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[–]thoughtcriminal 21 insightful - 3 fun21 insightful - 2 fun22 insightful - 3 fun -  (31 children)

It's a lose lose.

If Trump wins or the case is dismissed (most likely imo) it's because it was clearly a witch hunt, given the weakness of the charges.

If Trump loses it's because it was clearly a witch hunt, given the weakness of the charges.

Considering every past (and current) president in my lifetime has committed literal war crimes and never been tried, it looks like a witch hunt regardless. Imagine spending 6+ years, including the largest and most expensive federal investigation in history trying to find something to jail Trump over; and the best they can come up with is falsifying a business record which is usually just a misdemeanor and is already past the statute of limitations. Amazing.

Maybe if Bragg focused on crime in his own state instead of Orange Man it wouldn't be such a shithole.

[–]ActuallyNot 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (30 children)

How can it be a witch hunt? Michael Cohen was sentenced to 3 years in prison for this same campaign finance violation.

The only reason that Trump didn't do time then is his DOJ was so partisan they didn't pursue the sitting president as out of scope.

[–]SoCo 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (29 children)

Chohen plead guilty to a non-crime that made no sense and never would have survived simple review. He either was paid handsomely for it, which made this whole grasping at straws against Trump possible, or he negotiated his way out of other crimes for doing so.

The DOJ is a separate branch of government. The executive branch doesn't control the DOJ. The DOJ is stuffed with activists judges slowly over time.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (28 children)

It was two crimes. One, a campaign finance violation. Two, saying he paid it out of his own pocket to cover up that it was a campaign finance violation.

The executive branch doesn't control the DOJ

Trump appointed Bill Barr, who covered up his crimes for him.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (27 children)

Barr didn't cover anything up.

I see you are confused about the "campaign finance violation" ruse. No, it came from his own pocket, not from any campaign fund. It is well established what accounts sent money to where. They are accusing any payment from his own pocket that they can speculate goes towards helping his campaign, to be technically a campaign payment. So he can't spend any more than the campaign value cap on any one thing, that some weasel can mind-read that it was totally about the campaign.

He made the payment from the Trump org to a LLC company formed by his lawyer, Cohen, to deal with legal issues, such as purchasing the enquirer interview and paying off some salty gold diggers looking to make some cash with freedom of speech/association killing slander interviews. They are accusing the monthly payments to the LLC to be structured payments directly to Stormy Daniels, making him logging the payments as legal fees to be fraudulent.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (26 children)

Barr didn't cover anything up.

He closed the Mueller investigation early.

He released out of context fragments of the report to make it look much less damning than it was.

He redacted large sections of it so that it seemed that there were ongoing investigations.

He's good at it. That's why Trump gave him the job.

He pressured Durham to investigate the whistle blowers about the Russia collusion inquiry, and when the only crime they found was by Trump, they hushed it up.

No, it came from his own pocket, not from any campaign fund.

I see you're confused about the laws on campaign finance.

Under federal election campaign rules, candidates are required to register with the FEC within 15 days of receiving contributions or spending more than $5,000 on a presidential campaign. It doesn't matter if it comes from your pocket. It matters what it's spent on.

He made the payment from the Trump org to a LLC company formed by his lawyer, Cohen, to deal with legal issues, such as purchasing the enquirer interview and paying off some salty gold diggers looking to make some cash with freedom of speech/association killing slander interviews.

Paying hush money and killing stories isn't "legal issues". It's "media".

When it's done to support a presidential campaign, it must be declared.

It's clear he had criminal intent because he lied about it, saying it was a retainer for Cohen, who was providing legal services. In fact no legal service were provided. Cohen was being reimbursed for paying off Daniels, but in monthly payments in an attempt to hide what it was.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (25 children)

He closed the Mueller investigation early.

He released out of context fragments of the report to make it look much less damning than it was.

He redacted large sections of it so that it seemed that there were ongoing investigations.

None of that is true.

The Mueller investigation completed. Barr released the main result. Salty people were upset of the results and upset that Barr gave just the result and didn't spew leading nonsense to muddy the result. Barr didn't even complain when Mueller broke the norm to do just that, squeeze nonsense in their pretending there was possibly obstruction, which helped the media continue to lead the salty people around like a carrot on a stick. He is required to redact names and ongoing investigations. His redactions were extremely minimal and not only done by him.

He pressured Durham to investigate the whistle blowers about the Russia collusion inquiry, and when the only crime they found was by Trump, they hushed it up.

That wasn't hushed up by anyone but the media trying to bury it. At least three people were criminally charged as a result of Durham's investigation, including people (FBI/lawyers) who lied for force the fake Russian collusion political attack Hillary paid millions of dollars for, but wasn't charged for campaign spending violations. Unfortunately, the activist judges let almost everyone off, especially the FBI members, who conspired to push the fake accusations.

I see you're confused about the laws on campaign finance.

I see you are grasping, as I explained that what you said was the nonsense accusation. There's no realistic way to call that campaign spending. They might of paid Cohen to plead guilty on the nonsense charge, but that doesn't work for anyone else.

