My parents forced me to get the covid vaccine

submitted by Solus from self.whatever

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[–]TheJamesRocket 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

For instance?

In 1976, the U.S. government vaccinated an estimated 45 million people against pandemic swine flu. The 1976 pandemic swine flu mass vaccination campaign was canceled after 53 people died. Pandemrix (for the the 2009 flu pandemic) was pulled because it caused ~1500 cases of narcolepsy. Rotoshield was pulled after it caused an modest increase in the risk of intususseption in infants. The Dengvaxia rollout in the Philippines ended in controversy because it contributed to the deaths of a few hundred kids.

So a catastrophe would be if one person in 8 billion has some temporary neurological side effect?

You have a special talent for grossly distorting what other people say, to the point it no longer even resembles the original comment. I was (and still am) talking about the situation in the United States today, where hundreds of millions of people have been vaccinated, and tens of thousands of people have died as a result. If you extrapolate those numbers to the world stage, then the death toll is going to be much larger. This is not some hypothetical, it is what is actually happening right now, because the vaccines are not safe. You look like a complete buffoon, by talking about a hypothetical vaccine with a death rate of 1 in 8 billion, as opposed to the real vaccines which have a death rate of 1 in 3500.

It would need to be less than 99.99975% fatal if you want to vaccinate 8 billion people and still kill 20 thousand.

Oh my god, how can you be this stupid? I was specifically talking about the United States, not the entire world! Did you completely miss the part where I said that 48% of the U.S. population has been vaccinated (roughly 156 million people), and that there have been at least 45,000 deaths from the vaccines? How can you be so clueless as to think that I was talking about the entire world? Your numbers are based on a complete fiction of your own making, especially since the entire world hasn't even been vaccinated yet! You are a MORON.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You have a special talent for grossly distorting what other people say, to the point it no longer even resembles the original comment.

You said: "If they are anything less than 100% safe, then the consequences will be catastrophic."

100% safe would be 0 medically significant side effects amongst 8,000,000,000 people wouldn't it?

Anything less than 100% would be anything more than 0. Including 1.

What have I misunderstood?

I was (and still am) talking about the situation in the United States today, where hundreds of millions of people have been vaccinated, and tens of thousands of people have died as a result.

Nope. There are reports on VAERS. That does not mean or even imply that that many have died as a result of the vaccination.

as opposed to the real vaccines which have a death rate of 1 in 3500.

The stage three trials were 0 deaths in 44,000. And 0 serious safety concerns. Your source for this 1 in 3500 is from one guys interpretation of VAERS, which requires a misunderstanding of what VAERS is. That's a reporting system by the public. Even assuming that there aren't dozens of anti-vaxers making up reports, they will include a lot of post-hoc effects that are not related to the vaccine.

Oh my god, how can you be this stupid? I was specifically talking about the United States, not the entire world!

Oh, pardon me. I'd forgotten that America is the only country getting vaccinated. I will restrict my discussion to the only 4% of the world that we clearly should be talking about.

Did you completely miss the part where I said that 48% of the U.S. population has been vaccinated (roughly 156 million people), and that there have been at least 45,000 deaths from the vaccines?

No, I responded to it.

Right. But that's bullshit isn't it.

Also keep in mind VAERS is not evidence. It doesn't attribute any side effect to the vaccine. It is merely a vaccine reality show where members of the public vote for their favourite side effect.

To look at if any of those are attributable to the vaccine, you need to look more closely. Or compare vaccinated and unvaccinated groups of a decent size.

The question you missed:

In the past, vaccines have been suspended for causing dozens of deaths.

For instance?

[–]TheJamesRocket 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You said: "If they are anything less than 100% safe, then the consequences will be catastrophic."

100% safe would be 0 medically significant side effects amongst 8,000,000,000 people wouldn't it? Anything less than 100% would be anything more than 0. Including 1.

How about no? ''Anything less than 100% safe'' includes a huge range of numbers, from 99.99% safe, all the way down to 0.01% safe. You can run those numbers to as many decimal places as you want, and the basic conclusion is still the same. When you have a vaccine thats being administered to billions of people, anything less than 100% would be a catastrophe.

The problem is that you are deliberately being obnoxious and refusing to concede an obvious point. You don't want to acknowledge the truth, so instead, you create a red herring. You speculate about a hypothetical vaccine that is 99.99++++++++% safe in order to try and invalidate my point. This is not only petty and dishonest, but it is completely irrelevant because we know from the VAERS database that the covid vaccine is nowhere near as safe as this. We're not arguing about your bullshit hypothetical vaccines, we're arguing about a real life vaccine that is killing huge numbers of people. Pull your head out of your ass!

