"It’s easy to be a communist in a free country. But try being free in a communist country." - Aubrey Huff

submitted by muellermeierschulz from self.quotes

sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun
you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–]Breadman 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (15 children)

Former serfs living in apartments for the first time, in the USSR; certainly felt more free than they had been under the Tsar.

Stop thinking in absolutes. The world is nuanced.

[–][deleted]  (10 children)

[deleted]

    [–]flugegeheimen 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (9 children)

    Tens of millions of Russians were slaughtered

    No, billions! Tens of billions!

    force-famined by the Bolshevik/Soviet communist conquest of Russia

    These fucking Bolsheviks forcing nature to cause droughts and consequential bad famine, completely different from good famines regularly happening in Imperial Russia.

    Families and lineages were destroyed.

    Why couldn't pathetic commies keep these noble lineages and families intact (preferably with serfs and palaces)?! What a crime against humanity!

    It was communist policy to kill or gulag (slave labor camps and brainwashing) everyone who disagreed with communist tyranny.

    You also forgot to mention the mandatory eating of kids in the Soviet Constitution of 1924.

    Your belief that people "felt more free" later isn't possible to measure accurately, even if it were not a preposterous assumption.

    It would be a preposterous assumption if USSR wasn't more free than Imperial Russia, which is the whole reason you are even whining about (heavily exaggerated) soviet policies mirroring the previous regime. Man, your comment made /u/Breadman (!) look smart. Just think about it for a minute.

    [–][deleted]  (7 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]flugegeheimen 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (6 children)

      Forced famines are different from natural ones

      Technically you are right, the former is conspiracy bullshit the latter is what happened in reality. The most you can reasonably attribute to the Soviet government in 30s is bad agricultural management and that they didn't halt completely grain export, exactly the things typical for Imperial Russia during their famines. Soviet famine in 20s is even more clear cut at being natural and Bolshevik's treatment of it is even more damaging to your argument.

      Bolshevik rulers weren't concerned about planning more than 2 steps ahead for 'their countrymen', only for themselves, because the bodies of real Russians were seen as disposable. They hated Russians with the same type of hate that the modern breed of 'Bolsheviks' have in hating white people today.

      I'm kind of tired of repeating "and how is this different from the previous regime?". My point is don't double down on making up increasingly more inane shit about Bolsheviks. It's a comparison, if you have to make up some BS, at least you need both to make one side look bad and to whitewash the other side. The former alone is not enough.

      Bolshevik/Soviet communism had an extremely higher body count and was more enslaving than anything under the Russian monarchy, when comparing two examples that are both negative.

      Finally, something that is close to an actual argument, thank you. Too bad your "isn't possible to measure accurately, even if it were not a preposterous assumption." line bites you back, when you try to compare actual numbers. With that aside you take quite a leap between "higher body count" and "less free". Like it doesn't even make the slightest sense? Less free means having less freedoms and it's really a preposterous assumption (I'm going to use your "a preposterous assumption" non stop now) that the police state of absolute monarchy with nobility and other estates is more free than whatever political structures evolved in USSR.

      [–][deleted]  (5 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]flugegeheimen 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

        It isn't preposterous to assume that most Russians at the time would choose the monarchy (as their dictators) instead of Lenin/etc (as their dictators), were they to have the benefit of hindsight and the freedom to pick

        Yeah, if only people living at the time could make decisions not on their own experience but on whatever crumbs of information a poorly educated first world internet denizen could extract from Wikipedia and random conspiracy theory books. (the latter describes us both btw)

        based on the death toll alone.

        Again, this based on a preposterous assumption that your bullshit numbers are accurate and not comparable to Imperial Russia.

        Yes, living under a monarchy was comparatively more free than being killed or having your entire family killed.

        Besides being atrociously bad at the whole false dichotomies business, you just repeated your preposterous assumption of equivalence between being free and body count without adding anything to it.

        Bolshevism killing a lot of the country's smartest people at the time is not "conspiracy bullshit".

        I think it's mixed with ignorance as well, not just conspiracy bullshit. They were "smartest" in the first place because Imperial Russia intentionally limited lower classes from receiving the same education higher classes had. Naturally a small most educated part was also the one intent on keeping the old regime, although a lot of the country's smartest people joined Bolsheviks as well.

        [–][deleted]  (3 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]flugegeheimen 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

          I don't feel like repeating myself to disprove you simply repeating your BS over and over. So, one more question (kind of off-topic in this comment chain): how in your fantasy world where "Communists seek to eradicate a lot of the smartest people blahblablah" do you explain Bolsheviks putting a monumental effort into mass education to grow a lot of smart people they supposed to eradicate?

          [–][deleted]  (1 child)

          [deleted]

            [–]GConly 10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

            Forced famines.

            The communists took all the grain from the farmers, and shot anyone who tried to collect left over grain from the dirt after. Then all the farmers starved.

            Natural famine my arse.

            [–]jet199 11 insightful - 2 fun11 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

            You know the serfs were emancipated in 1861, right?

            [–]Breadman 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

            Only formally

            [–]GConly 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

            Tell that to the millions Stalin deliberately starved.

            [–]Breadman 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

            Again, no need to think in absolutes. Stalin was indeed a mass murderer, I’m just pointing out for many under the regime, perceptions of ‘progress’ had some genuine basis.