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[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 5 fun1 insightful - 4 fun2 insightful - 5 fun -  (10 children)

I agree - really jarring it is. There were several eugenics journals in the 19th and the early 20th century, and numerous books about eugenics. Social Darwinism developed toward the end of the 19th century, though did not reflect Charles Darwin's personal views, as he was not directly in favor of eugenics (as he had enough trouble fending off criticism that he'd reduced God's humanity to the primitive world of ape descendents). In any event, these ladies were interested in science, which is why they also agreed with eugenics. (Since the 1930s much better reseach has shown that there is no scienticific basis, justification or method for assessing eugenics research.)

[–]AidsVictim69 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

(Since the 1930s much better reseach has shown that there is no scienticific basis, justification or method for assessing eugenics research.)

I'm not even sure what this means. Research has shown that people with downs syndrome actually have an equal chance for having healthy children? That low IQ parents have the same chance to produce normal IQ children as high IQ parents? That schizophrenia doesn't have a strong link to inheritance?

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 4 fun1 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 4 fun -  (8 children)

Reasons for for my comment include the following:

...regardless of whether negative or positive [eugenics] policies are used, they are susceptible to abuse because the genetic selection criteria are determined by whichever group has political power at the time. Furthermore, many criticize negative eugenics in particular as a violation of basic human rights, seen since 1968's Proclamation of Tehran as including the right to reproduce. Another criticism is that eugenics policies eventually lead to a loss of genetic diversity, thereby resulting in inbreeding depression due to a loss of genetic variation. Yet another criticism of contemporary eugenics policies is that they propose to permanently and artificially disrupt millions of years of evolution, and that attempting to create genetic lines "clean" of "disorders" can have far-reaching ancillary downstream effects in the genetic ecology, including negative effects on immunity and on species resilience. source

(AKA: scientific attempts to breed a master race don't work)

[–]YORAMRWWhite nationalist, eugenicist 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

regardless of whether negative or positive [eugenics] policies are used, they are susceptible to abuse because the genetic selection criteria are determined by whichever group has political power at the time.

This is a very common lolbert talking point. The same tactical nihilism you anti-eugenicists apply to eugenics could just as well be applied to any type of policy backed by state power. The eugenics example of this argument with some other examples to put it into perspective:

  • "Using state power to implement eugenics that promotes traits we deem good and selects against traits we deem bad is dangerous and hypocritical, because that would justify our enemies using state power to implement eugenics that promotes traits we deem bad and selects against traits we deem good if they ever take over the state from us in the future!"

  • "Using state power to prohibit, restrict or deplatform white nationalist groups is dangerous and hypocritical, because that would justify white nationalists using state power to prohibit, restrict or deplatform antifa and BLM if they ever take over the state from us in the future!" (something someone who's on your side or is a concern troll who pretends to be on your side might say)

  • "Using state power to sentence rapists and serial killers to death is dangerous and hypocritical, because that would justify rapists and serial killers using state power to sentence people who hate rapists and serial killers to death if they ever take over the state from us in the future!"

Of course, this lolbert argument is totally ridiculous and has no bearing in practical reality, since any serious politicians and elites who genuinely want to enact certain policies will do everything they can to achieve this, regardless of whether their opponents are as fanatical as themselves (such as people like me) or whether they are lolbert cucks and boomer cuckservatives who refuse to play their enemies' game because "muh principles" (hence why they will always lose out against their more machiavellian opponents).

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Furthermore, many criticize negative eugenics in particular as a violation of basic human rights, seen since 1968's Proclamation of Tehran as including the right to reproduce.

LOL, the same "human rights" council that considers any form of "racism", prohibiting fags from adopting and molesting children, or pointing out that MTF trannies will never be real women "human rights abuses". Also, in a lot of countries, including the Netherlands, people who are more severely mentally disabled (around sub-75 IQ) are already de facto prohibited from reproducing, and in the rare occasion they decide to reproduce regardless the child is usually forcibly taken away and put up for adoption. So a lot of countries, the Netherlands included, already have a form of eugenics, albeit an extremely soft one. Maybe you can go cry crocodile tears at the UN "human rights" council and set up a petition for "free love for the retards" or something.

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Another criticism is that eugenics policies eventually lead to a loss of genetic diversity, thereby resulting in inbreeding depression due to a loss of genetic variation.

Eugenics doesn't lead to a loss of diversity and inbreeding, you disingenuous prick. Inbreeding depression only occurs when you have a tiny, isolated population of less than 100 000 people, which definitely isn't the case with eugenics, as it would only prohibit a small minority of the population from reproducing and would allow for any genetic traits not deemed dysgenic to continue spreading.

The only way eugenics could cause issues with loss of genetic diversity and inbreeding would be if it was done in a similar way as how dogs were bred for specific traits, forcing generations of people with certain traits to mate with their siblings and cousins just because they also posess those traits, but that's a woke leftist strawman definition of eugenics that has no bearing in reality regarding the ways in which eugenics has actually been historically practiced from the late 19th century up to around the 1970s.

