all 86 comments

[–]hennaojichan 11 insightful - 2 fun11 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The best compilation of 9/11 "coincidences" and sources I have seen anywhere. Many of them I did not know of. Thank you.

The first three comments here, about the "flat earth" theory, are a textbook example of Forum Sliding where posters try to slide the discussion from its obvious point, Israeli involvement in 9/11, to another topic altogether and a ridiculous one at that. Thank you JC.

[–]VirgilGriff 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (35 children)

So you admit the two 737s crashed into the twin towers, but maintain that the amount of damage they caused wasn't sufficient to destroy the buildings, and that orchestrators of the attacks knew this and planted explosives in the same floors that the planes hit, waited for a fire to rage for some 60 minutes, then successfully detonated the explosives, without the explosives failing to work or exploding in the fire?

How is that more likely than the plane crashes simply damaged the building enough for it to collapse? We know they were capable of destroying insulation, we know they took out numerous structural supports, and we know the heat weakened the integrity of the steel sufficient for it to bend. We also know the weight of the building it was supporting, and simulations have shown the same type of collapse from the same type of damage.

[–]Jesus[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Towers were destroyed “via conventional demolition, [top-down and classic] and that during the design stages of the process, the conspirators relied too heavily on the use of detonation cord in the floor systems, which led to the vaporization of most of the truss systems. This was accidentally revealed (the “iron microspheres”) when the RJ Lee Group did their Composition and Morphology study of the Ground Zero dust samples for Deutsche Bank.”

PETN/RDX is a good candidate because these are the most commonly used hi-explosives in the industry. They have a long, studied history and are generally reliable. It’s sensible to start with the most plausible hypothesis (conventional hi-explosives) first, and failing that, move onto testing more exotic hypotheses.

Det cord has a detonation velocity higher than that of TNT (about 1.6 times the power of TNT by mass). The detonation velocity of det cord (PETN) is 8,400 meters per second which makes it a rather powerful high-explosive. One of the most powerful. It is also very stable with medium range friction sensitivity and traits make it useful in the demolitions industry. With a relative effectiveness factor of 1.66, it is very useful to the industry, in fact.

PETN – POWER INDEX OF 167 … AS COMPARED TO TNT’S 116

PETN – HEAT OF EXPLOSION VALUE OF 5794 kJ/kg RDX = 5036 kJ/kg

RDX – TEMPERATURE OF EXPLOSION = 4186 K = 7075 F

PETN – TEMPERATURE OF EXPLOSION > 7075 F

(The formula for kelvin to Fahrenheit is ((Kelvin – 273) * 1.8 ) + 32; note: 1.8 = 9/5.)

Primaline 85 detonator cord would be used to pulverize the concrete, and also to remove the building’s lateral support supplied by the double-bridged long trusses. RDX cutter and kicker charges would be used to cut columns down to a specific length (every three floors is a common estimate from what I’ve read), and then ‘kick’ those columns out of the way from the proceeding downward collapse.

Background Reading if interested (Chronological Order):

Creighton introduces the idea of Primaline 85 detonator cord being used in the Tower demolition sequence. The specific role of the cord would be to break up the concrete, metal floor pans and trusses which hold the floor pans up. He also suggests that the iron microspheres found in the WTC dust have a possible source other than Jones’ “nanothermite” [which could have been used for severing certain columns], and debunks the stupid nuke theory.

Notice the telltale signs of high explosives in each sequence:

https://archive.li/eavFb

This article explains Mr. Creighton’s idea on how the demolition sequence proceeded:

https://archive.li/5wuvh

This article reveals that there were cabling ducts located underneath the metal floor pans which could be used for simple cable installation. Creighton proposes this as a possible vector for the detonator cord installation (under the guise of a fibre optic cable upgrade). CAT-5 fibre-optic cable is visually similar to Primaline 85 cord. Kevin Ryan documents a security upgrade for the Twin Towers in 1999-2000.

https://archive.li/EKAWh

These articles connects the discovery of “iron microspheres” to the destruction of the floor systems:

https://archive.li/wYZwl

https://archive.li/1op7b

The same discovery but extended to the metal floor pans of the Trade Center, which were held up by the long trusses.

