all 10 comments

[–]JasonCarswellVoluntaryist 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Australia, Canada, and New Zealand don't show up on those bar graphs. I guess totalitarianism is saving us.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (8 children)

I think sweden just let all their old and infirm die so now the low hanging fruit is gone and just people with good immune systems are left so covid is like a minor cold to them.

[–]StillLessons 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

Just a reminder. Even among those 80+ years old, the IFR (Infection Fatality Rate) was estimated at the end of 2020 to be ~10%. There have been some new estimates in April of this year which are increasing that, but not so much as to change my point. Let's say they've upped it to 20% (which is a huge change in numbers).

The point is the same. Even if you are already at the end of your life. Even when your immune system is going largely senescent (dormant). Even when you get the disease! Even then you are 80% likely to survive. 80% of 80+ year-olds who get Covid survive it. Just think for a second about the number of diseases which can wipe out 80+ year olds...

This disease isn't even killing the majority of the people at the end of their lives.

The exaggeration of the threat of Covid is pervasive, perverse, and entirely dangerous. This is a very dangerous pathogen. That's obvious. But treating it as "Getting Covid = Death" - for EVERYONE - is ignorant, unsubstantiated, and designed only to create fear and misery.

Fauci and his allies need to be held accountable for this.

[–]AcceleratedWallops 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Yeah lemme just go ask grandma if she wants to roll a die to see if she lives.

[–]StillLessons 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

The question is not whether she's going to live or die. She's going to die. The question is will she die in two months or two years, and which of those two is more likely given the options she faces: to vaccinate or not. My comment is not to deny the danger to grandma from this disease. But she needs to look at those numbers realistically. Telling her that if she gets covid, she is dead? That is a lie. It is a lie which is now incredibly widespread, but it is a lie nonetheless. If grandma is told that while there is a strong risk of her dying if she gets the disease, she has an even stronger likelihood of surviving it, that is an accurate portrayal of her risk, which she needs in order to honestly make a decision. The genuine misinformation is mis-stating her risk. Not surprisingly, this leads to extreme confusion, which leads to anger and pushback. Honest risk assessment requires honest risk disclosure.

[–]AcceleratedWallops 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Grandma has a higher chance of surviving bungee jumping than she does getting covid, but I don't see octogenarians doing that very often.

I think grandmas do honestly understand the risk and they aren't willing to take it. So I'm not sure what your point is here.

[–]chadwickofwv 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You should ask her the same about the risk of the vaccine. I bet she tells you she doesn't want that poison.

[–]AcceleratedWallops 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

She already took the vaccine and she's fine. There's extremely little risk in the vaccine, vs being old and getting covid.

[–]Alan_Crowe 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

How old are you? You might be romanticizing being old and frail. My priority for health care is to avoid following my parents down the care-home, dementia-unit, nursing-home route. I'm happy to roll for early escape!

[–]Alan_Crowe 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Stupid me. I've read the article now, and it turns out that the frail, old Swedes have not been dodging the care-home, dementia-unit, nursing-home hell-march :-(