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[–]passionflounderIndependent 9 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 2 fun -  (38 children)

The fact that Democrats are so rabidly against parents having any rights or say in their children's education screams volumes.

[–]LordoftheFlies 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

I mean, the Republicans have their own problems when it comes to education policy, like sperging out over sex education. (And I mean the dry facts, "this is what happens, these are the possible results, and this is how you prevent those results" variety, not the current one that encourages little kids to come out of a closet that they're not even in.)

But yeah, it's really interesting that the party whose adherents are so rabidly against the so-called "fascism" of the other party are so invested in making sure that parents aren't the ones making the decisions any more.

[–]passionflounderIndependent 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I question whether the public school classroom is the appropriate setting for sex education to begin with so I can understand a conservative objecting to a subject that is by its very nature at the center of one's moral identity. Let's not forget that our illustrious tax-funded school system is increasingly revealing its stance on things like transgender and gender identity where I say, hell no- these same granite-heads should NOT be impressing on young minds anything involving the use and maintenance of one's genitalia.

Frankly, if a young person is to reap the benefit of institutional sex education then let the medical community do it. Dry facts are best sourced from dedicated sources- let someone whose degree was earned in part through advanced anatomical education and not a blue-haired Social Justice teacher who's monitoring a health class and thinks there are more genders than Starbucks franchises. I think I'd be spurging out myself.

[–]LordoftheFlies 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The problem on the conservative side of sex ed, however, was that their alternative was abstinence programs--which worked about as well as expected around horny and curious teenagers--or pretending that sex just didn't exist.

And I'll admit that my view of sex ed is probably influenced by the fact that it was precisely the dry, factual version that I got from my school. And my educational years were long back, before this stupid shit took over.

[–]passionflounderIndependent 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Teaching abstinence should be a parent's prerogative. If schools could be trusted to stick with facts and leave moral considerations to the parents then I'd have less of an issue with it being the purview of schools but the growing track record of so-called "educators" seeking to exclude parents from the process leaves me with a resounding, "hell no!"

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (32 children)

The fact that you believe this obvious lie is informative.

Dems and everyone else want the parents to have those rights, obviously.

HR5 is also a lie - Repuglicans playing politics instead of governing - because parents ALREADY have the SAME access noted in that bill. It's the kind of stupidity that gets GOP liers elected. The GOP should do their jobs, rather than pull these stupid time-wasting stunts.

What the bill will promote is the continuation of prerents attacking teachers. This is part of the general GOP plan to fuck up the education options for kids in the US. (Well-educated people will not vote for the GOP, normally. It's part of the fascist agenda to destroy public access to a good education.)

[–]MuskyIndependent 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (28 children)

because parents ALREADY have the SAME access noted in that bill.

Then there should be no problems passing it, eh?

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (27 children)

It should not pass because it's toxic garbage, allowing 1 or 2 parents to shut down a school in administrative and legal difficulties - it's a legal mess:

https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/new-from-nea/us-vs-them-toxic-vision-parent-engagement

https://alaskabeacon.com/2023/03/09/gop-bill-mandating-federal-parents-bill-of-rights-passed-by-u-s-house-committee/

Parents have access to the same information, but not in the quick administrative micromanagement way in which the bill proposes. Those laws would effectively shut down school administration in red tape, which is why the bill has been proposed. Attacking schools in this manner part of the fascist playbook, and one of the worst decisions for our kids' futures.

[–]MuskyIndependent 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (17 children)

Pretty sure putting power in the hands of the parents is the exact opposite of fascism.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

Fascism can only develop by means of the disruption of society. We shouldn't conflate the path to fascism with the resulting fscist state. National socialists respond to the disruption they've caused.

And as I've noted: parents already have access to their children's school plans, activities, methods &c. They ust cannot immediately require administrative responses, which the bill wants to propose.

[–]MuskyIndependent 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (14 children)

That feels like an evasive answer.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

You made a false equivalence argument conflating strategies of fascist strategies for their rise to power (inc. disruption inspiring cries for order) with fascist governance (social and polical control of the 99% by the 1%). If you'd prefer a fascist governance example, look to education reforms in fascist Italy, Spain and Germany c. 1922-45. Some examples here:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/z897pbk/revision/2

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00309230.2020.1825496

https://www.britannica.com/topic/education/Nazi-Germany

https://www.theholocaustexplained.org/life-in-nazi-occupied-europe/controlling-everyday-life/controlling-education/

https://www.jstor.org/stable/40981567

None of this is difficult to grasp. There are other papers on growing fascist attacks on the education systems in the US.