This article details the extent of the heat events in the Trade Center collapse:

https://archive.li/e5u3P

The article below is a great master narrative around his conventional hi-explosives hypothesis. Towards the end, it describes the similarity between the inferred composition of the iron microspheres and WTC steel trusses. It quotes from the seminal 2003 RJ Lee Report (p. 7 and p. 19) on the background of the WTC dust markers, and the NIST report on the WTC steel trusses. NIST NCSTAR 1-3D, Table 3-11, p. 58 (p. 92 in PDF). The similarity in chemical makeup between the WTC dust markers and the Trade Center trusses is unmistakable. This is a key discovery which strengthens Mr. Creighton’s hypothesis about the destruction of the floor systems. In short, the iron microspheres found in the dust are the steel trusses (and floor pans, and filing cabinets, and computers…) This is explained in sub-section “Key Innovations of this Hypothesis”. Remember that ‘steel’ is iron alloyed with a small percentage of carbon.

https://archive.li/z72VO

This article offers an explanation for the publicly acknowledged presence of demolition crews at the Trade Center site:

https://archive.li/YeFB0

The pyroclasitic flow is extremely important. Look at all the cars that were set on fire. How is that possible with a gravitational collapse? it isn’t. What set them on fire was the red hot molten metal micro-spheres in the cloud, the massive wave of heat pushing down the street. Officers who died that day, their guns had all the rubber melted off of them and their badges were charred and whitened from the heat. Pyroclasitic flow hallmark of a demolition.

Proposed Tests to Detect Conventional Explosives

This article proposes a test for detecting the residue of post-explosion by-products in the Trade Center dust:

https://archive.li/Tj5CT

This article details possible specific procedures for testing for hi-explosives in chain of custody Trade Center samples:

https://archive.li/0tTmg

There’s informative discussion in the comment threads of these articles as well:

– Mr. Creighton refutes a troll comment on difficulty of wiring upgrade:

https://archive.li/dg8DH#selection-10361.0-10361.29

– Mr. Creighton refutes a troll comment on tracers as primary PETN identifier:

https://archive.li/dg8DH#selection-11095.0-11095.24

– Mr. Creighton refutes a troll comment on tracers as primary PETN identifier, Part II:

https://archive.li/dg8DH#selection-14663.260-14663.318

– Mr Creighton refutes a troll comment on the PETN residue detection process:

https://archive.li/dg8DH#selection-14407.0-14407.45

– Mr. Creighton’s lengthy argument with reader regards Twin Towers’ factor of safety, mechanics of a progressive collapse, mechanics of controlled demolition, etc. (and continued in replies further down):

https://archive.li/KMrfF#selection-9399.0-9399.64

– The pyroclastic flow of Tower collapse, owing to the great volume of molten metal microspheres in the dust clouds:

https://archive.li/iAOtQ#selection-10033.0-10033.45

PETN detonation is still a strong candidate (better than thermite) for many of the apparent combustion byproducts that were discovered…

Key innovations of this hypothesis:

The iron microspheres are byproducts of (likely Primaline 85) detonation cord explosion. The source of these spheres are primarily the 6000 metal floor pans and 40,000 double-bridged long trusses, the majority of which apparently were not found in the rubble. This also reveals a key feature of how the Tower destruction was engineered (re removal of floor systems).

This also explains the great abundance of spheres; the floor systems were a major structural element of the Towers, so their destruction, via detonator cord, would lead to hundreds of tons of spheres.

The microscopic “red-gray chips” in the dust, which were found alongside (often attached to) these spherical particles, can be explained as the primer paint which coated the trusses. The intense heat from the detonation cord (meant to pulverize the concrete) would’ve also flash melted the trusses, and the resultant molten metal cooled off whilst suspended in space…which formed via surface tension into these particles. That’s partly RJ Lee’s account for how these spheres formed:

Various metals (most notably iron and lead) were melted during the WTC Event, producing spherical metallic particles. Exposure of phases to high heat results in the formation of spherical particles due to surface tension.

— RJ Lee Group, “WTC Dust Signature Report: Composition and Morphology,” December 2003, p. 17 (p. 21 in PDF).

