Rule 4?

brickfrog · 2020-11-14T18:05:17+00:00

So even making a true statement but using stupid reasoning would be grounds for banning, while making a false statement intelligently defended would be fine.

It's only a false statement because you say it is and you would be moderating to remove that opposing viewpoint. So 4b would still apply.

Note that Saidit itself leans anti-moderator, and it also leans heavily into conspiracy theory. So while I get what you're saying that there's a real true/false, you're basically wanting to ban people that tell you their theory is correct and yours is wrong (yes I know, it shouldn't even be a theory but this is Saidit after all). And technically you can remove those posts/comments but you'd need to follow the rule 4 conditions.

Flipping your example around, it's like a flat earther having a sub and you keep posting trying to explain the earth is in fact round. Those mods could leave your posts up & it might dilute discussion of a flat earth if the sub is just filled with opposing viewpoints. Or those mods could remove all those posts & adhere to the rule 4 conditions.

brickfrog · 2020-11-13T15:44:48+00:00

I think your example is the same as the earlier one, right? It's still an opposing opinion (your sub claims earth is round, others are claiming othewise). Hence 4b applies.

Also may want to see the earlier post, there was much discussion on rule 4 there

https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/w6s/saidit_rules_for_moderators/

brickfrog · 2020-11-13T15:42:00+00:00

Would it be a violation of rule 4 to ban such people

Yes. Per rule 4b

Mods CAN remove opposing opinions that are high on the pyramid of debate, and ban those users on that sub, if and only if the 2 following conditions are met: 1: The fact the sub removes opposing opinions is announced in the sub's sidebar. 2: The mods uncheck the sub setting "allow this sub to appear on /all"

So if you don't meet those two conditions then you would be in violation of the rule if you remove/ban those people.

brickfrog · 2020-09-27T20:17:14+00:00

No. It is unlikely there will ever be a .onion address, in the past Saidit admins have mentioned that they have a low opinion of Tor in general (e.g. they think it is compromised, not worthwhile, etc) so I don't see them ever going through the trouble of maintaining a .onion address.

e.g. https://saidit.net/s/technology/comments/4khk/trump_signs_executive_order_stripping_social/gzbo

brickfrog · 2020-08-17T17:38:55+00:00

I'm pretty sure if M7 is a US citizen, he would have to obey copyright takedown orders regardless of where the server is hosted

That's a bit irrelevant, if the hosting provider is not bound by U.S. law or DMCA then there is no reason they'd need to supply details about the ownership of a host account to a U.S. based organization claiming DMCA. (assuming the host provider themselves bother to protect any of their own account information/logs/etc.)

In any case it seems this was mostly answered in the other post, Saidit does honor DMCA complaints/removals which means the host provider is likely in a country bound by DMCA (obviously not Switzerland)

https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/65k1/we_are_being_forced_by_our_server_company_to/nyfo

brickfrog · 2019-08-18T00:00:51+00:00

Agreed, the Saidit mod rules as currently written by /u/magnora7 seem to indicate that repeatedly posting the same topics is allowed and sub mods would be forbidden from removing them.

e.g.

Multiple people, or the same person, posting links to 10-20 different news articles about the same topic
Multiple people, or the same person, posting the same questions multiple times per day/week/month/whatever

That is the type of thing that would often be moderated/removed by sub mods in other sites (e.g. with a "keep it fresh / search before you post" type of rule) but in the Saidit scenario those are considered "in good faith AND on topic" thus cannot be removed.

Seems easier just to remove sub moderators from the site if Saidit doesn't really want moderation anyway.

brickfrog · 2019-06-15T03:40:47+00:00

It's still possible that it's just a troll, but realistically the distinction between legit vs fake DMCA does not matter if the server company itself deems it actionable. So you are correct, you do need to respond in some form otherwise the server company makes the decision for you.