Paying hush money and killing stories isn't "legal issues". It's "media".

Public figures, with business attached to their names, have many interests in to preventing damages and libel. The real question of this case, has nothing to do with that, thought. It has to prove that monthly payments for legal services to prevent the libel attacks are not a legal retainer and also specifically done for nefarious fraudulent reasons. This is the most extreme stretch possible, which will never be proven beyond a reasonable doubt in court, as it primarily relies on mind reading, as like most accusations, it relies squarely on gaslighting you into believing that projected nefarious motivations are unquestionable....it is the same trick over and over again, which shows the extreme bias, corruption, and divergence from norms that these activist courts devolve into when they run a fake circus trial.

In fact no legal service were provided. Cohen was being reimbursed for paying off Daniels, but in monthly payments in an attempt to hide what it was.

Nearly 3 times what the scamming gold digger was paid, was paid to the legal retainer. The legal LLC handled several issues, such as purchasing of rights from enquirer, something one would need a lawyer to handle.

The very extreme stretch of a possible assumption being projected, is grasping at straws in excess of legal norms, even if you ignore that the payments don't add up.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (24 children)

The Mueller investigation completed.

Barr was appointed and pulled the plug on the thing. Mueller's investigators were surprised to learn from the public that they were wrapping up.

Salty people were upset of the results and upset that Barr gave just the result and didn't spew leading nonsense to muddy the result.

Barr misrepresented the results.

Judge slams Barr, orders review of Mueller report deletions

Judge Calls Barr’s Handling of Mueller Report ‘Distorted’ and ‘Misleading’

There's no realistic way to call that campaign spending.

You claim Trump was paying to control bad press, and that was nothing to do with the election?

Do you expect anyone to believe that?

Do you believe it?

It has to prove that monthly payments for legal services to prevent the libel attacks are not a legal retainer

That's already established when Cohen was convicted.

even if you ignore that the payments don't add up.

The payments add up like this:

$280,000 paid from Cohen to the Daniels and McDougal.

$35,000 per month, was paid to Cohen under the false guise of a legal retainer for 12 months.

In truth and fact, there was no such retainer agreement, and the monthly invoices COHEN submitted were not in connection with any legal services he had provided in 2017.

$360,000 to cover his $280,000 payment given that disguised as it was as a retainer, he would now have to pay tax on it. $60,000 as a bonus for being a good fixer.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (23 children)

Barr didn't pull anything. Mueller finished.

Barr did not misrepresent the results, which found the accusations to be false. Barr just didn't add any extra context, which pissed off people suckered into expecting something, and media mouthpieces that were proven liars by the results. Also, politicians proven ethically devoid and nearly treasonous, by the results.

Again, Barr did not make the redactions....Corporate media manipulators and politicians with treason on their hands, found activist judges that were appointed by Republicans, to push nonsense. We've seen a lot of that in the following years, by judges appointed be either party.

A DOJ spokesperson on Friday said in a statement that the “court’s assertions were contrary to the facts.”

“The original redactions in the public report were made by Department attorneys, in consultation with senior members of Special Counsel Mueller’s team, prosecutors in U.S. Attorney’s Offices, and members of the Intelligence Community. In response to FOIA requests, the entire report was then reviewed by career attorneys, including different career attorneys with expertise in FOIA cases—a process in which the Attorney General played no role,” the statement said.

You claim Trump was paying to control bad press, and that was nothing to do with the election?

Yes, it was arranged before his candidacy.

That's already established when Cohen was convicted.

No, Cohen pleading guilty for some slimey deal and kickbacks, ensured nothing was established in court. This provides him more room to lie later.

I see you seem to be guessing what payments were for what and even had to add extra so the numbers not adding up would make sense.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (22 children)

Barr did not misrepresent the results,

Read my linked article.

“The Court cannot reconcile certain public representations made by Attorney General Barr with the findings in the Mueller Report,” wrote Walton, an appointee of President George W. Bush.

“The inconsistencies between Attorney General Barr’s statements, made at a time when the public did not have access to the redacted version of the Mueller Report to assess the veracity of his statements, and portions of the redacted version of the Mueller Report that conflict with those statements cause the Court to seriously question whether Attorney General Barr made a calculated attempt to influence public discourse about the Mueller Report in favor of President Trump despite certain findings in the redacted version of the Mueller Report to the contrary,” the judge added.

which found the accusations to be false.

No, it found that Trump committed crimes

Again, Barr did not make the redactions.

Again, read my link. I'm referring to the out of context releases made by Barr prior to the release of the report.

Yes, it was arranged before his candidacy.

It was paid in October 2016, a month before the election.

How long before his candidacy do you claim it was arranged?

Why did it take so long for Trump to get the payment to Daniels?

No, Cohen pleading guilty for some slimey deal and kickbacks, ensured nothing was established in court.

You'll need to show a whole lot of proof of that. He got a three years sentence, and used to be a lawyer. It's difficult to imagine what kickbacks would make that worthwhile.