Different sorts of paint ignite at different temperatures, and we know that Jones & Harrit only focused on the primer paint from the columns. Therefore, paint from the trusses as a source for these red-gray chips cannot be ruled out. Mr. Creighton’s hypothesis provides a good accounting – as with the microspheres – for their presence in the WTC dust.

The pyroclastic collapse dust cloud can be explained as the molten microspheres generated from the detonator cord, travelling within the pulverized concrete cloud at rapid speed. Recall the firefighter testimony on the Tower collapses as documented (see Citation #1 in his article). The “Neither Gravity nor Thermite” article and the firefighter testimony refute the common claim that the collapse was “cold”, whereas its initiation was “hot”.

The smoke and dust clouds are linked again to the pulverized concrete floor systems. Not unique to Mr. Creighton’s hypothesis, but still accounts for it well in terms of the demolition design.

[–]cisheteroscum 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

the two 737s crashed into the twin towers, but maintain that the amount of damage they caused wasn't sufficient to destroy the buildings, and that orchestrators of the attacks knew this and planted explosives in the same floors that the planes hit, waited for a fire to rage for some 60 minutes, then successfully detonated the explosives, without the explosives failing to work or exploding in the fire?

Yes

Just try to explain WTC-7. It wasnt even connected to the other buildings and came down in a free fall because of "fires"

[–]VirgilGriff 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Jet fuel doesn't need to melt steel for it to significantly weaken steel, genius.

There's also no evidence that the molten metal you're referring to is STEEL. You know what else is an incredibly common metal in skyscrapers which has a significantly lower melting point? Can you think of one? Starts with an "a." Anything coming to mind?

[–]cisheteroscum 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I never said anything about jet fuel or molten steel. Just two of many peices of hard and circumstantial evidence that this website (and this post) cover in better detail than I could. Im sure you didnt bother to read the whole thing

The basic truth is that planes are real, the towers got hit by them, but they were also detonated by previously placed internal explosives after the collision. The towers go down in free-fall ffs. They just should not have collapsed that way. And owner (((Larry Silverstein))) sure loved his insurance payout from his underperforming real estate

Some of the particulars of the event just dont matter, since the more brutal fact is that 9/11 was Zionist/"Deep State" plot to get the US perpetually involved in the Middle East to benefit Israel. That means a ton of people in government (including Bush) and many Zionist billionaires and Israeli assets conspired to kill us civilians and the media conspired to cover it up, all to benefit the Jewish Supremacist State. This is the world you still live in - one nation, under ZOG

[–]Node 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That means a ton of people in government (including Bush) and many Zionist billionaires and Israeli assets conspired to kill us civilians and the media conspired to cover it up

But to be fair, they only killed the kind of people who chose to inhabit Sodom Gomorrah. Essentially making it a fight among our enemies.

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

How do you wire explosives in such a way that they survive being hit by 737s and burned for an hour, without detonating prematurely, placed at the exact floors that 737s would hit, and why would it even be necessary over the spectacle of having 737s crash in the first place? If your goal is destruction of the buildings just let 737s smash into them, burn, take out supports and fire insulation, and wait for the fires to cause the buildings to collapse.

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

There are numerous ways to wire the inner core columns so they won't be heat blasted with debris and jet fuel, which burned up in the initial explosion anyway. There is footage of a women standing where the plane hit in the North Tower. The areas were cold and much of the fires were not hot enough to weaken the steel at all. There was however severing of beams on these floors, possibly nano-Thermite was used in order to weaken the structure, hence the ailvery molten metal pouring from the towers and the white smoke after 35mins. The actual explosives that streamlined down the building likely had radio transceivers and were several floors below impact.

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Buildings don't fall into their own footprint, or that 1/4 of the top section destroys 3/4 of the healthy section below. It's impossible without explosives, which are proven by lateral ejection force and pulverized nano-sphere concrete particles.

[–]cisheteroscum 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How do you wire explosives in such a way that they survive being hit by 737s and burned for an hour

I don't know, the article does a better job than I do. You can debate this with people who know more on the subject. Many explosives are designed to withstand physical impacts, as far as I know.

placed at the exact floors that 737s would hit

They werent placed exactly there, the whole building or at least key sections were wired

and why would it even be necessary over the spectacle of having 737s crash in the first place?