I don't know if shutting down the entire sub is the correct response but it certainly fixes the issue in the short term.

brickfrog · 2019-06-15T03:36:09+00:00

Bound to happen eventually, not surprising really. I am curious how this sort of situation will play out after the server move. Being less vulnerable to DMCA would be a major plus IMO.

https://saidit.net/s/AskSaidIt/comments/klf/should_saidit_be_hosted_in_norway_or_switzerland/

And like others mention, you can't really have a piracy related sub around here if the entire site is going to have issues every time a DMCA is issued.

brickfrog · 2019-06-01T02:01:36+00:00

Yeah that's more of a Voat thing. Honestly if this site fills up with racist/homophobic content then this Saidit experiment is pretty much over. Really, people can go to Voat for that kind of garbage.

brickfrog · 2019-05-19T18:59:44+00:00

Curious if you've had any progress on this?

One thing I'm wondering about Saidit's hosting is whether it can be outside DMCA jurisdiction. (bonus if it is also outside EU countries jurisdiction that actively enforce NTD).

With that in mind you could actually use the Special 301 Report as a short list for countries that do not actively cooperate with DMCA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_301_Report

https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/files/Press/Reports/2018%20Special%20301.pdf

Based on the above Switzerland would get my vote.

Once side effect of having a host outside DMCA jurisdiction is that you can pretty much ignore overzealous DMCA takedown notices - This would result in less work for Saidit admins as well as allow certain subs like /s/Piracy to exist without the need for admins to moderate the random takedowns that Saidit will receive otherwise.

PS - As a counter point I noticed that Raddle is hosted in the Netherlands so they too are outside DMCA jurisdiction. They technically could be subject to the EU copyright directive, however the admin's position is that since they are non-profit (don't even have ads) then the directive does not apply to Raddle.

PS II - I'm not a lawyer, don't assume any of this is 100% correct, etc. etc. :)

brickfrog · 2019-05-07T00:38:26+00:00

That and general TOS / nothing law breaking. Saidit does not operate in some kind of bubble that allows them to ignore local jurisdiction. Unless something changed Saidit itself is still hosted in the U.S. so would have to follow U.S. law

https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/gd3/where_is_saidit_hosted_based/

brickfrog · 2019-05-05T21:47:44+00:00

AFAIK Saidit does not have a core mission of never banning subs. A sub whose primary purpose happens to violate TOS or pyramid of debate may end up getting the axe here.

That said I don't know the specifics of whichever sub you are referring to.

Also worth noting sometimes subs get banned then re-instated, e.g.

https://saidit.net/s/cryptocurrency/comments/qz/why_is_rbitcoin_banned/

brickfrog · 2019-05-04T18:41:59+00:00

100% agree, when you see someone sitting in moderation for 50+ subs you already know that person is not actively moderating all those subs. Worse still, if they are not actively moderating then they tend to ignore modmail from those 50+ subs and nothing gets done to fix the sub or improve moderation down the road. Better that there be some sort of limit.

Another important note is having some account with 50-100+ moderation subs leaves those subs vulnerable to hijacking in the case that one account gets hacked. Suddenly all those subs are compromised. Hopefully Saidit admins would be responsive in those circumstances but it would be good to prevent that sort of situation from occurring in the first place.

brickfrog · 2019-04-22T23:33:38+00:00

Dunno, maybe just a temporary glitch? Wouldn't think on it too much. Plus the msg is really about Bitsnoop shutting down.

Zooqle has been around for a few years now, I don't get the feeling they're going anywhere anytime soon. They're not really the first place I check for things but they are certainly unique, they are the only public torrent indexer that attempts to examine & document video/audio streams in torrents indexed there.

Nothing on the internet is permanent of course, they may indeed go away one day but hopefully not anytime soon.

brickfrog · 2019-04-22T16:52:09+00:00

But why is it coming up now?

