men, they are suddenly evil oppressors exercising their privilege. When GC speaks over trans men, they will just continue to say whay they want. When a trans man complains about GC, it is just as valid as if the trans men were to complain about trans women. GC wants trans women to do something they don't want to do themselves.

You keep focusing on comments and reddit threads and shit- GC is focused on what is actually happening in the world. Yes there are people on both sides who generalize and make rude comments - qt and tras are actively infringing on people’s rights, spaces, l‘language, etc. If both sides have rude people, it cancels itself out.

I don't have a problem sharing spaces with trans women. If you have a problem, we can create a space for GC women.

Yes, gc has some platforms- but we can’t even say sex can’t be changed publicly even tho it’s true without facing repercussions. We can’t be openly gc without rape and death threats from your side.

I don't agree with threats, but has anyone been raped after a threat due to stating GC views? Focus on what's happening, not what's being said.

So you are fine with supporting racism, homophobia, sexism, appropriation, rape apologists, child abuse and so much more- but that’s okay because gc has a platform to oppose it?

I absolutely do not condone racism, homophobia, sexism, cultural appropriation, rape and child abuse.

So it’s okay that me making a statement “transwomen are not women, they are transwomen and they deserve safety and equality” lead to me getting rape and death threats for months? Because at least I had a platform? You’re okay with a woman losing her job for setting sex can’t be changed, and another woman now being “canceled” and threatened, people burning her books and spreading misinformation about her, because at least she had a platform?

The original thread was that women are more likely to support trans rights than men. So whose firing you? Whose canceling you. Not my dad, he agrees with GC views.

Every time a TW plays a female sport, that’s a female athlete that doesn’t get to play. Everytime a TW represents females politically- that’s a group of females who don’t get representation. Everytime a TW enters a female space, be it bathrooms, shelters, locker rooms or fucking prisons- that’s taking away the right for women to congregate and or be housed away from men. Everytime a TW is categorized and included with females, they are denying women the right to be grouped/classed without their oppressors. Every time a TW refers to themselves as a real woman for refers to women as “cis” they are saying that 1.womanhood is a mental state that men can opt into and 2. Women are women because they identify with the stereotypes men place on us and that we identify with our oppression. They are denying sex based oppression. You are wrong. And you haven’t even shown anything to indicate that you don’t believe you’re wrong, you just try to point out racist (or what you think is racist- tho you don’t seem to grasp what racism actually is) or mean.

I view trans women as women. GC doesn't. Our beliefs are polar opposite.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

  1. Can you explain how it’s racist to point out that there’s one POC speaking out and everyone else is white? Because that doesn’t sound racist to me.

  2. That’s not what all or even most qt is saying. I don’t know how to link from my phone but you can see the threads that have been commented on my post. This is a flat out lie or you don’t know.

  3. Sexual orientation doesn’t really leave room for reinterpretation unless you advocate conversion therapy. No matter what- sex, like actual fucking, comes down to genitals, not gender presentation.

  4. There’s waaaay too many “bad apples” for you to pretend they most qt rejects this. Why aren’t they speaking out in at least equal numbers? If this isn’t a common stance, then we should see most of qt speaking out and clarifying. They are not doing this. Again, you can refer to the links.

  5. Can you please explain how GC is the side reinforcing gendered stereotypes? Because we aren’t the ones saying that gender identity (literally a cherry picked collection of stereotypes) is valid.

  6. Social media- not tv, I understand that that wasn’t clear. I’m talking about YouTube, Twitter, Instagram, etc

  7. So you’re saying gc is wrong for saying that TW don’t care about TM? It sounds like there’s a (one- single) thread where that’s being said, and Im pretty sure GC considers TW oppressors always, not just when they speak over tm. Also- we don’t really need to support tm as trans- we support them as females.

  8. We gonna make sure gc women have female political representatives? Female only sports? Female only whatever we want? How are you gonna keep the TW out? This is an unrealistic option. We had female only spaces- transwomen invaded them. It’s kind of one of the reasons we’re upset...

