"Getting rid of capitalist 'exploiters' in Communist countries did not raise the living standards of workers, even to levels common in many capitalist countries, where workers were presumably still being exploited, as Marxists conceived the term." - Thomas Sowell

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[–]Bud223 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

It's not very surprising that changing the exploiters from the capitalists to the communist party itself did not improve the lifes of the working class. That takes away any opportunity to improve your situation in life. Then replaces it with a system that is proven over and over again to lead to a steady decline in the fortunes of all but the government leaders themselves.

[–]Soloninja 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The workers end up becoming poorer than before

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Whereas socialism, in the true and absolutely anti-communist definition of the term, is the tilting back of the balance of unbridled capitalism from the oligarchs, back to well SOCIety, which is where the term socialism comes from. Having the super rich contribute significantly to society is a bad thing how?

It's only a bad thing if you accept the COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA started by Marx that went like "Communism is socialism done right". What a bunch of shite.

The pre-Marx socialists were anarchists and libertarians. That's how far opposite communism the origins of socialism are. But because of this COMMUNIST PROPAGANDA psyop brainwashing campaign, we have an Orwellian Newspeak definition of the term, which conflates it with communism, rendering people unable to think the ideas that used to be represented by the word "socialism". As such, all the English-speaking world has become mentally handicapped from a good chunk of socioeconomic thought.

No wonder the USA is falling apart. It has been engineered, in good part through language (and therefore thought) destruction.

[–]JuliusCaesar225 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Marxism in it true form is a democratic anti-state philosophy that seeks an anarchist society.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

It posits class opposition, and as such, seeks a classless society. But this is extremely destructive. It's still the worst idea ever.

[–]JuliusCaesar225 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Not saying it is good. Some people think Marxism advocates for a totalitarian state but it doesn't. It happens due to the falseness of its dogma.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Agreed! :-)

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Marx literally openly opposed anarchists in his life time.

[–]JuliusCaesar225 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Communism is an anarchist society. He opposed anarchists because they had different views on how to achieve communist society. Both seek a stateless communist society. Marx wanted the proletariate to take control of the state to develop communism, anarchists wanted the state abolished in the revolution.

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Socialism is the workers owning the means of production. It's nothing to do with the super rich paying more taxes, checks on capitalism or more public services, those things exist in all kinds of societies. PreMarx socialists were more like cooperative members now, they meant for the actual workers to own the company they worked in not some state owning everything no matter the set up. The trouble is the majority of people don't want to work in cooperatives because they want to concentrate on their own job without the worry of being partly responsible for the whole business. They simply don't want to own the means of production in a big company, they actively want someone else to do that job.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

But it doesn't change the exploiters. The entire idea is to remove them. Capitalists take profit out of companies, which comes directly off the backs of the workers. Remove the capitalists, and the profits go away. These (abundant) monies are now available to be redistributed among the workers.

[–]Narrator 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

So just have normal capitalism and a progressive tax rate. You don't need a communist revolution.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

But...power to the people!

[–]GConly 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Capitalists take profit out of companies,

Yes but the build and run the companies, with out them there is no wealth to take.