Coming up where? That message does not seem to be on Zooqle. I was thinking the only place this news is coming up in 2019 is here in your post :P

like writing this Tigole article

Meh, that's just a random uploader not affiliated with either Bitsnoop or Zooqle.

brickfrog · 2019-04-22T03:21:11+00:00

That's the Bitsnoop shutdown message from 2017, it's been long gone.

Also see https://torrentfreak.com/torrent-site-bitsnoop-shuts-down-170331/

brickfrog · 2019-04-06T03:08:33+00:00

Good luck! That's a tough one to moderate. Over on Reddit the amount of VPN shills and spammers is pretty extreme. Maybe it won't be as bad on Saidit since it's a smaller site (for now, anyway).

brickfrog · 2019-03-27T03:20:06+00:00

Comments and posts like that should be reported, ideally.

How exactly? Current reporting for posts/comments don't list anything like "pyramid of debate" as a report reason.

Also not sure if you're talking about reports going to Saidit admins, or reports going to the sub mods (who may or may not care about the pyramid of debate).

brickfrog · 2019-03-24T20:26:14+00:00

Agreed - there's also a earlier post suggesting the same thing

https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/h32/it_seems_like_we_get_automatically_subscribed_to/

Right now there is very little distinction between /s/subscribed and /s/all. Like you said /s/subscribed really turns into [/s/all minus unsubscribed subs] and that's very confusing.

brickfrog · 2019-03-24T17:15:15+00:00

Yes noticed the same thing. Kind of wonder if those are from accounts coming from Reddit or from Voat.. though I guess they'd be Reddit rejects either way.

brickfrog · 2019-03-20T04:12:02+00:00

https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/gd3/where_is_saidit_hosted_based/

Hosted in the U.S. with U.S. admins. Sadly I don't think SaidIt is going to last long-term for the /r/Piracy refugees, this site is going to be slammed with the same DMCA abuse that hits Reddit. Enough of those and I'm not too sure that SaidIt will want to keep /s/Piracy open, it's not like SaidIt has an entire legal team to deal with those things.

I do hope I'm wrong - Guess we'll see how things evolve.

brickfrog · 2019-03-19T12:46:35+00:00

Just asked a similar question in a different thread, for what it's worth /u/magnora7 has stated that saidit is vulnerable to DMCA notices. Also seems both hosting and admins are in the U.S.

https://saidit.net/s/piracy/comments/g6w/sharing_links/rv8

https://saidit.net/s/piracy/comments/g6w/sharing_links/rvn

Based on the current info it seems like saidit will have the same issues Reddit has with DMCA, copyright trolls, etc.

brickfrog · 2019-03-19T04:48:01+00:00

Just curious, does saidit have an official policy on handling and/or disputing DMCA complaints, in particular invalid DMCA complaints?

Reason I ask is that many social networking/discussion type sites receive tons of DMCA notices and not all of them are valid. Many are generated in the hopes that the result is a takedown even if the DMCA notice itself wouldn't hold up if challenged.

For example the recent DMCA issues over at Reddit actually involve many notices that aren't really valid but Reddit opted not to dispute them

https://www.reddit.com/r/Piracy/comments/b28d9q/rpiracy_has_received_a_notice_of_multiple/eitku9s

Simply asking if a site is down, simply linking a website, simply mentioning the name of a file alleged to be pirated content, etc. those things aren't actually in violation of DMCA. Would a site like saidit be in a position to dispute notices that aren't actually valid or would it end up going ahead with removing content similar to what Reddit is doing?

Admittingly it's a tricky task, sites like Youtube deal with these things on a massive scale e.g.

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-42580523

https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/11/18220032/youtube-copystrike-blackmail-three-strikes-copyright-violation

Just curious how saidit plans to handle those things when they come up, or if there is a plan.

EDIT: Just to be clear it's probably a stretch to allow direct links to alleged pirated content if saidit is vulnerable to DMCA. I'm thinking about more general stuff outside direct linking.

brickfrog