Comply and live is a myth.

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[–]magnora7 14 insightful - 5 fun14 insightful - 4 fun15 insightful - 5 fun -  (47 children)

US police kill about 900 Americans every year. About 50% are white.

In Germany, police kill 0.5 people per year on average. In the UK they kill 1.3 a year on average. We have a police violence problem, and that comes back to a lack of accountability for wrongdoing, because our justice system gives police special treatment.

[–]Druullus 10 insightful - 3 fun10 insightful - 2 fun11 insightful - 3 fun -  (21 children)

...or people are allowed to defend themselves?

[–]Firstbrickwall 13 insightful - 3 fun13 insightful - 2 fun14 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Finally someone speaking the truth. Most people whining about police violence have never been in a situation where they’re facing a criminal or someone so unhinged that your own life is on the line.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (8 children)

Shooting unarmed people is never about defence. Thankfully our police isn't like this.

When i went full psycho-mode they came with 12 men and drove me into a psych ward instead of shooting me. Maybe i could have choked my ex to death otherwise.

No guns involved, because i could've snatched one.

They used plastic shields (because i'm a quite fierce guy for my weight class) instead of guns to pin me and be able to arrest me (which they then even didn't do). I wore handcuffs for like 2 minutes or so. They talked with me instead of shooting. I still don't like German police but i gotta respect them for being able to handle these kinds of situations.

There wasn't even a charge. This is what a solution to a conflict should look like.

One of the rare reasons i actually like to pay taxes.

[–]JasonCarswell 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

IMO the police are stretched FAAAAAR too wide and their tasks MUST be broken up.

We need:

NEW deescalation teams - with backup SWAT thugs and/or paramedics and/or firemen standing by in case.

NEW mental health teams.

Reform of psych wards, akin to prisons far worse than being left alone.

SWAT to be separate.

Traffic cops and ticket writers to be as separate as the postman is.

Criminal investigators, minor crimes, major crimes, and corporate crime investigators to be separate.

End the drug war and decriminalize everything.

Prosecutors and judges to be separate and independent and accountable.

Prisons to be separate and community controlled - not corporate.

etc.

MORE reforms to help the little guy. But of course they'll never do that.

[–]ReeferMadness 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

That is a massive undertaking and only works in a society with low violence. When you have 1 domestic abuse call per day or less in a city. When there are dozens it becomes untenable.

Then consider that what these officers are doing is mostly traffic stops that quickly turn violent because the person refuses to comply and thinks they can fight their way out.

Letting people like that win is not an option. That is a recipe for absolute disaster.

We can't have a kid gloves swat team at every traffic stop.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

They 'handled' me. Nothing more to add to that.

As i wrote: Without guns. So it is possible. Nobody got injured and the conflict was resolved quite quickly.

If rooms didn't have corners it might have gone south. But it didn't. Because even my kitchen has corners and you only can box against fists you see. Even the big guys never lowered their shields after they dropped the cuffs. There was mutual respect.

Involving guns would have complicated the whole situation.

Medical personnel was also quite nice. I slept it off, my ex moved out quite peacefully and i was back there the day after.

These five minutes were decisive.

[–]ReeferMadness 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You are claiming that this is comparable to the 900 shootings a year. It is absolutely not.

You are claiming that this kind of response is scalable to all the situations that may lead to violence involving police. It is absolutely not.

Guns are not the problem, violent people are. Those people are by far not temporarily mentally disturbed; they are career criminals.

You are an exception and what worked on you was an exception.

Changing society to conform to your unique situation is stupid.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Do you have any idea how competent in chemistry i am?

It is my third most liked.

What do you think what i did think when i saw a T5 van with six cops into it near my house ?

Yes. I went in there. Like a man does.

There is no fucking fleeing gene in me.

Also i'm quite hard to KO. Even if you manage to hit my head: i should add.

[–]Chipit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Oooooh...you're a violent misogynist.

Well that explains a lot.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You know exactly one night of a sever year long story and still judge me, even literally no one was hurt. Which clearly shows you are an idiot.

I just deny your allegations and since this is not your first comment like this: Nice never reading you bs again.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Maybe i could have choked my ex to death otherwise.

If that isn't the act of a violent misogynist, what is?

