"If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed, and love of power" P.J.O'Rourke

submitted by EndlessSunflowers from i.imgtc.com

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[–]wizzwizz4 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Unfortunately, there's no test for those.

[–]magnora7 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Sure there is. If they love power, they will continually seek it and have actions that display that.

If they're greedy, their actions will be oriented around procuring more money rather than helping fellow human beings.

Basically anyone who has worked themselves in to a position of high power in a system that is corrupt, shouldn't be allowed to have any power.

But who's going to enforce that? That's the real pickle, and why things are basically always so messed up. The answer is the masses have to enforce it, and that only comes through widely-held cultural beliefs. If everyone believed like the OP, we'd have a much better system. But instead many people kowtow to it, so they can get a little piece of the pie for themselves.

[–]wizzwizz4 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Basically anyone who has worked themselves in to a position of high power in a system that is corrupt, shouldn't be allowed to have any power.

I've been thinking stuff like this through since I was 6, and came to the conclusion that it was naïve at about age 11. The kind of culture required to enforce such a thing is too hard to create.

Instead, I thought about devising a system where the positions of power allowed those people to profit somewhat without really being able to affect anything unduly, whereas the actual positions of power were thankless tasks such that they couldn't profit. And, now that I think about it, that's ridiculously naïve.

This problem is hard. Those who seek power are either greedy and corrupt, or benevolent and prone to being quashed by corruption and aggression – or somewhere in between those two extremes. We could put random people into power – there have been serious proposals to that extent and even some functional systems – but then you're just shifting the power to the advisors (is that the "deep state"?). ARGH!

But anyway, that's only a test for love of power (or benevolence), and a test for greed. The stupidity and ignorance are harder to test.

[–]magnora7 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

whereas the actual positions of power were thankless tasks such that they couldn't profit. And, now that I think about it, that's ridiculously naïve.

Well... it worked for the UK royalty system. I don't see a reason it couldn't be done for a whole senate, other than the fact it's not based on bloodlines.

We should just make the senate based on bloodlines (which it partly already is) and then just relegate it in to irrelevance like the UK did with the queen lol.

But maybe that's not a real solution, I don't know.

We could put random people into power – there have been serious proposals to that extent and even some functional systems – but then you're just shifting the power to the advisors (is that the "deep state"?). ARGH!

Completely relate to what you're saying. Seems like the only solution is to simply weaken the power structure, but this has to be done by the society at large, not through a movement with a leader or else you just wind up right back where you started lol. Like most revolutions.

Good comment!

[–]wizzwizz4 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Well... it worked for the UK royalty system.

Not quite all the time. The first thing that comes to mind is Mary I's attack on France, though this may be because they were trying to assassinate her and isn't actually a very good example.

I don't see a reason it couldn't be done for a whole senate, other than the fact it's not based on bloodlines.

Culture.

We should just make the senate based on bloodlines (which it partly already is) and then just relegate it in to irrelevance like the UK did with the queen lol.

The Queen isn't irrelevant! She brings in loads of tourism money, and if the government decides to do something stupid like kill all of the firstborns she can step in and stop them (but will probably have to abdicate immediately afterwards).

Seems like the only solution is to simply weaken the power structure,

Off-topic: Would you be interested in the movement to become our own ISPs? Cjdns and Hyperboria are two keywords.

Good comment!

Thank you! Yours too.

[–]magnora7 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Ah interesting about the Queen, I didn't know that.

Becoming our own ISPs is very cool, I've not heard of that. Anything that helps decentralize the internet is a good thing, imo. I'll read more about it.

[–]wizzwizz4 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

If you host a server, do it on cjdns. Even if it's a cjdns connected straight to your ISP. Let your neighbours connect to your cjdns. If we need the ISPs then let us use them, but they must never have a monopoly on internet connectivity.

I suspect that parts of the US stand to benefit greatly from this (cough cough Comcast cough).

[–]magnora7 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Interesting, I bet /u/d3rr would be interested in this technology too.

[–]wizzwizz4 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

/u/d3rr (and probably also you; I don't know) would be able to get it to run on a phone. If you can figure out a way to connect a chain of phones together (can you connect it to WLAN while being a hotspot?) then you can give a lot of cheap internet to the people down the road with terrible reception who don't want to / can't pay the monopoly ISP a fortune.

Also, it functions similarly to a less-secret Tor – mostly by accident – so EU citizens can get around the content blocks. If set up correctly, it can actually be faster than the normal internet. It's really quite great.

[–]magnora7 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That's super interesting. I still don't quite understand how others connect to it though. I guess from a user's perspective it just looks like a normal server? Or do they have to install this ISP-replacing software too?

[–]wizzwizz4 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Bluetooth. That's the second connection.