With all the reddit users coming over lately, I wanted to share something. This is what happened to Voat. by Alduin in propaganda

[–]magnora7[A] 59 insightful - 5 fun59 insightful - 4 fun60 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

Yup, I was there when voat was called whoaverse, I watched it all happen and you're absolutely right!

This is why user participation is important. This is why the pyramid of debate is important. This is why everyone who truly cares about saidit needs to voice their opinions and vote when they see something insightful or fun.

We have lots of defenses against what happened to voat, but primary among them is community.

The second thing we have going for us is no downvote. So the dedicated minority group cannot re-shape the site at large to their own desires nearly as easily. It got much worse as well after voat added restrictions where if you've been downvoted you cannot downvote others. It sped up the echo-chamber feedback-loop effect and let these extremists take over the mainstream culture of voat much more quickly. Now a dissenting voice of reason stands out like a sore thumb, and is downvoted to hell.

Saidit doesn't have these locking-out features because we don't have downvotes, and we're careful to avoid "improvements" to the algorithm that actually just speed up the feedback loop that creates an echo-chamber culture. Furthermore one group cannot brigade another, because there is no downvote, and also they must abide by the pyramid of debate or be banned from saidit. So the only remaining way to "brigade" is to argue one's point rationally.

Thirdly, and perhaps most importantly, the admins actually care. This site used to be called antiextremes.com, specifically referencing avoiding the extremes of reddit (censorship) and voat (far-right). It's literally our declared mission to avoid becoming voat, even right in our original name.

The reason reddit went bad is because the admins turned a blind eye (or perhaps were paid to) while brigading and astroturfing groups took it over, subreddit by subreddit.

Voat however failed because the admins just let whoever take it over, as you pointed out. They had no ideological backbone, no pyramid of debate, no nothing. Just an empty space for anyone who has enough free time to go absolutely nuts and create their own echo chamber. And that's exactly what happened.

But at saidit, we will actually will learn from their failures and try our best to avoid them.

Fourthly, saidit has open modlogs available in any sub under the list of mods, it says "moderation log". Anyone can click it and see everything every mod has ever done. Voat and reddit hide this information for mods only. This transparency adds a LOT of accountability. No more secret user deletions and secret mod coups.

Fifthly, we're run by donations. Not advertiser revenue or big secret investors. This means we have zero incentive to get rid of certain messages to please our advertisers and investors, because we have none other than community donations. We do not plan to ever change this funding model because saidit is run for the community, not for profit.

So you can see our approach is multifaceted, and we think we have a very good chance at avoiding the fate that befell voat. It won't be easy, but I believe we can do it.

Voat literally praises the mass murder, repeatedly calling him a hero. 90% of voat upvotes in agreement. by magnora7 in MeanwhileOnVoat

[–]magnora7[S] 41 insightful - 5 fun41 insightful - 4 fun42 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

Then sane comments that call out the nonsense are downvoted:

https://voat.co/v/whatever/3099068/17411620

https://voat.co/v/whatever/3099068/17411920

Voat is overrun with shills, and white supremacists who can't tell they're surrounded by shills. Voat has a lot of free speech, but very little moral backbone despite all the grandstanding they do. I guess that's what happens when you let white supremecist neo-nazis literally take over your site and run it for their own benefit. They'll cheer on murder as long as the people killed have the skin color and religion they don't like.

Disgusting.

This is why voat can't be the next reddit. This is why we had to build saidit, to give people a 3rd option, because one didn't really exist. Free information for those who aren't completely lost to extremist ideology. Which is why this site used to be called antiextremes.com back in the day

Saidit is worse than reddit with censorship. by Troll in SaidIt

[–]magnora7 37 insightful - 13 fun37 insightful - 12 fun38 insightful - 13 fun -  (0 children)

The irony of someone who supports physical_removal, crying about having their sub removed. It's your own ideology come to life! You should therefore support my actions. But that irony aside...

There has been plenty of discussion about why, ad nauseum.

"didn't feel like talking to a guy like you."

Pretty certain I never said anything like that.

Physical removal is removed for advocating violence ("Let's throw gays and communists out of helicopters, so to speak." being a central meme), and coontown is also removed for advocating violence. ("Black people are just the worst and shouldn't exist, and we should probably hang them" being a central meme)

You seem more upset you can't set up little mod fiefdoms than you actually are upset about your information being limited.

The issue has been explained to you. The community doesn't really support you. What are you even trying to accomplish here? If you want to hate black people and gays so bad that you need to make a whole sub about it, just go to voat. Seriously.

We have banned 5 subs in 16 months, so this idea it's "worse than reddit" in terms of censorship is just laughable.

Reddit Falls Out of Top 20 Sites Worldwide by useless_aether in news

[–]magnora7 34 insightful - 2 fun34 insightful - 1 fun35 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

It's been falling since after the 2016 election. Which to me just shows how many political agendas were being pushed through it.

4chan, 8chan and Voat banned in Australia by Greedeater in censorship

[–]magnora7 31 insightful - 4 fun31 insightful - 3 fun32 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

Wait, for real? Holy crap. AUS and NZ are really going for it, aren't they?

Yikes.

I much preferred Norway's reaction to their mass shooting: They changed nothing, and said if they did change how they operate, that means the shooter wins.

Where is saidit hosted / based? by [deleted] in SaidIt

[–]magnora7 28 insightful - 1 fun28 insightful - 0 fun29 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Dallas TX, under a medium-sized independent server company that has no affiliation with any big server companies. If we ever have any trouble from them, we're technologically prepared to move to a new server at the drop of a hat.

PSA: Our site culture is dropping. by wizzwizz4 in SaidIt

[–]magnora7 24 insightful - 3 fun24 insightful - 2 fun25 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks wizzwizz.

I appreciate you all who are being real and honest and well-spoken, and responding to the real core of what your debate "opponent" is saying when you get in a disagreement.

I've already seen some great debates happening on saidit where all the different sides of an argument were being stated very clearly and articulately, and it's amazing how much I can quickly learn! This is what saidit is for.

Sometimes we'll get steamed when we disagree with someone, but only engaging with the highest-quality arguments makes the culture of mud-slinging just naturally die out from people simply ignoring it because we know it's not worth our time.

It's a subtle thing to truly grasp, but I see lots and lots of people on saidit who "get it" and I'm proud of the community we've all built so far.

Props to Josh at kiwifarms for giving 0 fucks. by useless_aether in censorship

[–]magnora7 23 insightful - 9 fun23 insightful - 8 fun24 insightful - 9 fun -  (0 children)

If everyone acted this way, the intelligence agencies would collapse overnight.

VOAT goats urged not to use Saidit: The leftist censorship shithole by VantaFount in MeanwhileOnVoat

[–]magnora7 22 insightful - 5 fun22 insightful - 4 fun23 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

Extremism hates non-extremism, no surprise there. Just for the record, saidit has banned literally 5 people total in 16 months out of 8,000 users, other than obvious ad spammers who never respond. So this idea it's "even worse than reddit" in terms of censorship is just silly.

Meanwhile they have "ProtectVoat" brigades that will censor you to -20 if you say anything out of line with their site culture, ensuring you never get to use your downvotes yourself, because it requires a user score of 100 to be able to use.

The post on voat is basically propaganda, to beg people to keep them from leaving the extremist echo-chamber they've created, imo. Not surprising at all. Let's just ignore them, and keep making this place better and better. The best way to progress forward is to build something so good that it makes the old ways obsolete.