"Can't shake the Devil's hand then say you're only kidding"

-- They Might Be Giants, "Your Racist Friend" (1992)

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

What, you think people other places don't defend themselves? What the hell is wrong with you? You think a murderer being found out by police is going to hide his gun so they won't find the illegal weapon?

But people elsewhere don't expect to get SHOT for running a stop sign. Go figure.

[–]ReeferMadness 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

No one gets shot for running a stop. You have been brainwashed.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

I've seen it.

[–]Chipit 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

That which is claimed without evidence may be dismissed without evidence.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You don't have search engines in your neck of the woods? You're too disabled to use one? You really don't know about anything that goes on around you, do you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Walter_Scott

https://www.vox.com/identities/2020/6/9/21285536/maurice-gordon-police-shooting-explained

https://www.tmz.com/2020/09/02/new-video-shooting-dijon-kizzee-la-county-sheriff-deputies/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Javier_Ambler

Every year there are a few. Of course, the newest ones might well be psy ops, but to state "No one gets shot for running a stop" is utterly false.

[–]Chipit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Now you've changed your story. You said you'd seen it personally, now it's changed to some Wikipedia articles.

Why do I get the idea if I investigate any of these, I'll find out the perp made a sudden movement like he was going to pull out a weapon?

After the 22 minute police chase and several minor collisions, the chase ended when Ambler crashed into a tree, on a North Austin Street.

Yup, there's one.

But it isn’t until he exits the cruiser that he gets into an altercation with the officer, who shoots him six times.

And another. Boy, Vox.com sure is a credible source, isn't it? Not hard left at all.

The Sheriff's Dept. goes on to say that during the struggle, some items Kizzee was carrying fell on the ground ... one of which they claim was a handgun.

There's another one. Bonus points for using the highly credible site TMZ.com.

In December 2017, Slager was sentenced to 20 years in prison, with the judge determining the underlying offense was second-degree murder.

Justice was served.

None of these were running a stop sign. All of them ran from the police and resisted arrest. Traffic stops often result in taking dangerous criminals off the street. It's how they caught left-wing terrorist Yū Kikumura.

You don't have search engines in your neck of the woods? You're too disabled to use one? You really don't know about anything that goes on around you, do you?

These are personal insults, explicitly disallowed by Saidit rules. Moreover you made an ableist slur, which is forbidden by your own leftism.

[–]ReeferMadness 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

No you haven't. You are just dumb enough to watch a criminal try to murder a cop, have the reporter tell you he was shot for running a stop, and just believe that retarded lie.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Wow this place is really turning into a shithole as bad as reddit.

[–]Intuit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You can help bring the level of discussion up.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Don't worry, I do that a lot. But replying to trolls doesn't bring the best out of me. Go figure.

[–]Druullus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Americans are allowed to defend themselves with guns/carry guns, so American cops must deal with that, i.e. does German cops run into people with guns, or suspect it. How many of the fatalities were unjustified?

And the US s a lot more homogenous than Germany.

[–]antireddit 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

The US sees 20k to 30k murders a year. What are the murder rates in those countries? How many cops a year are murdered in those countries compared to the US? How many guns are on the streets in those countries? Guns change the equation dramatically when it comes to policing.

The US has a violence problem. Period. It always has. This includes police as well, but u cannot act like police operate in a vacuum. Everyone likes to pin all the problems on police but nobody has any viable solutions on how to address the issue other than saying police suck. The end result of all this has been people violently resisting arrest more often less competent people wanting to be police or stay on as a cop, while funding for police is now being diverted. So you'll have less competent police with less money facing an increasingly armed population with record numbers of felons being let out of prison early at a time the US is facing massive economic upheavel, and with a media that continually incites hatred of them along with racial hatred overall.

That is all going to make the problem of violence in America(the real problem), worse.

[–]CarlDung 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

US has a multi-ethnic problem. Swizerland has more weapons per capita and has no issues with crime. The problem is the people with stone age level of cognitive development.

[–]antireddit 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Well the US also has the descendants of ex slaves making up 13% of its population. Granted they were slaves a couple centuries ago but you'd never know that listening to our media, who never misses an opportunity to pick the scabs off old wounds and pour salt on them.

The end result is gonna be a break up of the US, possibly along racial lines, which at this point suits me fine. Anything is better than the shit were dealing with now.