  9. So rape and death threats are acceptable as long as we don’t have proof that they’re all acted on? Some have been. Also, it’s super shitty to dismiss violent threats that are so prevalent. It’s really alarming. People are also losing jobs and being socially ostracized over it. But I guess that’s fine too. The thing you don’t get is, a lot of these threats aren’t coming from allies, they are coming from the TW themselves. These are the people threatening to rape and murder us, actual females are just calling us evil and maybe threatening to punch us. The very people you’re so comfortable advocating for, the people you see as women and think should be included in every way are the same people threatening to rape us and breed us and Murder us. These are the same people that are supposed to be safe. That we have no reason to fear. If they can so easily threaten to rape, torture, and kill us, as well as see that doing so is applauded rather than reprimanded- how exactly are we supposed to feel safe around them? And how many women do you know that casually threaten to rape or kill people for disagreeing with them?

  10. If you support tras and qt, you absolutely do.

  11. This doesn’t really address what I said. Yes women support trans rights- thing is, none of those rights in what you linked except for the bathroom stuff we’re rights that gc people oppose. We understand they are stigmatized and agree that they shouldn’t be discriminated against. Also, over 50% of the people (both sexes) polled agreed that there are two genders and that gender/sex is binary. So the majority in what you linked supports gc stances...

  12. You view them as women but of course have offered no reason why. And according to what you linked, half of the women polled don’t view them as women either. So you’re totally fine with disenfranchising all females because about half of them are also fine with it. At least with gc all females would still have their rights.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Can you please explain how GC is the side reinforcing gendered stereotypes? Because we aren’t the ones saying that gender identity (literally a cherry picked collection of stereotypes) is valid.

Gender critical movement and gender critical feminism want to abolish gender. Gender critical feminists were helping ContraPoints when ContraPoints was just a man in dress who was fighting against gender stereotypes, and when ContraPoints became transwomen and said that they are embracing opposite gender stereotype now and is a woman - gender critical feminists started to be against them.

Gender critical feminism is fighting so women can wear manly cloths, do "manly" work and have "manly" interests and it will be fine, so men can wear dresses and makeup, do "feminine" things, and still be men and it will be fine. And that there will not be "manly" and "womanly" things altogether. Gender critical feminism is critical of gender.

Genderqueer and transgender theories are saying that if man likes dolls - then he is a woman, if woman is doing "manly" things than she is a man. If man or woman are doing both manly and womanly things at same time, then they are either non-binary or of one of 100 genders. This mean that if you do not fit gender stereotype of a man - then you are different gender stereotype, and that you need to act accordingly to that gender stereotype (transition and start acting of the opposite sex and wearing cloths and makeup as an opposite sex, for example).

How "we are supporting gender-non-conforming people and want to remove gender stereotypes" - is "reinforcing gendered stereotypes"? What level of mental gymnastic is even needed to get to this conclusion?

And how "you must act like gender you have chosen" is not reinforcing gender stereotypes? How banning drag queens and transvestites because "it makes transwomen look bad" in some USA universities is "accepting gender-non-conforming people", when it is the opposite?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I really hope OP addresses this comment. It’s spot on.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh yes, I should've answered to GB and not to you, my mistake.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Can you explain how it’s racist to point out that there’s one POC speaking out and everyone else is white? Because that doesn’t sound racist to me.

Because there's not just one POC speaking out. Here are a few other users who claim to be POC.

https://www.reddit.com/r/GenderCynical/comments/hhb6to/take_it_up_with_calvin_klein_and_not_your_echo/fw9qw1s/

https://www.reddit.com/r/GenderCynical/comments/8xp39q/reddits_bringing_out_the_i_dont_get_it_so_it/e24jqs7/

https://www.reddit.com/r/GenderCynical/comments/gvxbf7/because_advocating_for_2_issues_at_the_same_time/fsts9bn/

That’s not what all or even most qt is saying. I don’t know how to link from my phone but you can see the threads that have been commented on my post. This is a flat out lie or you don’t know.

OK, I'll call out that behavior when I see it.

Sexual orientation doesn’t really leave room for reinterpretation unless you advocate conversion therapy. No matter what- sex, like actual fucking, comes down to genitals, not gender presentation.

