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[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

That source is based on hearsay. Hoetll is known liar, hoaxer and fabricator. THis is not evidence for 6 million figure. I'm a little concerned on why you would think this is proof of the figure.

https://saidit.net/s/news/comments/19vs/a_principal_in_florida_said_he_couldnt_confirm/2upb

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

That source is based on hearsay. Hoetll is known liar, hoaxer and fabricator.

Actually, practically any time a political figure is quoted (eg by people in the media) you could call it "hearsay" as long as there was no video of it.

And (in contrast) if there was audio/video of this conversation you would call it edited and fabricated "by the jews!!!1"

I showed you endless photos of the holocaust and it's train system which shows it was a massive killing system for killing many millions of people, and you deny it like "photos are a jewish conspiracy theory!!1 because jews!!11"

I even show the photos are from multiple sides (eg multiple states) and they all match.

And what is your "argument?" It's essentially this: "photos ain't real !111 Because Jews !!!1"

THis is not evidence for 6 million figure. I'm a little concerned on why you would think this is proof of the figure.

That's not even why I quoted it. There's a bunch of people saying that the number 6m was commonly used for jews for religious reasons.

But in reality.. Even if that's true (that the number 6m was used a lot by jews) that's irrelevant if the estimate of 6m jews killed came from the nazis.

Btw, in your images (about how commonly the 6m number was used) you're often just quoting coincidences.

  • eg the estimated 6m population of jews in the ukraine.

  • Or in poland,

  • etc

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

And yet you use Hoetll, a known hoaxer and liar, who has lied in the past for money as proof that the 6 million figure is correct. I have provided census data and documents of Jewish emigration and camp records that prove the six million figure false. It is scientifically impossible, if we take into account the gas chamber myths. Not even modern gas chambers today could kill with such efficiency, that is excluding that they were not gas chambers but delousing chambers. Watch the banned documentary 'Probing the Holocaust,' for more information. Keep in mind I also think the deaths in Soviet Russia and during the Bolshevik reign are highl;y exaggerated as well. I do not believe 66 million, 50 million or 30 million died. Even the mainstream account of 25 million seems quite high in my opinion.

Now that does not mean Nazis did not execute Jews in what could be defined as a genocide. The Holocaust as defined as a burnt offering, is not what happened in the definition of the word.

There is proof of Jewish executions and the census data and emigration data, and camp records proof that nearly 2.5 million Jews died and up to 1 million were killed by the Nazis. My estimate is a little over 600,000 based on all the facts and figures I could compile. So, did Nazis murder innocent people? Yes. Were Jews targeted? Yes. Could you consider it a targeted genocide? Yes. Were 6 million killed? No. Did 4.5 million die in gas chambers? No.

And (in contrast) if there was audio/video of this conversation you would call it edited and fabricated "by the jews!!!1"

Nope I would not, I would watch it and take it with a grain of salt. I would then research it further until I could safely say it is a true account. Your are using the slippery slope argument and reductio ad absurdums.

I showed you endless photos of the holocaust and it's train system which shows it was a massive killing system for killing many millions of people, and you deny it like "photos are a jewish conspiracy theory!!1 because jews!!11"

Nope, this quote again is a fallacy, so I will just ignore it. You photos you showed were Jews, communists and anyone the Nazis deemed a threat, even if completely innocent in concentration and work labor camps. These photos were taken at the VERY END of the war, when Germany had a food blockade and railines to the camps were bombed. No food was coming in nor were medical supplies in a collpased German economy. They are emaciated because of typhus that killed MILLIONS. The lice hides in the cloths which Is why they took them off. I went to the Holocaust museum and they were using an allied bombed camps as evidence of bodies burned in a crematorium. They were terror bombed by the allies. But that didn't stop the very profitable holocaust industry from lying, which does a diservice to the common Jew.

I even show the photos are from multiple sides (eg multiple states) and they all match.

No you didn't. And what does it prove? It proves Nazis took Jews and others away from there homes and put them in concentration camps. Probably executing hundreds of thousands via work orders over the years. That is what those pictures prove. They do not prove the six million figure.

And what is your "argument?" It's essentially this: "photos ain't real !111 Because Jews !!!1"

That's not my argument ^ ^ ^ Another fallacy by you. I will also ignore this quote as well.

That's not even why I quoted it. There's a bunch of people saying that the number 6m was commonly used for jews for religious reasons.

Well, these people only used media references but many politicans and communists in Bolshevik Russia also used the holocaust and 6 million figure burnt offering well before WW2. That of course, I don't really get into, because it proves little. Facts and figures prove the six million figure to be a lie nonetheless, but clearly 2.5 million Jews died in my estimate.

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

It's circular reasoning to say someone is "hoaxer" is evidence that their claims are a hoax. Your 'argument' here could be endless historic events where you just declare the people quoted to be hoax selling liars.