Shock and awe, create confusion as to how to investigate the details. Otherwise you wpuld also have no pretext for TSA, less for the Patriot Act too

If your goal is destruction of the buildings

The goal is to 1) psyop the American people into endless wars against muslims (but actually for Israel) 2) psyop them into supporting the patriot act, etc. 3) Make sure Silverstein gets his insurance payout so he goes along with the plan

I encourage you to order a subpeona of Bush, Cheney, Silverstein, Lowy, Eisenberg, Mossad leadership (plus their "dancing israelis") and others to get the full story as to what their plan was and how it was carried out. ULtimately, the particulars of the collapse just dont matter so much because - as I've said elsewhere - You are ruled by zionist Jews and traitorous elites who conspired to do this, and that's the world you still have to live in. Exactly how/why the towers fell or what happened on the planes on 9/11 is irellevant to this fact, and focusing on minutiae is a cope to avoid dealing with the current problem.

[–]Node 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Did you see the video of the "fires" taken from the backside, where you saw directly into the core of the building through the huge "slash" from top to bottom?

No one ever shows that, or even brings it up. That building was wrecked, with a raging inferno in the middle from top to bottom.

Could have also been wired with explosives too, but it's not like it wasn't already destroyed.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

they might have falled eventually from the planes but they'd fall over to the side not like in a controlled demolition. That could have damaged other buildings around, like they did want to demolish building 7 too but no other ones.

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

It didn't fall straight down, the top tipped over towards the damaged side and that was enough to destroy the remaining supports, at which point it fell down.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

no it fell straight down like in a controled demo

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Except for the part where the top tipped over before falling down, sure

Also I'm not aware of any demolition that requires two planes to slam into it first

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

just went straight down

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

Yes, I admit passenger jet drones were flown into the towers and ACARs data, which has never been refuted and which proves 9/11 was a false flag, that 9/11 AIRCRAFT, specifically, Flight 175 and UA93 WERE AIRBORNE LONG AFTER CRASH. Every place also had either a ground or in flight place swap!

See here:

Part 1: https://archive.vn/7OiB8

Part 2: https://archive.vn/QjjS1

All these messages were confirmed as received and even the routing via PA stations is known....

Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System (ACARS) is a device used to send messages to and from an aircraft. Very similar to text messages and email we use today, Air Traffic Control, the airline itself, and other airplanes can communicate with each other via this "texting" system. ACARS was developed in 1978 and is still used today. Similar to cell phone networks, the ACARS network has remote ground stations installed around the world to route messages from ATC, the airline, etc, to the aircraft depending on it's location and vice versa. ACARS Messages have been provided through the Freedom Of Information Act (FOIA) which demonstrate that the aircraft received messages through ground stations located in Harrisburg, PA, and then later routed through a ground station in Pittsburgh, 20 minutes after the aircraft allegedly impacted the South Tower in New York. How can messages be routed through such remote locations if the aircraft was in NY, not to mention how can messages be routed to an aircraft which allegedly crashed 20 minutes earlier? Pilots For 9/11 Truth have briefly touched on this subject in 9/11: Intercepted through the excellent research of "Woody Box", who initially discovered such alarming information in the released FOIA documents(1). We now have further information which confirms the aircraft was not in the vicinity of New York City when the attacks occurred.

These are the 'text' (ACARS) messages in question - The format for these messages is pretty straight forward. To limit the technical details, we will explain the most important parts of the messages, however, for full Message Block Format Code standards, click here. The remote ground station (MDT in the message below) used to route the message to the aircraft, the time and date in which the message is sent (111259, meaning the 11th of Sept, at 1259Z or 0859 Eastern), the flight number (UA175), and the tail number of the airplane in which the message is intended (N612UA), are all highlighted in red. The underlined date and time is when the message was received by the airplane.

This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1259Z (8:59AM Eastern) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the MDT remote ground station (Harrisburg International Airport, also known as Middleton).

