Thousands Across US Demand Reproductive Freedom on Roe's 50th Anniversary

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    [–]Alienhunter 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

    Where is my larceny freedom? Anti-theft laws are a violation of my Kleptomanic rights.

    [–]StillLessons 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

    The lines on this haven't really changed in 50 years. The university "educated" (=socialized) are trained in post-modern thought. That eliminates morality, essentially. As such, this cohort swings strongly pro-abortion, because they just want to be able to fuck when they want with no consequences. Those not so force-fed this hedonistic, amoral philosophy say, "wait a second. Isn't killing a formed human unit morally wrong? If we let nature take its course, this life continues. By intervening, doesn't that mean we're committing murder?" Neither of the two sides has an overwhelming majority, so the same lines have been fought over for a half a century.

    What I have noticed, watching this argument for decades, is that those on the pro-abortion side are deeply unhappy people. Even when they get what they want, they are still miserable and angry. Doesn't seem to be yielding the open horizons for growth they are advertising their side to provide. Instead it looks like their outcome leads to spiritually stunted people. The anti-abortion humans appear more balanced, rational, and peaceful in their interactions. This is my observation. I used to be pro-abortion. I am now anti-abortion, and increasingly more so every day.

    [–]Alienhunter 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    I'm marginally "pro" abortion. But the discourse surrounding the issue is retarded and basically pointless to engage with anymore.

    Anyone who sees abortion as a good thing and somehow not the termination of a human life is an idiot. The problem is that there are "some" cases where homicide is justified and abortion is sometimes one of those cases. But it's very circumstantial.

    We get into the weeds with it but it's not that complicated. Baby is already dead? Abortion is perfectly justified. Baby is malformed and lacks a head or something? Perfectly justified. Some kind of horrific pregnancy situation or other thing goes wrong and risks the mother's life? Perfectly justified.

    Obviously unnecessarily terminating a pregnancy is horrific, especially late in the term. Very very early after conception it's a bit different of a case and it's not so unreasonable to say, prevent the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus wall. But this is more a moral philosophical question of "when does the baby have a soul" which is as a metaphysical question not really answerable in any way that will be recognized by everyone.

    Pro-choice people like to go with the angle that it's cruel to "force a mother" to raise a baby they can't afford. I agree, which is why I think it's horrific that we live in a society where financial pressures make women choose to terminate their pregnancies. Which is why we should consider that it's in the best interest of society as a whole to remove a lot of those financial barriers for childbirth and childrearing. This does mean government programs and taxes, and the pro life people will usually agree, but many of the American political right will not.

    The main way to get abortion advocates to re evaluate their own positions though, is to serve them some duck, some egg, and some balut. Most won't have a problem with the first two. Logically people shouldn't have a problem with the third and yet, somehow, they do.

    Abortion is one of those things like Euthanasia, or even killing someone in self defense, sometimes it is the morally justifiable action to take, sometimes, rarely. There's usually a far better option that doesn't require taking a life but not always.

    [–]StillLessons 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Baby is already dead? Abortion is perfectly justified.

    While technically, this may still be an "abortion" (aborting the pregnancy), I don't think most see the term in this way. In common usage, abortion calls to mind the concept of ending a viable human life.

    In general, thanks for your thoughts. I appreciate the depth of effort you demonstrate here.

    The trouble - as you note - is not in the exceptional cases where 95% of people agree, e.g. health of the mother. Rather what creates the heat in this area of human thought is what you term "unnecessarily terminating a pregnancy". The problem is that once we normalize the practice, we are experts at rationalizations applying this practice for ever more particular reasons.

    It's about control. We all seek to control our world and "our life" and make it behave according to our plans. It never does. Period. The fundamental idea of elective abortion (not the exceptional life of mother kind) is that becoming a parent in an unplanned way "destroys" a person's life. This is an ignorant perspective. The simple truth is that an unexpected child radically changes the course of a life, but from an objective perspective, that change is neither good nor bad. It's simply different. The mother's life will not be the same life she expected in her visualized future. But that's called flexibility. In truth, very few of our visualized futures actually come to pass. Sacrificing another human life (that of the unborn) in the name of an uncertain, fuzzy, vision of "what the future should be" is killing something concrete in exchange for a potential that likely will not materialize in any case.

    Thus these people - as I noted - are deeply unhappy. They are left with the concrete guilt of knowing what they did, and yet wait... where's that "potential life" in the name of which they committed this horrific act? It doesn't come.

    I'm a believer in the normalization and absolute de-stigmatization of adoption for young unwilling mothers. If the family from which she comes is not capable of caring for the child, let the child go to a home where he or she can be raised as he or she deserves.

    What saddens me so about human nature is this incredible push by a significant portion of our population to treat potential human lives as the "possession" of the mother, for her to do with as she pleases, up to and including disposing of it. They fervently promote this, up to and including with violence. That is a tragic view of human lives in their most vulnerable phase - that of the fertilized egg up to birth.

    [–]iamonlyoneman 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    the problem is that the court pretended the lines changed 50 years ago IMO

    [–]jerkwad152 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

    Nobody's being prevented from reproducing. Many probably should be...

    [–]jamesK_3rd 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

    It's why one of the most important things we can recommend to women seeking reproductive freedom is to ensure they're up to date in COVID jabs. If you are up to date, get another one.

    [–]jerkwad152 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Ahh, took me a bit to get the joke there.

    [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    They want to kill babies.

    Also, if women get to kill babies, men should also have that right.

    I’m how women get extra family planning privileges because they have vaginas.