[–]CarlDung 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Spot on. Most people have innate behavioral matrix which brings up patterns that have worked in previous generations. About 90% of europeans were farmers and 9% professional merchants / soldiers etc. while 1% were royals etc. The thing is, in europe everything needed long term planning. When to plant stuff, how to regulate your resources etc. while in africa it has been 100% of pure opportunistic savagery. They gather into gangs and prowl on the streets just like their primitive ancestors. They are incompatible with modern world and obsolete to maintain it modes of production. They consume from a closed feedback loop without putting anything back into the system. Europe is e.g. soon in ruins. Sweden has 25% immigrants and they will lose control soon.

[–]Intuit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's almost like species evolve for their environment and its particular qualities.

[–]jet199 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

99% of people in the US are descendents of ex-slaves. Don't imagine you don't have that legacy in your genes and culture too.

By great great father was bought from an orphanage in the 1910s by a minister so he could stick him down the mines and take his wages. I'd like to say I don't see the mark of that harsh world on the personalities and instincts of my family but its simply not the case.

I 100% believe black people do have that as a problem but so do most other people from lower class stock. At the end of the day in a tough world its the tough, it was the selfish people who survived and that does now jar with the nice comfortable world of the modern West.

[–]horatioherbert 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

"99% of people in the US are descendants of slaves" is completely laughable unless you are going back to the dawn of man which is equally laughable to include in this argument

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's a good thing that we despise the lower classes for being deplorable today.

[–]Intuit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think the descendants of ex-slaves here was meant as a euphemism for blacks (e.g. 13%).

[–]Djfjfjdbffj 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The violence looks celebrated to me compared to other cultures, exported through cultural exports like Hollywood.

Outside of the US we're just not that interested in fighting. Nearly every yank film has fighting. It's a bit weird.

Sorry but I just think of spaghetti westerns. hasn't really moved on much.

[–]Ergu 2 insightful - 7 fun2 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 7 fun -  (1 child)

I call bullshit, how could you kill .5 people and why would it take a whole year to do so.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Midgets are quick and slippery.

[–]ReeferMadness 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

It is true that we need reforms. The problem with BLM is they are demanding retarded reforms and turning it into a race thing. We need reforms led by intelligent, rational, and honest people. Everything BLM does seems to be designed to inflame, segregate, and destroy. Their goal is to not have any progress. Their claims are lies, police are not hunting people. Their examples are always chosen so that half the people will disagree that it was unjustified violence. The point of BLM is only to divide people and pit them against each other.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

In the current system, intelligent, rational and honest people can never attain positions where they are capable of using said attributes for the betterment of their civilization.

[–]superjesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Damn, you really like using the word 'said' like that. I like it. It really makes you sound like a "the smart kind of person" kind of person.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You are being facetious. Still, that I would be thought of as "trying to sound smart" in a language I learned relatively recently instead of "oof you sound so foreign" is a compliment. So thank you, troll.

[–]ReeferMadness 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

So you were born yesterday. 😄

[–]DisgustResponse 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Myopic take. It's much deeper than that. America is a very different culture and society compared to the UK or Germany. Lower trust, more cutthroat.

Qualified immunity is much more a reaction to the state of things than a cause.

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Also more macho all over. The women and the men.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Macho culture doesn't exist in America. You're thinking of Mexico and Latin America. That's where macho comes from.

Unless you were making a dog whistle anti-immigrant slur. Then, well played.

[–]Leo_Littlebook 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Germany doesn't have a bunch of niggers escalating the underworld's violence. Apples to oranges.

[–]asterias 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

A note about those statistics, while police in other countries rarely kill someone, that doesn't mean that they still don't have a problem with police beating innocent people or placing them under false charges and so on.

[–]magnora7 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

In the US we have a problem with police regularly killing people when they go on wellness checks

[–]Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

They divided people by race and pro-BLM or PRO-police.

[–]magnora7 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Yes they made a police misconduct issue, which affects all of us, in to a race issue. They invalidated people who are white and want police reform. They also invalidated people who are black who think all races suffer because of police misconduct, and that general police reform is needed. Instead the conversation is centered fervently around racism, thanks to the media. They successfully divided and conquered people over what should be a relatively straightforward issue.