        DDLXCXA SFOLM CHI58R SFOFRSAM

        .SFOLMUA 111259/JER
        CMD

        AN N612UA/GL MDT

       - QUSFOLMUA 1UA175 BOSLAX


       I HEARD OF A REPORTED INCIDENT ABOARD YOUR ACFT. PLZ VERIFY ALL

        IS NORMAL....THX 777SAM


        SFOLM JERRY TSEN

       ;09111259 108575 0543

__________________________________________--

So you admit the two 737s crashed into the twin towers, but maintain that the amount of damage they caused wasn't sufficient to destroy the buildings, and that orchestrators of the attacks knew this and planted explosives in the same floors that the planes hit, waited for a fire to rage for some 60 minutes, then successfully detonated the explosives, without the explosives failing to work or exploding in the fire?

Explosives in dust have been proven. They used PETN, detcord and nono-thermite to cut certain beams. It is likely in the areas where the passenger jet drones hit the facade, they reinforced the elevator shafts so the detcord would noy get dislodged. And we are of course, forgeting about teh demolition of building WTC7.

How is that more likely than the plane crashes simply damaged the building enough for it to collapse?

The liklihood is near 0%. Every sequence, including the streamlining of explosives down the core columns of the building (top-down demo) skipping every third flood ahead of collapse sequence proves demolition and not mere gravitational collapse.

We know they were capable of destroying insulation, we know they took out numerous structural supports, and we know the heat weakened the integrity of the steel sufficient for it to bend. We also know the weight of the building it was supporting, and simulations have shown the same type of collapse from the same type of damage.

The planes did not take out any of the core columns. The floors in these areas either were likely reinforced so as to not dislodge explosives.

We know the heat weakened the integrity of the steel sufficient for it to bend.

Nope, not at all. Even NISt had to backtrack and say the temperatures were not even hot enough to bend the steal columns, not even close.

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (18 children)

So you also believe that the 737s that were flown into the towers had the passengers removed and/or didn't have passengers in the first place, and were remotely piloted by drones?

How is that more likely? Why would that even be necessary for your first theory to be correct? The planes could've still contained humans. Why would they need to be drones? Why wouldn't it be possible for it to be a murder suicide? There are dozens of murder suicides a year. There are dozens of suicide bombers a year, or at least a few, moreso at that time.

Why wouldn't people commit suicide by crashing planes into a building?

How is your proposal even remotely MORE plausible?

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

You obviously have not researched 9/11 in the slightest bit. Whatever happened to the passengers is not my knowing. All we know is that there were plane swaps, on the ground (Flight 77) and in the air. We also know for a fact that ACARs, proves more than anything else, that UA93 and Flight 175 were flying westward well after their passenger jet drones crashed either into the facade of the towers, or as Rumsfeld said, was "shot down" over Shanksville. ACARS data proves without a doubt that the offical narrative is a lie, period.

When Ellen Mariani sued, her lawyer wanted the judge removed from the case due to his conflict of interest, his son’s law firm represented ICTS, the Israeli company that provided security at the airport the planes were hijacked from, among numerous other conflicts of interest. They were attacked as – what else? – “anti-semites.”

https://marianilawsuit.wordpress.com/

Mariani, along with her lawyer Bruce Leichty, were threatened with sanctions “in the form of double costs, for which Mariani and Leichty would be jointly and severally liable” and were condemned for “ad hominem attacks”, “bombastic challenges to the integrity of the district court” and “deeply troubling personal slurs”.

Mariani’s April 19, 2012 brief noted, in part that “Judge Hellerstein and his wife Mildred are known to be active supporters of Israeli causes, and it is implausible that Judge Hellerstein would not at least be on inquiry notice of the affiliations of his son’s law firm and the connections of his son’s clients to Israeli and Israeli-linked defendants in a case before him, particularly in a case of the magnitude of the 911 case.” It continued “It is not plausible that Judge Hellerstein, a highly-educated and connected supporter of Israeli causes, was unaware of the connections of his son’s law firm.”

In fact, Mariani knew that Hellerstein was pressuring everyone to take settlements – basically, take some money and shut up.

