There is no such thing as an "expert" in a programming language

submitted by trident765 from self.programming

Spend a couple of months learning the basics of a programming language, and this is all you need to know. It's a bit like English. Having Shakespeare's knowledge of the English language will give you a minimal advantage over the average person in being able to communicate your point.

Expertise in your niche of software matters, as does having the right philosophy, but don't let anyone fool you into thinking they are a "Python expert" or a "C expert", unless they are speaking in the context of the development of the language itself.

all 11 comments
sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun

[–]Tums_is_Smut_bkwrds 3 insightful - 4 fun3 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

Spoken like someone who's never taken the time ie. years to become proficient at anything. OP clearly hasn't a clue what the difference is between competent and expert is.

It is true that the current state of IT is so fluid that it's hard to justify devoting the time and energy on a single programming language to attain wizard status, assuming you're looking for work that is. But anyone with a decade of programming under their belt can become 'good enough' in a new development platform in weeks because programming languages are like tools to a competent craftsman. I've known professional musicians that learned how to play an entirely new instrument in just a few weeks sufficiently well to perform. They never intend to become a virtuoso on the instrument, just good enough to get the job.

Besides it's a well known and understood phenomena that people with a some amount of experience with a new discipline -- any discipline, not just programming -- consider themselves considerably better than they actually are. It's not until they gather more experience that they begin to understand just how little they actually know. As the saying goes the path to true enlightenment starts when you realize that you know nothing.

[–]iDontShift 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

experts know the inner workings of how a command works.

you can use a language without knowing how it works

but those that know can do and avoid problems newbies find baffling

it is a lot like speaking language, but the implications of not knowing the origins of words is far less critical when speaking than in a computer language.

what i have found is the more I learn the more I discover that i thought I knew that I now see more than I could know, the knowledge of what is but not known can be useful as well and often (perhaps impossibly so) unknown by newbies

saying this is like implying that all code is equal, it is not

same for communication, it may be 'literally correct' to say a thing in a certain way (using double negatives for instance)... but it is wasteful in its use of resources.. for computers it is wasted time .. and the same for people as they are required to unpack the meaning using literary rules akin to a mathematical equation

[–]harley 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

a couple of months of experience with a programming will give to you a minimal advantage over someone who knows nothing.

when you acquire a decade or two or three of experience writing code, then you will understand that when you had only a few months of experience that you really knew nothing.

there is a fairly famous quote that says something about that the more i learn i realize how little i know... it is beginners that think that they know it all.

a famous car bumper sticker:

if(you_love_c()) honk();

[–]jamesK_3rd 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Ok I'll say it..

Python is a scripting language. C gets you close to the hardware, and your design and thought can mean the difference between a completely optimized program for the hardware or a software that just doesn't function as intended.

This is so true that most people hear from others about how dangerous C is, or how archaic and antiquated the language is. The reality is that since the 80's, CS grads haven't been taught how to think through and properly design and write a program.

In fact, it's mostly use XXX module or macro it'll do what you want, without understanding the risk, liabilities, or vulnerabilities that comes with using someone else's design. It's faster, and the mantra is " let's not reinvent the wheel, just get it functionally working so we can move on to the next thing"

[–]Tiwaking 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Python is a scripting language.

/me watches all the Python programmers get their pitchforks and torches

[–]jamesK_3rd 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Haha. Yeh. But I see this all the time with new kids coming in at work.

I get pretty frustrated with how the company focuses so much on metrics on your completed tickets or dev work making it more important than what you actually do. This leads to new devs looking up some similar issue on stack overflow or server fault, getting the issue to "just working", close tickets and move on.

When we transitioned from py2.7 to 3.6, it was a shit show. I made sure I let everyone know python was garbage. Of course, I'm an obseleted C/C++ dev who is transitioning to DevOps, so call me bitter.

[–]fschmidt 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

I made sure I let everyone know python was garbage.

What's wrong with Python? Sure, it is a scripting language, but it is a good scripting language. Scripting languages have their role, see Ousterhout.

[–]fschmidt 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The modern scum have commented here. But who knows, maybe modern programming languages are so fucked up and overcomplicated that they take forever to master. Certainly most old languages, developed before modern culture became depraved, can be learned in a few weeks. My language, Luan, can be learned in a few days. But I haven't looked much at modern programming languages, so I don't know how long it would take to learn them.

[–]Tiwaking 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

/me laughs in Lisp

[–]yabbit 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

If you're high iq you can learn a programming language way faster than somebody whos slightly less smart tho.

[–]zyxzevn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How a deep look at C++