Anatoly Karlin knocks it out of the park, documenting the complete degeneration of the US military

submitted by casparvoneverecBig tiddy respecter from self.debatealtright

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[–]Lugger 5 insightful - 4 fun5 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 4 fun -  (12 children)

Those "U.S. military is a piss poor fighting force" copes are such amusing rants to read.

Imagine a conflict with Iran or Russia

Yet despite these facts, the US military is suffering a potent recruit shortage.

It's not hard to imagine what the situation is going to be if a major war breaks out ... Recruitment would probably collapse to zero ...

Really? I don't think so. Keep in mind that Russian and Iranian militaries are total jokes with poorly trained troops, equally poor leadership both on lower (squad/platoon/company) and higher (regiment/division/et cetera) levels and garbage-tier combat gear (though this one is a little bit less prominent in Russian case).

If anything, should America clash with any of those countries, the U.S. military would be annihilating them so quickly and effectively the morale would skyrocket to unbelievably high levels and attract even more young men to join the ranks.

I can see blacks and women simply running away from the line of action and blacks selling their equipment to the black market for some ganja.

Partly agree on the women, because it's been proven that cowardly f*moids who join the military bail out via pregnancy or other means as soon as it gets hot, but blacks? Unlikely.

I can, however, imagine masses of Iraninan and Russian conscripts deserting in droves as they face a much more technologically superior and competent foe.

A similar scenario happened during the fall of Mosul in 2014.

LMAO, you've just described what awaits those pathetic Iranian and Russian armies, although on a much greater scale because a bunch of sandal-wearing ISIS weaklings is hardly the same as expeditionary forces of superbly trained warriors with state-of-the-art weaponry.

The Russian and Iranian militaries aren't far from such a scenario. I can see this happening in Iraq during an Iranian invasion or a battle with Russia in Ukraine or the Baltics.

Fixed that for you. No need to thank me.

[–]TheJamesRocket 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (6 children)

You again? It seems you didn't learn your lesson from last time.

Keep in mind that Russian and Iranian militaries are total jokes with poorly trained troops, equally poor leadership both on lower (squad/platoon/company) and higher (regiment/division/et cetera) levels and garbage-tier combat gear (though this one is a little bit less prominent in Russian case).

Your confident diagnosis of Russian military incompetence is undermined by the results of a recent wargame by Poland. In this exercise, they suffered a crushing defeat at the hands of the Russians. Heres a snippet:

''By the fifth day of the mock conflict, Russian troops had reached the Polish defensive line along the Vistula River, while fighting to take Warsaw. Poland’s navy and air force faced complete obliteration and ceased to exist. Front-line Polish army units faced the loss of between 60 and 80 percent of their equipment. Russia obtained complete victory within five days.''

This wargame by Poland was organised in response to an exercise between Russia and Belarus several months earlier. The Russians are far more formidable than you give them credit. It is unwise to underestimate them.

I can, however, imagine masses of Iraninan and Russian conscripts deserting in droves as they face a much more technologically superior and competent foe.

Thats nonsense. Wishful thinking at its worst. When it comes to national willingness to fight, Russia scores significantly higher than the U.S.A. Gallup did an international survey a few years ago, in order to determine what percentage of the population from each country was willing to fight. Here are the results: China, 71%. Russia, 59%. Poland, 47%. United States, 44%.

If we accept this data as a reasonable proxy for morale (and there should be a correlation here,although not a perfect one), then we are led to the conclusion that Russian troops would have higher morale than American soldiers. If these nations go to war, and the fighting is not resolved quickly, then we would expect to see the U.S military disintegrate before the Russian military does.

LMAO, you've just described what awaits those pathetic Iranian and Russian armies, although on a much greater scale because a bunch of sandal-wearing ISIS weaklings is hardly the same as expeditionary forces of superbly trained warriors with state-of-the-art weaponry.

Again, you are engaging in wishful thinking. If you think the U.S. military is going to score a quick and easy victory against either Iran or Russia, then you are going to be very dissapointed. You come off as the sort of person who fetishises the U.S. military, and has an inadequate grasp of military history. You said alot of things about the Iranian military during its war with Iraq that were blatantly untrue. You really need to do some more reading about the current state of the U.S. military. This article will help give you a quick rundown.

[–]Lugger 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Again you jump in to shit on the U.S. military?

Well-well, what do we have here now?...

Let's see.

Your confident diagnosis of Russian military incompetence is undermined by the results of a recent wargame by Poland. ...

Bro, you've just put a gorillion of words in my mouth and completely misinterpreted my stance on the Russian army. I never denied they would be able to defeat goddamn Poland. Frankly, every single European military (except for France... perhaps) is a complete shitshow, and even something as incompetent as Russian army would have a chance of crushing them by the force of sheer numbers alone — Russia has a lot of cannon fodder in the form of conscripts to throw at Polish/German/British/whatever guns.

But on the other hand, poor perfomance of Russian units in the Eastern Ukraine and a high number of casualties infincted on them by the Ukrainians of all the people makes me wonder if sheer numbers are enough for these incompetent buffoons to pose a threat to any country with a military that's not a shit-stained, fully stuck in the Soviet era in terms of training and technology bunch of cowboys like the Ukrainian army was.

Thats nonsense. Wishful thinking at its worst...

Is it, though? You're forgetting that the willingness to fight right now is not the same as the state of the morale when your army is getting completely obliterated and suffers one humiliating defeat after another — and this is what awaits the Russians should they clash with Americans.

