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[–]Dragonerne 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (20 children)

Someone supporting BLM doesn't mean they hate white people, that's ridiculous.

Yes, it does. They might not personally perceive it as such but this is what they do. It's normalized and internalized hatred of white people.

Saying BLM is racist, because it's connected to the movement. The lives of black people matter is not racist, but BLM is.

just like white people are

Trust me if millions of whites ran around yelling "White Lives Matter", killing police officers, shooting blacks, murdering people, looting stores, putting buildings on fire, taking down statues of historical black leaders, forcing blacks to resign from their jobs, jailing blacks for defending their homes, jailing blacks for calling the cops, demanding blacks kneel and submit, demanding blacks wash their feet, demanding that universities and hiring processes artificially give bonus scores to whites and killing a black woman for saying "All Lives Matter" then you would have an entirely different take on this if I told you "White Lives Matter" is totally not racist.

[–]zerosis 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

I understand your frustrations with BLM, but I disagree that the movement is inherently racist toward white people. A white person supporting BLM (Because let's be honest, it's mostly middle to upper class white people vocally supporting it) isn't 'hating' white people, it's people jumping on a moral bandwagon that they think is doing genuine good in the world. At worst it's a bunch of white people feeling guilty because they know the way black people are percieved subconsciously by most people in the Western world. Black people and black features are frequently viewed as less beautiful, less refined, more 'mysterious,' foreign, an underdog, primal, damaged or dangerous, unwanted, slightly or heavily lesser-than. That would get to anyone after a while, and I don't blame some black people for complaining about being forced to live in a culture that casually views them like that. I'm sure I'd get sick of it too, as a white person, if I was living in a country where the standard of normality and beauty was black/asian/latino, and I was more likely to get shot just for being white (whether by cops or by my own people due to the socio-economic ramifications of being white in said country). Most of it has fuck-all to do with white people themselves. An infinitesimally small sector of extremists were responsible for the lootings and shootings, it's dishonest to claim that it's 'millions of black people' doing this, or that the majority of BLM even condones that. The statues that were taken down were monuments to the Confederacy, which was a dark chapter in America's history and I don't blame them for taking them out of public places. As a white person, I would want something taken down too if it was honoring the mass slavery, colonization and murder of white people. Obviously giving a higher score to a black person just for being black would be ridiculous, but I highly doubt that's happening on a pandemic scale and it sounds highly sensationalist. If you want to provide a source for that, I'd love to read more into it.

[–]Dragonerne 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

A white or black person supporting BLM is hating white people. Even if it's just "moral bandwagoning". They might not perceive it as such, but that's what it is.

At worst it's a bunch of white people feeling guilty because they know the way black people are percieved subconsciously by most people in the Western world.

I can't take this serious. Whites are constantly attacked in society, in movies, in media, social media etc.

An infinitesimally small sector of extremists were responsible for the lootings and shootings

What's your take on the charlottesville rally? Peaceful? Non-racist?

The statues that were taken down were monuments to the Confederacy, which was a dark chapter in America's history and I don't blame them for taking them out of public places.

Yes of course you don't blame them. I'm not surprised.

and I was more likely to get shot just for being white

Doesn't happen in the US. Blacks are less likely than or as likely to be shot as whites.

I'm sure I'd get sick of it too, as a white person, if I was living in a country where the standard of normality and beauty was black/asian/latino

You would be free to move back to your home country.

Obviously giving a higher score to a black person just for being black would be ridiculous, but I highly doubt that's happening on a pandemic scale and it sounds highly sensationalist. If you want to provide a source for that, I'd love to read more into it.

Sure, google affirmative action, disparate impact, caren act, aca 5 bill.
The mistreatment of and racism against white people is institutionalized and systemic in the US.

[–]zerosis 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

Not surprised that you're not even remotely taking this conversation seriously, but it's nice that you just let me know your true motives with that 'move back to your home country' line. Christ. You're like a caricature of a white racist. This kind of shit is exactly why saidit will never get off the ground and will never compete with reddit, it's full of people like you who refuse to see nuance in anything and want to fight the left by throwing the victim card right back at them in the most bullshit and transparent ways. Do you honestly think anyone is convinced by this 'oh I'm a poor opressed white man' shit? Black people have it shitty, white people have it shitty. You're just making it worse by playing into the oppression olympics and acting like white people are getting cosmically shafted right now.

Also, it's on you to provide sources, I'm not going to spend a week googling to find some sensationalist report of a liberal arts professor trying to make a social statement in Seattle, or something.

[–]Dragonerne 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

I'm sorry but I don't have to take your abusive and gaslighting language.

Black people have it shitty, white people have it shitty.

There are not "two sides" to this, when you have literal laws and policies that discriminate against whites simply for having the wrong skin color.
Your response was expected after your defence of BLM. This is why I didn't bother finding sources to educate you on this topic. History will judge.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

Gaslighting? Abuse? Really? You have got to be trolling me right now, dude. If I was trying to be abusive, I'd call you stupid for repeatedly parroting tired leftist talking points in an attempt to validate your white oppression card. I don't think you are, though, I think you're just being willfully obtuse, even though you're probably fully capable of coherent thought. BLM being obnoxious doesn't detract from the fact that white people don't have it that bad right now, or ever in this country, really. If white people were THAT oppressed, we wouldn't have a fucking white president, for christ's sake. Or 44 white presidents.

Ah, of course THAT'S why you can't provide sources. Ok.

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Deny, deny, deny. Gaslight, gaslight, gaslight. Abuse, abuse, abuse.
"Source?" "Source?"
"BLM isn't racist. Blacks have it really hard."
"Stop playing the victim card, you whitey"
"You're being willfully obtuse"

Sorry, I've debated too many on reddit like this. So yes, I was expecting that.

If you want an actual conversation between two normal people, then you need to first apologize for claiming that I was not taking the conversation seriously, your comment about my "true motives. Christ", your comment about me being like a caricature of a white racist, your comment about people like me being the downfall of saidit, you calling me willfully obtuse.
And then, after apologizing for that, you would spend 5 seconds to type "Affirmative action" into google and click on one of the first links to educate yourself on this topic, and then I might consider forgiving you but I very likely wont, because I would feel uncomfortable and fearing that you might relapse and continue the abuse.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

Don't know if you noticed, dude, but I was having a polite conversation until you turned the tide toward abusive language. I wasn't kidding when I asked for a source, I was still debating you in good faith at that point, and I was interested and open in what you had to say, but obviously you had nothing real to show. If you're that concerned about having a 'normal conversation between two people,' you should have stayed civil.

I'm kind of amused at how far you're willing to take this parroting, though. It's kind of endearing in a way. The asking for an apology bit is a little on the nose, I would advise against going that far next time, it isn't really spicy enough to hold up to the 'abuse' tantrum thing you have going on.

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

After calling me names, obtuse, etc. forgive me for not really caring at this point. If you want to know more, spend 5 seconds on google.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Cared enough to refuse to cite your claims again, I guess