You're still very much ignoring u/StillLessons excellent point - which is that if you look at what Democrats do, not what they say they'll do, they are either horribly ineffective or else they're liars, and all the years of Clinton and Obama didn't look a wit different from the Bush years in terms of war, decline in economic mobility, decline in civic institutions, and general undermining/malaise in the working class. Joe has no fucking brilliant new ideas....he's a relic of the old machinery. He has nearly 50 years of politics behind him showing what he is and what he does, and dude, he can not and will not deliver any of those vaguely nice sounding things.