“Federal Judge Alvin K. Hellerstein has presided over all of the proceedings arising out of the terrorist acts that beset the United States of America on September 11, 201 1, including but not limited to the crashing of United Airlines Flight 175 into the South Tower of the World Trade Center in New York City, leading to the death of Appellant’s husband Louis Neil Mariani. The effect of Judge Hellerstein’s supervision and rulings has been that no trial has been held on any wrongful death or survivorship claim arising from any of the 9/11 plane crashes… Consistent with pressure exerted by Judge Hellerstein at numerous points, settlements have been sought and approved as to all claims made to date, and Mariani believes that her claim and the claim of her deceased husband’s Estate–settlement of which was fashioned over her objection–are the only 9/11 claims not yet the subject of binding resolution by final nonappealable order.”

Mariani lost one of her own on Flight 175. So we can be sure there were real passengers, it is jsut that ACARS proves that 175 did not hit the towers. As it was pinged flying westward, likely to an undiscolsed miltiary base, as was perfectly written out in Operation Northwoods. But it Northwoods case, they would use fake passengers with Aliases, switch transponder with Passenger jet drone and have mock funerals after the fact.

PICCOcalls also prove that UA93 and 175 were undergoing a live hijackign drill at the time as passengers were able to use their cellphones by plugging the numebr into the airphone. PICCOcalls can only be done via a transponder on the plane and are only utilized for live hijacking drills. So it is likely these passengers were unknowingly part of a live hijacking drill, whether they believed it or not. Whatever the case may be, 175 was hundreds of miles west flying in the opposite direction.

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

You're the one making the argument, so you need to account for the flaws in your theory. One of those glaring, plane-sized flaws is what happened to all the passengers onboard the planes. You don't get to wave your hands over every gap in logic and go "that's not my problem."

Take your fucking meds

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Crap, he can't explain the passengers. In that case, I guess 9/11 happened like big brother says it did. Bravo, amazing work.

[–]VirgilGriff 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

That's not some minor quibble. It's a major flaw in his theory. He can't explain it because there's no explanation that doesn't strain the credulity even in his schizoid brain. "Guys, all they had to do was hijack four 737s fully laden with passengers and then land those jets unexpectedly before a state of emergency was declared without anyone realizing that it was unusual and then offload the passengers and kill them all, then activate the futuristic remote-control drone override box that maintenance personnel installed in the cockpits months before without anyone noticing and then take the planes off without anyone noticing and then put them back on their original route where their transponders were turned back on but no one noticed and then the empty places were remotely flown into the buildings, and all the hundreds of people involved in keeping this quiet would've had to remain quiet about the biggest and most complicated and most unnecessary conspiracy ever for two decades.

INB4 his argument is updated on the fly to "yeah well maybe all those passengers actually were on the planes in the first place! You can't prove they weren't knocked out with sleeping gas!" and he pretends he never said otherwise.

I've seen these arguments since the days of Loose Change when some 16-year-old schizoid claimed a single frame of footage was able to prove the planes shot a laser beam out before they crashed into the towers, as otherwise they would've turned into Wiley-E-Coyote on the superstructure.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Were Israel and the US and PNAC responsible for 9/11?

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

INB4 his argument is updated on the fly to "yeah well maybe all those passengers actually were on the planes in the first place! You can't prove they weren't knocked out with sleeping gas!" and he pretends he never said otherwise.

I already proved via ACARS data alone, that the official 9/11 story is a blatant lie. If flight 175 was pinged 200 miles from where it was said to have crashed, flying westward, then it was 200 miles flying westward and something else struck the building, such as a commercial airliner drone. It's really that simple. You can't forge ACARS pings. The plane swaps prove this as well, as evidenced by pilots for 9/11 truth.

All you're doing is ignoring the evidence and spewing ad hominems. If I had to guess, you're a shill.

[–]Jesus[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

INB4 you're a shill. I can play the game too. Fortunately for me and truth, and Mariani, you can't debunk the Acars data.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

the people that said they got calls from passengers simply lied

[–]Jesus[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Possibly, possibly not. Like I said Piccocalls happened. Meaning that some passengers were able to call via cellphones through airphones but this can ONLY HAPPEN and these transponders are only retrofitted on planes which are undergoing LIVE HIJACKING DRILLS.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I remember watching Jesse Ventura's conspiracy show and he spent a long time showing the technology existed to alter one's voice so it sounded just like someone else, so someone could have called and made it seem like they really were the loved one the person knew, I'm thinking occams razor says they just lied. I guess it's hard for some to believe people would be so craven as to lie about such a thing. They don't allow a real investigation tho so they're hiding something.