People do get surgeries to have genitals of the opposite gender. I'm a cis woman. I'm attracted to cis men and trans men who are well passing and post op. I'm not attracted to cis women and passing trans women. I am straight.

Can you please explain how GC is the side reinforcing gendered stereotypes? Because we aren’t the ones saying that gender identity (literally a cherry picked collection of stereotypes) is valid.

Gender identity is really your brain gender. I am a cis woman who is content with my gender identity and sex characteristics. If I was born male I would feel uncomfortable having a penis and all these body hairs and I would transition. But I did not because I was born female.

We gonna make sure gc women have female political representatives? Female only sports? Female only whatever we want? How are you gonna keep the TW out? This is an unrealistic option. We had female only spaces- transwomen invaded them. It’s kind of one of the reasons we’re upset...

QT considers trans women women, so.

So rape and death threats are acceptable as long as we don’t have proof that they’re all acted on?

Rape and death threats aren't acceptable but in your last comment you wrote to focus on what's actually happening in the world and not GC threads.

People are also losing jobs

Speak to your state legislature about creating laws protecting employees.

and being socially ostracized over it.

I can't control who others choose to be friends with.

If you support tras and qt, you absolutely do.

LOL so me supporting QT and TRAs means I support racism, sexism, homophobia, etc? I call out other white people on their racism, even when POC aren't around. I read threads like this one and this one to learn about racism, I attended BLM protests and listen to POC on how to be a better ally, especially trans, disabled, POC. Yet I support racism because I support QT and TRAs. Are you going to say the same thing about POC who post on GenCyn or otherwise support QT?

Gay marriage was legalized when I was finishing 9th grade and I happily announced it to the class. Are you going to say I support homophobia now? Wow.

This doesn’t really address what I said. Yes women support trans rights- thing is, none of those rights in what you linked except for the bathroom stuff we’re rights that gc people oppose. We understand they are stigmatized and agree that they shouldn’t be discriminated against. Also, over 50% of the people (both sexes) polled agreed that there are two genders and that gender/sex is binary. So the majority in what you linked supports gc stances...

My original thread was mainly about bathrooms. GC doesn't want trans women in women's bathrooms. I asked then why are women (including myself) more likely to be fine with trans women in women's bathrooms than men?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

  1. That’s not racist, honey. Lol

  2. You’ll call out the behavior while still supporting the side that engages in the behavior... might as well not call shit out then

  3. Nobody can surgically recreate the genitals of the opposite sex. They get surgery that reconstructs their own genitalia to hopefully closely resemble the opposite sex’s genitals. They don’t function or even fully look the same.

  4. And how does your brain know you have the correct genitalia? And what does genitalia have to do with gender, if a person with a penis can be a woman, and a person with a vagina can be a man?

  5. So... you said we could have gc bathrooms, I’m asking how you plan to enforce that and keep males out, and if gc women are allowed representation politically, our own sports etc. I know qt thinks males can be women. That’s not an answer to my question.

  6. Rape threats are actually happening. Bomb threats are actually happening. Death threats are actually happening. And you’re basically saying not to take them seriously. The sheer number of them warrants them being taken seriously.

  7. Speak to people who are afraid of being canceled themselves about canceling us?

  8. Yes, I would say that a poc who supports trans ideology is also supporting all of the things that you support. Calling it out when you recognize it, particularly when you don’t seem to understand racism as seen by what you think racism is, but still supporting them is still supporting all of those things. You’re on their side and supporting them despite what they say that’s racist and homophobic

  9. Yes, if you support the pressuring of lesbians to sleep with males and gay men to sleep with females then you’re absolutely homophobic. You can lol all you want to, if you support tras, you support a homophobic group.

  10. Your original thread is about women being more likely to support trans rights than men. It’s there for us all to refer to so why pretend you focused on bathrooms? Women can agree to share bathrooms with men without supporting trans ideology. The link you provided shows that.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

You’ll call out the behavior while still supporting the side that engages in the behavior... might as well not call shit out then

That's like saying because I support BLM protests I condone violence because some BLM protests are violent.

