The problems with both sides of the abortion debate

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[–]package 9 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

The most important part of this would be to shift ALL pro-life energy towards preventing unplanned pregnancies instead of preventing abortions.

We already tried this for decades, and the issue is attitude not education. A certain demographic didn't seem to give a shit, and a certain ideology pushed absolute sex positivity and the idea that telling people to practice some degree of self-control/personal-responsibility was some sort of misogynistic slut shaming dog whistle.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

You're absolutely right. And that's why I feel really tied up trying to think through all of this, because no matter what, some people will be irresponsible and careless. Even the law can't control that. You can't make people respect themselves or others, which is why things like murder, rape, theft, drug addiction, etc will always be around.

I can only hope to change one person's mind at a time. The problem is systemic. We never should have lived in these huge nation states with large central governments in the first place. The loss of community and strong families is what got us here to begin with.

I'm kind of just rambling at this point. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I know there is no simple solution or fix. But if the focus was on the prevention of unplanned pregnancies instead of abortion, maybe that would be more amenable to both sides.

[–]raven9 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The loss of community and strong families is what got us here to begin with.

Yes and it happened quite suddenly. When I went to school in the late 1970s and 1980s everyone came from families with two married parents. I remember only one girl at school who came from what they called back then, 'a broken home'. Her mother later remarried so she had a baby brother with a different last name. At the time that was just weird. But then by the mid 1990s the elementary schools were full of kids from single parent families.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Give reproductive power to the state (of course, you would first need a legitimate state). Sterilize low-IQ parents after 1 or 2 children. Mandate abortions in the case of major defects.

Edit: also ban condoms. They only ensure that the people who are too stupid to use condoms are the ones that reproduce.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I personally would rather have been aborted, at least if it weren't painful. But there is no guarantee that someone will share my feelings, no matter how impaired: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Vujicic

[–]jet199Instigatrix 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

It's not just attitude.

There is a human instict to reproduce and it's very strong.

Your brain knows when you're trying to get round it and so will put you in a mindset and/or situation to undermine your plans.

Just look at how many men have an aversion to condoms. That's not rational, that's the part of their brain which wants to get people pregnant making them feel certain way so it happens against their rational judgement. Saidit favorite Assange was even removing condoms mid sex in a country where that is legally rape. That's not coming from his rational mind.

Of course people who are generally more out of control and impulsive will be more effected but it can happen to anyone.

Our insticts have more control over us than we like to think and our brain is conning us into doing things we know aren't good for us everyday. No one is 100% above that all the time.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My instincts failed terribly