Changing the history curriculum (calling it CRT, which isn't what it is), banning books, attacking teachers and school boards with insane rants about nonsense, installing Christo-fascists on school boards, etc. If you think a member of your family has become a Marxist while at school, that seems to relate to your comment history here on Saidit, where often argue that anything left of the extreme right is communist. What's happened here is that you believe the far right propaganda about this, and you are very much in a far right minority in the US. The majority of Americans understand that banning books, removing history texts, attacking teachers and schools, and passing fascist laws that push a far right agenda is indeed a growing fascist threat to the American way of living.

[–]MuskyIndependent 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

with fascist governance (social and polical control of the 99% by the 1%)

That sounds exactly like Democrats. Did you see the post here about the censorship on the r/WorldNews post regarding the Trans athlete ban? By censoring and even outright banning anyone with an opposing view to their ideology, they create a false consensus where it appears nobody disagrees, and further indoctrinates unwitting people into their ideology. It's very insidious. I don't see that happening on the right, you're clearly on the side of the fascists.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

You might know that I and many others at Saidit and in the Democratic party don't want former men, or also women born with penises, competing against women athletes, nor do we agree with all of the policies of a website that has 50 million active daily users. In Reddit's defence, they cannot be seen to unfairly discriminate against minority groups who pay lawyers to send cease & desist letters to Reddit's ISP. Reddit also likely complies with EU rules and other forms of legislation that we might not like.

But the general content policy of a website with 50 million users is unrelated to fascist statecraft, or any other form of statecraft (unless we're to discuss the nuances of this, and Saidit doesn't do nuance).

And we agree that numerous mods on Saidit are themselves fascist assholes, and for example prohibit criticism of Israel, Pakistan, China, India and other fascist countries. But that too is unrelated to statecraft.

The recent passing of HR5 is indeed fascist statecraft. It's meant to create additional difficulties for schools, specifically to make access to a good education more difficult, AND to reduce working conditions in order to hire teachers without MA degrees who can be paid less, AND especially to create disruption among the peasants while the GOP (and 2 or 3 traitor Dems) pass more laws that create additional wealth inequality, gleaning much more from the 99%.

Living and work standards for school teachers have dropped exponentially under GOP-controlled congresses. Just one example - of many - of the GOP destruction of the American Dream in the past 40 years.

[–]JewsAreOfColor 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It’s the only answer communist groomers have.

[–]JewsAreOfColor 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Any society that is disrupted by criminalizing child abuse deserves to be disrupted, and will be disrupted.

[–]MuskyIndependent 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

They have to change something, we can't sit back and let our kids be indoctrinated into Marxism and gender identity theory. That's toxic garbage.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

our kids be indoctrinated into Marxism and gender identity theory.

That's not happening, by any stretch of the imagination

(Get news from better sources)

[–]MuskyIndependent 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

(Get news from better sources)

I have a youngin who was recently indoctrinated. Am primary source.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

If you make an etic argument ('our kids be indoctrinated into...'), the evidence for it would be etic, (not emic ['am primary source'])

[–]MuskyIndependent 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

What I'm telling you is I've seen it first hand.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Not wanting to irritate you, but: 1 kid ≠ 'our kids'

[–]JewsAreOfColor 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

All the more reason the bill must Pass, and all opposition to it must be criminalized.

[–]passionflounderIndependent 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

The fact that you believe this obvious lie is informative.

The fact that you chose this type of rhetoric is also very informative. You could inquire as to why I made my conclusions but instead you chose to insinuate that I'm stupid so you'll of course forgive me for declining the opportunity to engage you in any response other than this.

[–]dicknipples 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You could inquire as to why

That's not how debate works. You made a false claim and I made a counter argument. Were I to ask you a question, that would not be a debate. I also did not refer to intelligence. I could ask you why you said, 'the fact that Democrats are so rabidly against parents....' but I know already that this is part of the far right rhetoric, even if you want to claim that it's your own experience, or part of a university research project where you've examined thousands of Democrats' poll data. But we know that your kind of statement is part of the Fox "News" disinformation propaganda 24/7 and that this has indoctrinated millions in the US to believe those GOP lies, which is the only way GOP liers can be elected. A well-educated, informed, thoughtful populace would never elect Republicans. So they must of course use a methodology that will allow 2 or 3 parents to shut down entire schools and school systems. It will benefit the GOP and help them turn the US into a Banana Republic.

[–]JewsAreOfColor 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Accusing the GOP of lying is not just psychological projection, but treason as well.

[–]JewsAreOfColor 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

From defending slavery to defending pedophilia. There really is no need to allow any opposition to the GOP after this point.