all 27 comments

[–]wahala 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (13 children)

Funny coincidence, just the other day I was listening to an old Art Bell-hosted Coast to Coast AM from 8/21/2005, with guest Sir Charles Shults III (https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2005-08-21-show/). They discussed the space elevator, and were very keen that it could be possible. Sir Charles felt that funding really was the only hold back, and that the technology already existed. It was refreshing to hear their optimism.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

It really seems to come down to the ability to manufacture long carbon nanotubes reliably and somewhat cheaply. If we can figure that out, then it seems like we can pull off the space elevator. Seems like we're close to figuring out the carbon nanotube manufacturing issues, maybe a decade or two. And then they can start building it which will take another decade probably. So hopefully the space elevator would open around 2050 or so. It all depends on how quickly people can figure out the long nanotube mass manufacture process.

[–]wahala 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

That and any environmental concerns. I mean, there's nothing to explode here, like a rocket, so the typical impact zones that we have in many space ports areas/surrounds, are nullified. I don't know how a failure of the elevator would impact the environment, and for how large of an area. Definitely seems possible, just has to be a deliberate process.

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (7 children)

It would be crazy if it somehow whipped around the earth and that tether wrapped around a country and cut a bunch of buildings in half like a cheese wire slicer. Sounds like a good sci-fi movie

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

Wouldn't they have it in the ocean so if it fell over it would just fall into the ocean, not land? I think they don't want to spend all that money to build it and it collapses, wasting all the billions.

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

Maybe yeah, but it would probably want to be mounted to land as creating a secure mount on the ocean might not be easy.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

It's not like it would float away into space. I think it being not secured and floating in the ocean is preferred actually. It could be moved if space debris threatens to hit it in space

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I mean people still have to get on it, and there has to be a platform around it that you get on and off of, and it has to be stable enough to load people and luggage in and stuff

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah it could be a base that floats in the ocean.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_elevator#Base_station

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Wow that article has improved since last I looked years ago. Still missing a few ideas, but if farm more impressive.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Actually drifting into space is a real possibility. It would be an immense balancing act that would be in serious jeopardy from the weather and jet streams.

Having a mobile target to receive it on the surface (easier over water than land) might be an advantage if it were being built downward as suggested in the video. Once contact is made it could be maneuvered to a larger pre-built anchor point.

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

To build anything in space you'll need rockets. You can't just build upward. Most of it needs to be started in geosynchronous orbit. All satellites have fuel to perpetually adjust their position until they run out and become space junk. Even the outer end, past the main orbiting mass will need rockets to position without purchase on land or any other means of shifting position, and certainly not by the elevator.

The powers that be would never care about the environmental impact, though they might try to spin some public relation stuff to justify or defend their interests.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

My Bittersweet Seeds story takes place around 2045-2050, largely because that's when the Singularity is supposed to happen and also because I can't picture much beyond that strange world. Everything is already coming true that was just in my imagination less than a decade ago - including the surveillance state. My story was supposed to warn people not document it.

I'm also disappointed not to have a space elevator in my story, but I think I have a solution that is more practical and interesting - a "space bridge" (I use better words in the story), like a matrix of tensegrity towers 20km tall with a maglev pneumatic hyperloop (vacuum hyperloops like Elon Musks are complete nonsense (see thunderf00t's videos on it)) that launches a "space train" and, as the maglev "shuttles" that hold the train in the tube peel away to self-glide back to Earth for reuse, with a great head start and lots of momentum the rockets kick in to push the space train and its payload through the remaining thin atmosphere to the L1 Earth-Moon Lagrangian point to build a micro-gravity space station that will eventually host a hotel, military base, research, and industrial processing and manufacturing in decades thereafter. This may be the first time I've shared a very basic outline of my secret space recipe. The practical craft design is a whole other surprise.

That's only how the 3rd act starts. I'll finish it one day and share it.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I like optimism, but I also like practicality. The tensile strength of carbon-fiber is off the charts by comparison with other materials - but it won't be enough unfortunately.

[–]TruthTeller 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

No.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

Agreed. The numbers get staggeringly huge too fast and too much and to build from the top down you'd already need an industrial space solution anyway.

Geostationary orbit 35,000+km/22,000+miles away, but you'd also need all of that counter weight extending MUCH farther out as you simultaneously build back towards Earth (or else it would begin to fall "down"). A VERY critical balance would be necessary the entire time. How would you land/connect?

Not only that, but you'd definitely need at least 3 lanes for lack of a better term. 1 up, 1 down, and 1 on perpetual maintenance.

It's a nice abstract idea, but when you actually start to think about it...

However it's interesting that even 20 years ago, in the previous century, with our existing technology then, with concrete and steel, if someone had an ego with a budget and a purpose, technically, we could have built a tower that's 20km tall. Obviously that means we could also do it now. But to what end?

I've thought extensively on these matters (and more) and have my own practical (but not cheap) solutions for industrializing space in my subversive cautionary hard-sci-fi tale, though it doesn't take place until the 3rd act starting off the dramatic final act and climax in space. I should be finishing my first draft of Bittersweet Seeds instead of this, but this year has been crazy and I don't have focus nor discipline, and other things that need my help keep landing in my lap. I can't decide how best to save the world!

[–]TruthTeller 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

You don't have to take this all that seriously. Just a simple "No" will suffice.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Yes and no.

Not everything is serious.

Bad science is a serious as COVID, climate scam, and big pharm.

Bad sci-fi and fantasy (magic, monsters, bad physics) has been dumbing down the world and passing for "science".

Half of everyone is stupider than average and most of the rest are really close to average. We don't need to help them be stupid.

Nuff sed.

[–]TruthTeller 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Again, NO would be enough.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

No, it wasn't.

[–]TruthTeller 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Nice video! It reminds me of an excellent sci-fi novel regarding the topic called Pillar to the Sky by William R. Forstchen (author of One Second After). Great read for anyone interested in the subject.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Thanks for the recommendation!

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Np! It's entertaining, and it would seem he did his research.

The effort required to actually pull off something like a space elevator would be immense. Not impossible, maybe, but surely impractical... at least until we have some serious industrial advances taking place first. But then comes the question: what would such advanced industrialism look like? Would it be as damaging to the environment as the machine we currently maintain? Would it be worth the effort? (At that stage maybe we could start terraforming planets, which might make the effort more worthwhile, but which might have moral implications as well.)

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Also check out Arthur C. Clarke's The Songs Of Distant Earth (which inspired Mike Oldfield's great album of the same name) which features a space elevator.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Songs+Of+Distant+Earth

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks, will do if I can find it. I love all of Arthur C. Clarke's work. The Rama series was also great.

[–]TruthTeller 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

No.