Nope. There are reports on VAERS. That does not mean or even imply that that many have died as a result of the vaccination.

Wrong. Here is a quote from the article I linked to: ''Allegedly, the whistleblower stated that there are around 11 VAERS systems reporting adverse reactions and deaths across the US, and one system alone has allegedly has reported the shocking 45,000 deaths from the Covid jabs. However, Renz believes that this number is “immensely higher” and is calling for immediate investigations into the VAERS system.''

The stage three trials were 0 deaths in 44,000. And 0 serious safety concerns.

I've already went over this, and why it doesn't mean much. To repeat myself: ''In trials, they use healthy patients to experiment on. In the real world, there are people with serious health problems taking the vaccine.''

Your source for this 1 in 3500 is from one guys interpretation of VAERS, which requires a misunderstanding of what VAERS is.

There are several different sources indicating a high number of deaths from the covid vaccine in the U.S. The VAERS whistleblower reported at least 45,000 deaths. The CDC also reported 12,313 deaths on their website, before they hastily edited that number down to 6079 deaths.

No, I responded to it.

No, you didn't. You were babbling on about your hypothetical case where 8 billion people have been vaccinated and only 20,000 have died as a result. Because it had completely escaped your notice that I was talking about the United States and the 45,000 people who have died from the covid vaccine.

The question you missed:

In the past, vaccines have been suspended for causing dozens of deaths.

For instance?

Are you blind as well as stupid? I already answer that question in my last post. Go back and read it. I am getting very tired of having to repeat myself because of your bad reading comprehension.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How about no? ''Anything less than 100% safe'' includes a huge range of numbers, from 99.99% safe, all the way down to 0.01% safe.

Surely 99.999% safe is also less than 100% safe.

Did you mean "Anything less than 99.99% safe"?

When you have a vaccine thats being administered to billions of people

To quote your good self: Oh my god, how can you be this stupid? I was specifically talking about the United States, not the entire world!

How many people do you think are in the United States?

anything less than 100% would be a catastrophe.

So again, you claim that even as little as one medially serious incident every 330,000,000 doses would be a catastrophe.

Most people wouldn't call that a catastrophe.

The problem is that you are deliberately being obnoxious and refusing to concede an obvious point.

Not at all. It is not necessary for any medical intervention to be 100% safe. So long as it is safer than not doing the intervention, it isn't contraindicated.

Surgery has a risk. Antibiotics have a risk. Going to the gym has risks. They are a good idea (for things that they treat) if they are less risky than not doing them. The demand for them to be 100% safe is not the test for whether they should be done.

we know from the VAERS database that the covid vaccine is nowhere near as safe as this

As I have made clear above, the VAERS database cannot determine how safe the vaccine is, because it includes anything people send in. They are not attributable to the vaccine. It is only useful as an indicator of what effect we should consider looking for in a controlled study.

Here is a quote from the article I linked to: ''Allegedly, the whistleblower stated that there are around 11 VAERS systems reporting adverse reactions and deaths across the US, and one system alone has allegedly has reported the shocking 45,000 deaths from the Covid jabs. However, Renz believes that this number is “immensely higher” and is calling for immediate investigations into the VAERS system.''

I agree that that quote is in the article. My point is that claim is wrong, and not supported by plausible data.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/jul/22/instagram-posts/no-evidence-45000-deaths-covid-19-vaccines/

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/45000-people-die-covid-19-vaccine/

''In trials, they use healthy patients to experiment on. In the real world, there are people with serious health problems taking the vaccine.''

I responded to this already: If you have allergies or immune disorders, check with your GP before getting the vaccine.

The CDC also reported 12,313 deaths on their website, before they hastily edited that number down to 6079 deaths.

VAERS is unreliable as a count of deaths. Certainly as a count of deaths due to the vaccine.

If the numbers range about they could be cleaning up reports from antivax bots, or it could be a typo. But it doesn't make any material difference to the guidelines for who should not be vaccinated, because it's an open reporting system, not a controlled study.

Because it had completely escaped your notice that I was talking about the United States and the 45,000 people who have died from the covid vaccine.

Let me show you my response again:

Also keep in mind VAERS is not evidence. It doesn't attribute any side effect to the vaccine. It is merely a vaccine reality show where members of the public vote for their favourite side effect.

To look at if any of those are attributable to the vaccine, you need to look more closely. Or compare vaccinated and unvaccinated groups of a decent size.

Are you blind as well as stupid?

Sorry I couldn't see where you named some vaccines that have been suspended for causing dozens of deaths. Would you mind showing me the paragraph?