Again, you are engaging in wishful thinking. If you think the U.S. military is going to score a quick and easy victory against either Iran or Russia, then you are going to be very dissapointed.

Easy victory? Yes and yes.

Quick victory?

Against Iran? Yes.

Against Russia? No. Bro, I never said that, you're putting words in my mouth again. What I said was that the U.S. would have no problems crushing the Russians effectively and relatively effortlessly, but it's still gonna take time purely because of their high number of active troops.

You said alot of things about the Iranian military during its war with Iraq that were blatantly untrue.

What was it I said about the Iranians that was untrue? That they used child soldiers on the frontlies? That they used human wave tactics? That they haven't improved much since and serve as a typical example of a crappy third world army?

And while we're at it, I'm going to address right here your another comment you dedicated exclusively to me (lol)

He is an uninformed individual with a warped view of the U.S. militarys strength

My knowledge on the U.S. military is based first and foremost on the fact that it has perfomed extremely well in every single conflict it took part in — unlike the Russians and Iranians.

Lugger is a jingoist

Wat? Are u even serious?

I have previously debunked

If you say so :D

Please do not upvote his content, as this merely encourages him to continue.

LMAO, imagine thinking I write my comments for imaginary internet points on a half-empty website. Just imagine thinking that.

[–]SoylentCapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

If these nations go to war, and the fighting is not resolved quickly, then we would expect to see the U.S military disintegrate before the Russian military does.

This would never happen even if Russia has more morale. United States has better tech and numerical superiority in terms of manpower. Russia has less than half the amount of aircraft the U.S. does.

[–]casparvoneverecBig tiddy respecter[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2020/06/07/before-donald-trump-russia-needed-60-hours-to-beat-nato-now-moscow-could-win-much-faster/?sh=104e51950620

[–]SoylentCapitalist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Did you read it? This article is only talking about the very limited troops stationed in Baltics/Europe.

But instead of growing its force in Europe, the U.S. Army under Trump looks set to shrink its European presence. NATO’s eastern members are likely to be more vulnerable after the cuts. As the American army in Europe withers, Russia might not need 60 hours to occupy the Baltics. It likely could complete its takeover much faster.

[–]casparvoneverecBig tiddy respecter[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

He's a teenager who gets his idea of warfare from Call of duty and transformer movies

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Really? I don't think so. Keep in mind that Russian and Iranian militaries are total jokes with poorly trained troops, equally poor leadership both on lower (squad/platoon/company) and higher (regiment/division/et cetera) levels and garbage-tier combat gear (though this one is a little bit less prominent in Russian case).

If anything, should America clash with any of those countries, the U.S. military would be annihilating them so quickly and effectively the morale would skyrocket to unbelievably high levels and attract even more young men to join the ranks.

The US Government's own simulation predicted that Iran would wipe out the Navy in the first two days... twenty years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Challenge_2002

“The whole thing was over in 5, maybe 10 minutes.”

[–]Lugger 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

DoD would say whatever it takes to persuade the gubmint to increase the military spending.

Ever since the Russian invasion of Ukraine, do you remember how many times U.S. military officials have been spewing nonsense about Russians planning to invade [INSERT EASTERN EUROPEAN COUNTRY] or Russians posing a threat to NATO countries in general?

Of course, all of their "concerns" were utter bullshit, and they knew it was bullshit, but they had to play "Russia bad" card nonetheless to get more money for their dear military.

Now, why do I get the feeling that in the simulation you listed the Navy was "wiped out" for the very same reasons — to portray it as not strong enough and get more funding?

That, or the Iranian might was overestimated for training reasons.

There is no other explanation because Iran simply doesn't have the technology (and training) to counter American units. It just doesn't. The U.S. and Iran literally belong to different eras, technology-wise. If the war ever breaks out, it would be amusing to watch Iranians with rusty AKs and howitzers from the 70s attempt to counter American jets carrying laser-guided missiles, tomahawk-wielding destroyers and armed to the teeth Infantry and Armored divisions with excellent training.

Oh, and, by the way, what is the combat record of the glorious Iranian military? Sending child soldiers to the frontline? Using WW1-tier human wave tactics?

And the U.S.? Well, it has ROFLstomped every conventional force it came across — brilliantly, I might add.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

There is no other explanation because Iran simply doesn't have the technology (and training) to counter American units. It just doesn't. The U.S. and Iran literally belong to different eras, technology-wise. If the war ever breaks out, it would be amusing to watch Iranians with rusty AKs and howitzers from the 70s attempt to counter American jets carrying laser-guided missiles, tomahawk-wielding destroyers and armed to the teeth Infantry and Armored divisions with excellent training.

That's how they decimated the Navy. They took advantage of that US reliance on high-tech electronic surveillance.

[–]Lugger 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Hmm... I don't believe you understood what I was implying:

"They" never destroyed the Navy. It was "destroyed" in a simulation conducted by the Americans themselves, which doesn't necessarily reflect the real state of U.S./Iranian militaries for the reasons I mentioned above.

If such a scenario occured in a real war, chances are Iranians wouldn't even be smart enough to figure out they could use those tactics against the Americans — remember, Iranian military is comprised of poorly trained conscripts and incompetent officers, while the U.S. is a direct opposite which has proven its worth on many battlefields.

They took advantage of that US reliance on high-tech electronic surveillance.

Honestly, if anything it just further proves that the conclusion of the simulation was a BS. You can't just take advantage of high tech like that even if your troops are well-trained (unlike the Iranians).

[–]casparvoneverecBig tiddy respecter[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Are you 14 or 16?