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't need to theorize anything. I've proven already that the official sanctioned story is a lie by ACARS pings alone. Pilots for 9/11 truth have already proven it years ago. What happened to the pssengers flying westward well after the drones' crashed into beacons or the one shot down over PA, we won't ever know. While FAA was tracking the drones, the airplane companies were tracking the real flights. The conspirators screwed up more than enough times. ACARS proves the official story is a lie. It's never been refuted. Same with the Picco-calls.

[–]Jesus[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Take your meds?

How about you screw off Hasbara shill.

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

lol I struck a nerve. Reminding you to take your meds made you reply to me six times.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

he's right tho you're a shill

[–]VirgilGriff 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Who's right? Your alt? As you reply to me three times on this account in a 4 day old thread minutes after I reply to your alt?

Take your meds, schizoposter. My point still stands about you needing to address the flaws in your argument.

[–]Jesus[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

/u/popper is not my alt-accoutn. He can atttest to that, so cannot magnora7. Secondly, you didn't address anything I had to say, instead you spewed fallacies and ad hominems and then claimed there were flaws in my argument. Apparently, I'm suppose to explain something I don't know but the things I do know, such as ACARS data proving the offical 9/11 narrative to be a fraud, is all but ignored by you.

Take your meds, schizoposter.

Funny, no substance though.

[–]Node 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

[deleted comment] "People simply cannot imagine how deeply the psychopaths in the upper echelons of the societal pyramid utterly despise them as an expendable burden. With every booster nary a thought of a greater work at play."

It's actually pretty easy to imagine for anyone who's met members of "the public".

How could they have anything but contempt for the kind of cattle who would 'wear the mask', and just bovinely accept all the other bullshit? In some ways, this plandemic appears to be them proving to the rest of us that a massive cull is both necessary and desirable. (probably not, but that would be a plausible explanation)

[–]Jesus[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Considering this study, nobody should be trusting these people;

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.38.27.png?w=1024

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.38.57.png?w=1024

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.40.13.png?w=1024

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.40.43.png?w=1024

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.42.11.png?w=1024

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.47.16.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.47.59.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.03.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.13.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.17.png

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.21.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.29.png?w=795

https://earthlinggb.files.wordpress.com/2021/11/screenshot-2021-11-21-at-20.48.32.png?w=795

Now, I don’t think it takes me or any academic study to tell you you’re run by psychopaths. I think that is clearly seen by all today as you watch and listen to them drooling with their power over you on your TV.

So, here’s the thing: If you enjoy this dystopia (or agree with it) well carry on regardless (and you will be added to the list) but, if you want your freedom back, do you really think petitioning or protesting to a group of psychopaths is going to achieve it? Or do you think they may, perhaps, need to be dealt with in another way altogether?

Source: earthlinggb.wordpress.com

[–]Node 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm not quite sure which dystopia you mean. The psychopaths are one side of the issue, but they would have little effect on anything in a functional species. The other side is the masses, who are little different from a computer running Windows 95 in current year, with no firewall or virus protection. The programming just goes right in and self-updates.

If you're familiar with the ultra blackpills from Tallest_Skil, he appears to be right. No one ever has or will do anything about this situation, because it's just how we are. If we weren't, then the concept of 'leaders' wouldn't exist.

Or do you think they may, perhaps, need to be dealt with in another way altogether?

As we saw a few years back in Ukraine, even 'uprisings' are not organic by the masses, but are programmed into them by the psychopathic elite. They own it all, and are essentially running human feedlots on the surface of this planet. The terms "goyim" and "sheeple" didn't just spring up out of thin air. They're unfortunately all too accurate.

To be fair, the false belief that something can be done probably results in a happier cow. To bastardize Thomas Gray's ending, 'Ignorance can be bliss'.

[–]naples 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, my vote is that we just band together and try to get through it.

