Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. Spouts His Insane Anti-Vaxxer Conspiracy Theory in Measles Hot Zone

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[–]Tom_Bombadil 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (21 children)

The Pacific Northwest is in the grips of a measles outbreak that has already sickened 52 people in Washington and four in Oregon, nearly all of them children. Health officials say the spread of the highly contagious disease—which had been all but eradicated in the United States—is being fueled by parents, sometimes with the approval of their doctors, who refuse to immunize their children.

Measles is not a deadly disease. It's very similar to chicken pox. Do you know of anyone who has died of chickenpox? Me either.

It actually boosts your immune system for your entire lifespan. I would have no problem contracting measles of given the chance.

Having a 2 week fever would suck. But with plenty of vitamin A, I would be fine and immune boosted for life.

[–]wizzwizz4 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

It actually boosts your immune system

Yeah – against measles! The vaccination should also do that.

Having a 2 week fever would suck.

Measles causes many more fatalities than the vaccination. Quite frankly, it's not about you; it's about the people whose immune systems can't deal with it.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

It actually boosts your immune system

Yeah – against measles! The vaccination should also do that.

Against much more than measles. Watch this for 15 mins from 27:00, and you will understand.

Having a 2 week fever would suck.

It wouldn't be pleasant, but a bargain for the resistance that it gives you against many other diseases. This is why parents used to give they're kids measles. It makes you more resistant to many diseases.

Measles vaccines prevents this learned immuno-resistance. Bill Gates is not lying when says vaccines will reduce populations... This is the factual inflammation that we're not allowed to know about.

Measles causes many more fatalities than the vaccination. Quite frankly, it's not about you; it's about the people whose immune systems can't deal with it

This is not true. Please see the link above. You should watch the entire 2-part presentation.

I'm interested in your for assessment.

[–]wizzwizz4 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

It wouldn't be pleasant, but a bargain for the resistance that it gives you against many other diseases.

So, the toxins that measles produces gives you resistance against other diseases? Because the measles vaccine is a strain of measles; it vaccinates you by giving you measles, albeit a strain that's as dangerous as a pug. The vaccine itself isn't giving you immunity; it's merely allowing your body to generate immunity without getting ill.

Therefore, you are wrong. Actually, it's theoretically plausible that the toxins produced by measles might Wait, never mind; it's a virus. Viruses don't produce toxins, unlike bacteria. Therefore, you are wrong.

(I'm not watching the presentation, sorry; I don't have hours to spend right now. If you've got a textual version / transcription I could read that, since I read quickly.)

This is why parents used to give they're kids measles.

No, it's because kids have stronger immune systems (which uses up energy better spent elsewhere in adulthood, where it's unlikely that new diseases will appear) so they're less likely to die of it. It's a more dangerous version of vaccination.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

You didn't watch the lecture, did you? You really should.

If you had, then you wouldn't be making these arguments.

[–]wizzwizz4 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Watched it. Most of their "evidence" (at 32:21) is heavily influenced by selection bias; those who had stronger immune systems were more likely to survive measles, and other diseases too.

The measles vaccine would, if immune system strength is genetic, have a long-term negative effect on the population. But so does cancer treatment, and all other sorts of people-death-prevention. Eugenics would be letting the weak die to preserve the strength of the gene pool, which I don't think is ethical. Bill Gates is the opposite of a eugenicist.

The measles drop-off before vaccines were introduced is interesting; I will keep that in mind. However, the 32:21 evidence suggests that vaccines are actually useful at preventing deaths.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Selection bias is necessary when the system is a fraud, and double-blind study's with a placebo aren't conducted. The only feild of medicine that perpetrates this fraud. .

4 billion dollars in court ordered payouts is proof enough for that. The government estimates that only 1% if victims seek compensation..

The vaccine industry was going out of business, but then the govt stepped in an decided to indemnify the vaccine manufacturers.

[–]wizzwizz4 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

and double-blind study's [sic] with a placebo aren't conducted.

doi:10.1016/S0140-6736(86)91044-5

It's behind a paywall, but I'm sure that there's an open access version accessible from some other DOI provider. There's a list here, in the General section.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Let's see it.

[–]wizzwizz4 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I've given you all the information you need to get a copy.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Sworn testimony entered into the US Congress on behalf of a CDC whistleblower stating that the MEASLES MUMPS AND RUBELLA vaccine causes a statistically significant increase of autism, or autism-like symptoms in African American populations. Testimony asserts that this doctor, his boss, and co-workers at the CDC sorted through the documents, and destroyed the documented evidence..

[–]jtriangle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Well the two week hard to control fever is only part of it. It also sterilizes a fair number of people.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

Where is the evidence for this?

Have you heard about the serious risks with the MMR vaccine?

[–]wizzwizz4 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

What risks? The risks espoused by somebody who was selling non-MMR vaccines, which later turned out to be due to a fundamental and gaping experimental error?

Or is there evidence now?

[–]jtriangle 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I've read the studies, the worst thing that I can see about it that's proven with any scientific backing is that it wears off a little when you get old. Easily fixed with a mid-life booster, but there's some debate as to when exactly that should happen.

If there are any serious risks with the vaccine itself, the empirical data shows that it's well below the margin of error.

Now, because we're on a conspiracy sub, it's probably a better conversation to think about why people are getting measles in general. Are the feds infecting people to coax people into getting a vaccine? I can see a 'good' argument on their side that it's worth maintaining herd immunity for national security reasons, and it wouldn't be the first time they'd done something like that.

Hell, it pales in comparison to spraying Serratia Marcescens on San Francisco or giving poor black people syphilis.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Sworn testimony entered into the US Congress on behalf of a CDC whistleblower stating that the MEASLES MUMPS AND RUBELLA vaccine causes a statistically significant increase of autism, or autism-like symptoms in African American populations. Testimony asserts that this doctor, his boss, and co-workers at the CDC sorted through the documents, and destroyed the documented evidence..

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Repeating from above with a source:.

the system is a fraud, and double-blind study's with a placebo aren't conducted. The only feild of medicine that perpetrates this fraud. .

4 billion dollars in court ordered payouts is proof enough for that. The government estimates that only 1% if victims seek compensation..

The vaccine industry was going out of business, but then the govt stepped in an decided to indemnify the vaccine manufacturers.

4 billion dollars is hard evidence proving that vaccines aren't safe.

[–]jtriangle 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

How exactly do you do a blind study without literally giving people measles? It sounds like an impossible ethical situation.

That, and the proof of the pudding is in the eating. We had about 20 years of nearly no measles cases, and didn't get them again until people stopped vaccinating.

Also, without knowing what exactly went wrong, 4 billion dollars is a meaningless number. Most malpractice suits are borderline frivolous too, so that further biases your number.

Like anything, it's about how you filter the data. If you want the absolute worst number possible, you can get that with a good data set. If you want an absolutely accurate number of people actually harmed by the vaccine and only the vaccine, you can also get that with a good data set.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's a double blind study for vaccines vs a placebo. In vaccine studies the placebo is replaced with last year's vaccine, or another vaccine; never against a placebo.

It's always a study comparing the effects of two vaccines. There's is no placebo control.

Even cancer patients get placebos in experimental studies.