Your assumptions about how fast the nazis may have killed people are not relevant. Even if "modern" gas chambers work extremely slow, that doesn't mean a government couldn't build a much quicker system for killing many millions of people.

You're going on and on, but all you have is assumptions that you seem to believe are evidence of your other assumptions.

And your motive here, to say anything to get people to reject the holocaust, is obvious. So you attempt to show signs of "moderation" as if that hides that you are just another holocaust denier.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Hearsay is hearsay. That's where the six million figure originated. Census data does not back it up.

I don't assume anything. I looked at all the reports, census data, Jewish emigration data, camp work orders, etc,. And could not even come close to the six million figure. You mind sharing proof and physical evidence of this figure and/or debunk my posts above?

Clearly you assume the figure, I don't assume anything. My research has led me to a different conclusion.

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Your "research" is assuming the nazi's work orders accurately showed how many people they killed when (in reality) their goal was to hide these events. You are just making assumptions.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And census data and all the other hindreds of population reports.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Holocaust implies burnt offering. Did 6 million Jews die in a burnt offering? No. I'm not denying a genocide, I'm wuestioning the figures, and they're wrong. Truth fears no investigation. My research led me to this truth and one can be imprisoned for it. Revisionists were detained and imprisoned for questioning these figures only to be right thriry years later.

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Holocaust implies burnt offering

You've been totally misinformed, please read this:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-word-holocaust-history-and-meaning_n_1229043

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

The original meaning was burnt offering and was used as such by the Bolsheviks and Soviet propganda official during the war before any real provable assertions coupd be made. Yes it changed over time, but the use of it is wrong.

It should be called a genocide.

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

as such by the Bolsheviks and Soviet propganda official during the war before any real provable assertions coupd be made.

Did you not read the article I sent you?

  • The lower-case “holocaust” has described the violent deaths of large groups of people probably since the 18th century, according the Oxford English Dictionary. Before World War II, the word was used by Winston Churchill and others to refer to the genocide of Armenians during World War I.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-word-holocaust-history-and-meaning_n_1229043

And census data and all the other hindreds of population reports.

All the population data from the nazi regime should be treated with great skepticism. And even if there was population data from other sources (before and after the nazi regime) which showed the jewish population shrinking was less than 6m there could be many other reasons for that, plus sometimes the population estimates are just flat out wrong. eg if the jewish people felt they were victims of prejudice (eg in pre ww2 germany) they might not have sought to be very public about their presence, especially to the government & ruling class.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Okay, well we will agree to disagree on the six million figure. Through 5 years of research I could find no proof for the 6 million figure only hearsay from known liars. The proof I found was not of a genocide deniers pleasure in discovering a revisionist history, no, I simply looked through population and emigration reports, camp records from the Germans and Soviets, and Switzerland, census data on detained Jews, etc, and so, I like other revisionists came to the figure 2.5 million and nearly 1 million who were exterminated and executed by the Nazis and to a lesser extent the Soviets. That is 5 years of research and I tried very hard to prove that 6 million died, this just isn't the case. I based this for a long time on the 4.5 million gassed figure which was propagandized for thirty years before mainstream scholars had to lower the number by three fold, and in some cases 5 fold in various camps, which might have been delousing chambers to begin with. SInce we can't trust most sources and there are estimates that are under and over exaggerated, I researched these claims. And I, personally came to a 2.5 million figure.

Now as for the original definition of the Holocaust. Your source says the lower-case “holocaust” has described the violent deaths of large groups of people probably since the 18th century.

So, they certainly are not sure when this definition was used for other purposes. Though they have an idea.

It should be noted that a holocaust is a religious animal sacrifice that is completely consumed by fire. The word derives from the Ancient Greek holokaustos, "whole" and καυστός "burnt", with rough breathing), which is used solely for one of the major forms of sacrifice, "burnt offering" in Ancient Israel.

A "burnt offering" – from the verb "to cause to ascend," hence "burn") is a type of Biblical sacrifice in which the entire sacrifice is completely burnt, consumed totally by fire. It was used by the ancient Israelites. And might have been used for this genocide to denote a sacrafice of Jews for the founding of Israel, as biblical prophecy. It isn't too crazy to say this considering many Zionists, even those who were Nazis, were quite outspoken in advocating for a major pogrom or war that would push the Jewish diaspora eastward towards Israel, exactly what happened. Hitler in fact claims in Mein Kampf that Zionism was a great ideology, for obvious reasons.

So, they make it know in their memiors that a suffering must take place, and that antisemities must be our friends. The suffering and death had to take place according to them.

[–]Anticapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Your source says the lower-case “holocaust”

Don't try to save face- the word holocaust was used before the nazi holocaust.

research

You're repeating the same things I debunked already.

eg:

  • you look at the biased population estimates of people bigoted against jews, when jews may have not been properly reporting their population.

  • you simply accuse people who use higher estimates (and of quoting high estimates) of being liars & hoaxers.

  • you act like the nazis (who were hiding a genocide) would have given you the data for your "research."

Sigh.