Actual eugenics in the way almost all eugenicists historically advocated for and how it was actually practiced is totally alien from your ridiculous strawman conception of eugenics as "breeding humans like dogs", instead it just seeks to prohibit a minority of the population with traits deemed dysgenic from reproducing and to positively incentivize a minority of the population with traits deemed good to reproduce the most.

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Yet another criticism of contemporary eugenics policies is that they propose to permanently and artificially disrupt millions of years of evolution

If you're truly that concerned about millions of years of evolution being "artificially disrupted", you should be very upset at the fact that governments are, through incentives like non-discriminatory (or even low-income specific) child benefits and foreign aid to Africa, artificially enabling (or even rewarding) specifically the low-IQ and mentally ill in our societies to shit out as many babies as they want to like rabbits, instead of just letting them undergo sterilization but allowing to them keep their welfare in exchange. Many of those low-IQ and mentally ill people either would've had way smaller families or simply would've died off before the industrial revolution, but now that we have eugenics it would just be cruel to let them die off if we can also achieve the same outcome by simply paying them to get themselves sterilized.

But of course, you have no problem with that type of (actual) artificial disruption of evolution (dysgenics), you only have a problem with our type, the one that would actually improve and benefit humanity (eugenics). Whenever people (like yourself) insist we actively encourage and incentivize the dumbest, ugliest, weakest and most mentally ill members of society to reproduce the most, it's either ignored or applauded by Jewish leftists and other bioleninists (like yourself), but when people (like me) insist we do the opposite and actively encourage and incentivize the smartest, most attractive, strongest and most mentally stable members of society to reproduce the most, it's considered evil nazism and we're told that it wouldn't work and would "artificially disrupt" millions of years of evolution.

Also, if eugenics in favor of traits deemed positive would supposedly "artificially disrupt" millions of years of evolution, then by your own logic, so would any natural evolutionary selection pressures that had/have similar effects on humans (such as the selection pressure the Ice Age had on the humans that left Africa for Europe and eventually became modern-day whites), so this would mean evolution itself "artificially disrupts" millions of years of prior evolution, making your argument self-refuting.

[–]block_socks 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You just BTFO'd that cretinous imbecile.

I mean, look at this shit that he posts:

Yet another criticism of contemporary eugenics policies is that they propose to permanently and artificially disrupt millions of years of evolution

As if multiracialism doesn't do the exact same thing, except without any positive outcome? Literally nobody thinks of Brazilians as some kind of master race... though they're very easy to think of as totally subhuman. Nobody wants to immigrate to Brazil—the result of understanding that on an implicit level.

Eugenics has existed in some form at least as far back as Sparta, and its contemporary unpopularity is simply the result of the prevailing slave morality which glorifies mediocrity, despises excellence, and is fearful of any attempt to improve the state of Man; that is, because degenerate humans have good reason to fear that they themselves will disbenefit from it.

Ask yourself why 'socks' and other Leftists fear eugenics? Yeah, it's because they realized that they'd be on the losing end of it, whereas the idiot suffragettes probably thought (hilariously) that they would end up on the winning side. But feminism is obviously regressive, and so its adherents clearly belong on the losing side. They had to double-down on slave morality upon realizing that.

Unfortunately, the bad always outnumber the good, which is why regression is winning. Too many idiots drag the few geniuses down to their level.

One would never think that the average American once had a three-digit IQ given the state of the average American in 2021, because the 'average American in 2021' now seems exceedingly to be some weird combination of obese, mentally ill, brown, pansexual and trans. That is, the end result of rapid dysgenics. The American of 1921 would not recognize the filth of today as being worthy of inheriting their legacy.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

What's your other account name? Why did you create this account 23 days ago? To support your other comments? Rather cowardly, isn't it?

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

you disingenuous prick.

Why go to the trouble of writing this while making insulting comments? Are you not confident in what you write? Do you know the definition of 'disingenuous'? Do you really want to lower the discourse while you make your arguments? Do you think anyone will take you seriously when you do this? (No, they won't.)

It amazes me the lengths to which people will go to try to justify the recent rise in "scientific" racism. I see that they are very serious about it and have a substantial, which is doubly worrying. Comments like these help me learn about the resurgence of interests in eugenics (but at the cost of dealing with insults from insecure people). Individual concerns about marrying only within one's ethnic or local group date back millenia, for many ethnicities. That's a social and family development, and not scientiic. My concern is that recent racists want to claim that they use science for their arguments, based on two essays. But scientific evidence shows that this leads to inbreeding and serious social problems, and there are numerous examples of this. The other problem is that those who favor the resurgence of eugenics are now primarily arguing for the hatred and removal of (or distancing of) the 'other' - to breed a better race - rather than for 'science' and 'humanity', both of which support the opposite approaches to the 'other', that the mixing of people has made them smarter, more resiliant, and more attractive (and I know many on DAR who will vociferously argue against these last three words, and thus have differing views on the two essays by two so-called academics that try to argue against this, when almost all other academics refute these claims, on scientific bases).

