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[–]Musky 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Gender reassignment surgery has been around, but we have never had a transgender fad, or so many organizations and institutions push kids towards transgenderism before. We can see the trend, I believe, already beginning in the r/detrans subscriber count.

Sterilization doesn't have to be a part of that.

Sometimes it's just lopping off a nice pair of breasts or adding ridiculous looking fake breasts to a man.

You didn't answer my question.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

It would be a pity, and vanishingly unlikely.

Do you feel bad now, that lives are being saved and mental states improved by transitioning, for advocating against it?

[–]Musky 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

That's not settled science transitioning actually helps, and it doesn't take into account the more recent fad aspect to it.

The NHS says it's a phase for most kids. WebMD even has an article about issues with transitioning: Doctors Have Failed Them, Say Those Who Regret Transitioning

there is growing concern among many doctors and other healthcare professionals as to whether this is, in fact, the best way to proceed for those under aged 18, in particular, with several countries pulling back on medical treatment and instead emphasizing psychotherapy first.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The NHS says it's a phase for most kids.

That's why no one transitions kids.

WebMD even has an article about issues with transitioning: Doctors Have Failed Them, Say Those Who Regret Transitioning

A small minority of people should not have transitioned. They were misdiagnosed.

About 97% of people who transition are happy with the decision. It would be better to do better, and I suspect that we are doing better than we have in the past.

But the figures don't support the argument that transitioning is wrong. It is right in the vast majority of cases.

(https://www.gendergp.com/detransition-facts/)

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Hello. I like your posts and comments. But you're wrong this time.

That's why no one transitions kids.

Then why is there such thing as a pediatric gender clinic?

Have you seen Jazz Jennings's reality show? Have you heard of Kai? Or the famous trans kid runway model? Kids are transitioned as young as 3 years old, and medical interventions (puberty blockers are the first one) can start as soon as 11. To get a masectomy, you have to be at least 15. Jazz Jennings received sexual reassignment surgery (the genital surgery) at 16 and it required 4 revisions because not enough penile tissue grew due to the effects of puberty blockers.

detransition

When they take surveys on people who have transitioned to see who is happy with it, if they can no longer get in contact with the person, they exclude that data. That means that every person who commits suicide after transition is not counted, and countless others, happy or not, may choose not to take the survey, or if their contact information is outdated or not recorded, they aren't part of the survey.

I really think you should listen to the stories of detransitioners. You'll hear that many of them are homosexuals who suffered with extremely homophobic families. This is particularly relevant with children, as their parents are the ones making the decisions. When a parent sees signs that a child will grow up to be gay or lesbian, they can choose to interpret those signs as signs a child will "grow up to be trans". The parents may be homophobic, in the case of Kai, whose parents openly admitted to beating him for being feminine.

These people are particularly damaged and I don't agree with their views on everything, but listen to their personal stories, and note the theme of external and internalized homophobia.

https://www.youtube.com/@shifterofshape

https://www.youtube.com/@kcmiller1225

You can also check out r/detrans, which has been sanitized in the past year or so, but still has decent content.

Buck Angel is a very reasonable FTM trans person who speaks out against child transition.

Unfortunately, it's happening. And it's happening to gay and lesbian children.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Then why is there such thing as a pediatric gender clinic?

Because Children can have gender disphoria.

Kids are transitioned as young as 3 years old,

Right. When I said "no one transitions kids", I didn't mean social transitioning. Kids do that.

and medical interventions (puberty blockers are the first one) can start as soon as 11

Puberty blockers are to delay puberty so that they don't have to do gender affirming hormone treatment or gender affirming surgery on a kid.

Jazz Jennings received sexual reassignment surgery (the genital surgery) at 16 and it required 4 revisions because not enough penile tissue grew due to the effects of puberty blockers.

That's unusually young to be allowed genital reassignment surgery. Guidelines where I am are 18. But it seems in that case they were pretty confident of the psychology, and they seem to have gotten it right.