Nobody can surgically recreate the genitals of the opposite sex. They get surgery that reconstructs their own genitalia to hopefully closely resemble the opposite sex’s genitals. They don’t function or even fully look the same.

I personally don't mind trans penises. Whatever floats your boat.

And how does your brain know you have the correct genitalia? And what does genitalia have to do with gender, if a person with a penis can be a woman, and a person with a vagina can be a man?

How do people have dysphoria? The extent of dysphoria varies from person to person.

So... you said we could have gc bathrooms, I’m asking how you plan to enforce that and keep males out, and if gc women are allowed representation politically, our own sports etc. I know qt thinks males can be women. That’s not an answer to my question.

We'll use the phrase AFAB GC feminists.

Rape threats are actually happening. Bomb threats are actually happening. Death threats are actually happening. And you’re basically saying not to take them seriously. The sheer number of them warrants them being taken seriously.

Threats are not OK.

Speak to people who are afraid of being canceled themselves about canceling us?

GC says most people secretly agree with them but fear being cancelled. If that's the case why are most people cancelling GC?

Yes, I would say that a poc who supports trans ideology is also supporting all of the things that you support. Calling it out when you recognize it, particularly when you don’t seem to understand racism as seen by what you think racism is, but still supporting them is still supporting all of those things. You’re on their side and supporting them despite what they say that’s racist and homophobic

OK I will make an effort to center trans POC in my activism. In the BLM protests I have been to they always chanted "black trans matter" as well as "black men/women/girls/boys/children matter".

Yes, if you support the pressuring of lesbians to sleep with males and gay men to sleep with females then you’re absolutely homophobic. You can lol all you want to, if you support tras, you support a homophobic group.

I have said multiple times in this thread no one should be pressured to sleep with anyone and will call out that behavior when I see it. Yet you keep saying that I support this behavior.

Your original thread is about women being more likely to support trans rights than men. It’s there for us all to refer to so why pretend you focused on bathrooms? Women can agree to share bathrooms with men without supporting trans ideology. The link you provided shows that.

It was mainly about bathrooms but yes it's about trans rights.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

  1. There’s a difference between looting and sending threats and forcing people to accept your ideology. I truly hope you understand that.

  2. Good thing sexuality is defined by something other than your proclivities.

  3. And when bathrooms say “female” that keeps males out? Lol. Also, are you going to make sure gc has sports and political representation or just bathrooms?

  4. Threats are not okay but I’m fine with my camp sending them wantonly...

  5. The tide against gc is thankfully turning.

  6. I get that you personally don’t feel it’s okay, my point is that you still support a community where half (at least) believe this and force this. You’re supporting them regardless.

  7. It wasn’t mainly about bathrooms tho. I literally read it. It covers many things, bathrooms just happened to be one of them.

[–]FlanJam 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Read this thread by GenCyn titled You're not transphobic if you don't want to date transwomen as a cis lesbian, you're only transphobic if you spew this rhetoric..

There are comments in that thread disagreeing with it, for example: "I do not agree with this claim. If you, as a cis lesbian, decide that literally every trans woman is off the plate, then yeah, you're being transphobic." So clearly, not everyone in QT believes you can sleep with whoever you want without pressure. Its not just a GC strawman, these people are real and they're a problem.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Re your link- so... please explain how people expressing concern for this person is wrong? They’re literally discussing fear for her safety. Where there some mean comments? Sure. But again- have you completely missed the way tras and qt talk about gc? Are you telling me that a gc person calling Someone stupid is equal to the rape, death, and conversion therapy comments and memes hurled at gc women? Is calling someone stupid worse than saying you want to trap all gc women, rape and impregnant them constantly so that they can give you the babies you can’t have because you’re a whole fucking male? Is it worse than saying that you want to tie gc women up and make them take your “girl dick” until they like it? Because that’s what the people you’re defending say. If you don’t believe me, we can make a post asking both gc and qt to share posts, comments, articles and memes that display the violence and harassment that our two sides hurl at each other. But again- it would make qt and tras look like rape culture enthusiasts who hate women. Maybe, in your opinion, it will make gc look like man haters(I disagree), but it won’t show any of us threatening mass rape and abuse. That’s all your team.