[–]YORAMRWWhite nationalist, eugenicist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Why go to the trouble of writing this while making insulting comments? Are you not confident in what you write? Do you know the definition of 'disingenuous'? Do you really want to lower the discourse while you make your arguments? Do you think anyone will take you seriously when you do this? (No, they won't.)

Of course that's the only thing in my reply you're focusing on, instead of focusing on the actual substance of it, because you can't come up with any rational arguments of your own. This is tone policing by the way, and thus a Rule 2 violation on this sub, considering you yourself are all about people following the rules. Me throwing insults in at you in my reply has nothing to do with confidence, I do this because pathological liars and sophists like you require this in order for the arguments to get through your head, since you clearly aren't responisive to logic and reason on its own.

Judging by the amount of likes my reply verus your reply has gotten so far, I'm clearly the one that's being taken more seriously than you here, and almost any white person who has ever had biology classes (except for a small minority of brainwashed woke anti-white Reddit freaks like you) would definitely take my side regarding eugenics when presented both of our sets of arguments, as any sane person who has any grasp of evolution would simply have to lie to himsels to deny that I'm right on this.

And yes, "disingenuous" is actually a perfect description for someone who falsely claims that there's a risk of inbreeding depression with a population of millions of people just because some pathological traits have been removed from it, whereas in reality all scientific evidence suggests inbreeding depression can only occur without any deliberate actions of incest in very small, isolated populations of a couple of thousand people or less.

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It amazes me the lengths to which people will go to try to justify the recent rise in "scientific" racism. I see that they are very serious about it and have a substantial, which is doubly worrying. Comments like these help me learn about the resurgence of interests in eugenics (but at the cost of dealing with insults from insecure people).

That was a long-winded way of telling us we're living in your minds rent-free. We were already aware of the fact that the alt-right lives in everyone's minds rent-free nowadays, even more so in the minds of woke anti-white leftists and shitlibs like you, but thanks for the additional confirmation. Keep coping and seething. ;)

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The other problem is that those who favor the resurgence of eugenics are now primarily arguing for the hatred and removal of (or distancing of) the 'other' - to breed a better race - rather than for 'science' and 'humanity'

My support for eugenics has never been about hatred, or at least not primarily, it's about improving the white race, and by extension humanity as a whole, and about creating a safer, more prosperous and more socially cohesive future for my people and humanity in general. If you've actually paid any attention to my statements (including my previous reply to you) on eugenics from the past couple of years, you'd have known that I regularly talk about how I'm of the opinion that those who shouldn't be allowed to reproduce (the dumb, the weak, the ugly, the disabled, the mentally ill, etc.) should still be taken care of by the government, should still retain most of their other rights and freedoms (except for the right to vote and actively participate in politics), and should still be treated with respect by the rest of society. I do hate anti-whites (regardless of whether they're white themselves, Jewish or non-white) with a burning passion though, and they are obviously among the first who should be considered for forced sterilization under any eugenics policy.

PS: Furthermore, anti-eugenicists (like you) are on the same level of either delusional insanity or pathological lying for political purposes as flat earthers, young earth creationists and people who unironically claim 2 + 2 = 5, the only difference being that your lie/delusion is currently backed with money, propaganda, censorship and violence by the ruling elites, whereas the other lies/delusions aren't. So I sincerely hope that one day, once we've managed to remove the current elites, and your pro-dysgenics/anti-eugenics (bioleninist) shilling doesn't have any institutional support anymore, we can just simply neuter you, put you away in an insane asylum together with the other woke Reddit freaks, and be done with it, for the betterment of the rest of society.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Of course that's the only thing in my reply you're focusing on

Did you read the rest of my response?

it's about improving the white race, and by extension humanity as a whole, and about creating a safer, more prosperous and more socially cohesive future for my people and humanity in general.

Read about other attempts to do this with other groups of people and why it didn't work very well. Also search for: Steven Pinker Ashkenazim . He's wrong on many levels, but because the news media and many academic institutions are controlled by Ashkenazim, they're not going to challenge themselves to think about how wrong they are. Here they are crying over spilt milk: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/05/14/bret-stephens-new-york-times-outrage-backlash-256494

[–]AidsVictim69 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

But scientific evidence shows that this leads to inbreeding and serious social problems, and there are numerous examples of this.

Eugenics is against inbreeding. Inbreeding is usually caused by cousin marriage in real world populations and has nothing to do with eugenics outside some retarded strawman you've probably concocted in your head.

that the mixing of people has made them smarter, more resiliant, and more attractive

Did it? Funny all the mixed people I live near are uglier, stupider, and more impulsively violent than their unfortunate monoracial ancestors. I guess their IQ scores, crime statistics, and mirrors are lying about it though. I can't think of a single result of mixing European and other racial/ethnic groups where the average was an improvement.

Here's a liberal science devotee saying the obvious though https://twitter.com/richarddawkins/status/1228943686953664512?lang=en