That means that every person who commits suicide after transition is not counted, and countless others, happy or not, may choose not to take the survey, or if their contact information is outdated or not recorded, they aren't part of the survey.

It would be more complete if they surveyed the dead as well. But, given that you can't do that, the about ~97% of living trans people is still overwhelming.

I really think you should listen to the stories of detransitioners. You'll hear that many of them are homosexuals who suffered with extremely homophobic families.

It's important not to make that mistake when you're doing diagnosis. If someone has an extremely homophobic family you need to be especially cautious. Mistakes have, indeed, been made.

But the other 97% were correctly diagnosed, and are happier, have fewer mental issues, and kill themselves less because of the treatments that we have for that diagnosis.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

So you're acknowledging that children do indeed transition and even receive sexual reassignment surgery? They can also receive hormone treatments in their teens, and puberty blockers are part of transition. Also, social transition from a young age, especially as young as THREE, makes a person more likely to continue down the path of full medical transition, and so it takes people down that path who would have otherwise desisted. Every gay and lesbian child experiences gender dysphoria, and it generally improves greatly when they learn that other homosexuals exist, and can join a community of people like themselves and become comfortable in their identity as gay or lesbian.

Puberty blockers are to delay puberty so that they don't have to do gender affirming hormone treatment or gender affirming surgery on a kid.

You're wrong about this one too. For one, they can and do still give hormones and surgery to kids.

Puberty blockers lower the IQ of children and harm physical development in other ways. Puberty blockers for males make sexual reassignment surgery extremely difficult because to be frank, it gives you a micropenis and there's not enough tissue to construct the neovagina.

And puberty can not be "delayed". You don't get those years back. If a kid takes puberty blockers for two or three years and then desists, they will still end up underdeveloped.

But it seems in that case (Jazz Jennings) they were pretty confident of the psychology, and they seem to have gotten it right.

Perhaps you haven't seen the show (I don't blame you, reality shows are trashy), but Jazz Jennings is in extremely poor health, both physically and especially mentally. We can imagine a world where Jazz Jennings is a happy gay adult instead of a suicidal transsexual who has never experienced sexual arousal, much less orgasm, and has neurological and psychiatric issues along with severe morbid obesity and an array of other physical health problems.

---- All the signs that Jazz and other male "trans kids" display are actually signs of being gay. Being extremely girly as children and getting along considerably better with girls because they're psychologically more similar are signs of being gay. It doesn't mean that they need to become trans.

It would be more complete if they surveyed the dead as well. But, given that you can't do that, the about ~97% of living trans people is still overwhelming.

You really don't see the issue with excluding people who commit suicide from a study about people's satisfaction with something that is supposed to improve their mental health? Especially since suicide is the #1 talking point used to convince parents to start their kids on that path in the first place?

It's important not to make that mistake when you're doing diagnosis. If someone has an extremely homophobic family you need to be especially cautious. Mistakes have, indeed, been made.

Homophobia isn't the only reason that homosexuals experience gender dysphoria, and if you're arguing that everyone with gender dysphoria should transition, that includes every single homosexual with vanishingly few exceptions, especially if you're arguing that it's okay for them to start the process in childhood.

But the other 97% were correctly diagnosed, and are happier, have fewer mental issues, and kill themselves less because of the treatments that we have for that diagnosis.

The claim that they kill themselves less is completely baseless, especially considering you're making it in the same sentence that you use a statistic where suicides were excluded.

edit: ----

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Lives are not being saved by transitioning.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

How come they are in the UK?

https://www.emerald.com/insight/content/doi/10.1108/MHRJ-05-2014-0015/full/html

The study revealed high rates of suicidal ideation (84 per cent lifetime prevalence) and attempted suicide (48 per cent lifetime prevalence) within this sample. A supportive environment for social transition and timely access to gender reassignment, for those who required it, emerged as key protective factors.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

If social transition is what's most important to these people then they are just confused by internalized sexism. This clouds all the data about real transitioning.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If social transition is what's most important to these people then they are just confused by internalized sexism.

Agreed. But it's not. [A]nd timely access to gender reassignment