[–]turtlew0rk 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Coincidences are anti-semitic

[–]Entropick 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks, I'm going to go through this in detail. Unquestionably this is my crusade.

[–]aaarrgh 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

There are a lot of cohencidences in the world, way too much for my liking.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

epic post my man jc (lowercase). I didn't forget about your RES request, i just lowered the priority to work on a new saidit/reddit clone. their success is the success of RES and the android app and all that shit. I trust this comment is late enough to not be a forum slide / distraction. your content is top notch.

[–]iDontShift 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (37 children)

almost as big as my list of proofs the earth is in fact flat

the list that proves we live on a ball.. all come from videos from nasa and other big corp or big gov

lies lies and more lies

to get you to believe you are powerless

YOU ARE ONE WITH GOD AND GOD LISTENS TO YOU

think only about what you actually want to have .. if you notice what you don't want think about what you rather have

let the 'rather be' be your final thought on the matter

believe it as you believe if you turn a facet on it will pour water out

that is the reality

[–]Noam_Chomsky 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

almost as big as my list of proofs the earth is in fact flat.

The flat earth PsyOp hoax reveals itself in it's desperation to suppress the truth.

believe it as you believe if you turn a facet on it will pour water out

that is the reality

In case anyone was still on the fence with flat earth. Fake AF.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

the only one desperate are the ball earthers..

who can't stand up to debate, can't actually prove their case

In case anyone was still on the fence with flat earth. Fake AF.

run from the light you coward

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

We don't need to prove it, it's the ACCEPTED PARADIGM.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

if it is true, why is it not easy to prove?

seems simple. fuck off ball earther and your assumptions

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (29 children)

Explain tides and eclipses, as well as the Sun not setting or rising at the poles for 6 months of the year, with your Flat Earth fantasy. Kthxbai.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (28 children)

you explain why we have 2 tides a day

the south pole forever sun is only vaguely proven by shitty movies that hardly show anything

the all day sun at the north pole is awesome an incredible as you watch the ball circle around you

why does polaris exist, and not move (violating theory that we are traveling in 'space') .. and also

there is no south pole star, or anything.. like it above that doesn't change.. it is always change, it has no 'center' like polaris

here is buzz telling a little girl we didn't go to the moon

the fantasy world is the one you believe you live in, that you can't prove and must run away from truths..

like the suez canal being 100 miles .. connecting two oceans .. and completely level the whole way!

but keep watching their bullshit videos that have been shown repeatably to be frauds

[–]Node 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Explain tides and eclipses, as well as the Sun not setting or rising at the poles for 6 months of the year,

The biggest problem facing the flatters is there are no alternate theories to explain phenomenon like this we see with our own eyes. It's easier to fudge some of the other stuff, with people unfamiliar. And flatters can be entertaining in their efforts to maintain their narrative, but flat earth just breaks down before it comes up with an credible explanation for the world around us.

That "we're all in a simulation" actually works better than flat earth.

Wait, are you that guy from voat? Blackguard19 was one of the most diehard flatters on voat, and your user is seeming familiar too. If you are, then I probably linked you to a 'flat earth debunked' video from that reddit douchebag known as "professor dave" on youtube. He might be a total ass, but he wipes the floor with FE.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

here is buzz admitting we didn't go to the moon, not a complete admission of a flat earth, but exposure of part of the lie you live

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebPFRNzJeD4

you didn't explain the tides

obama literally refers to the 'flat earth society' .. known to be a fraud by flat earthers.. as if he didn't know

suez canal 100 miles long.. completely flat

kansas is said to be flat as a pancake

along with 7 other states that are even flatter

you have been perfectly lead to always not investigate my claims with unbias

you are not unique, i saw this behavior in my own family, and only recently uncovered how the ego avoids addressing the issue given: the ego allows some other idea to 'override' and 'overshadow' the new information that conflicts .. because it was written in heavy emotional content of sorts.. emotionally invested

letting will go feels like a death... a pain is involved

you'd hafta admit you are wrong

i've already done this so many times in my life .. but I do my best to always do what I NOW know is right

[–]Node 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

then I probably linked you to a 'flat earth debunked' video from that reddit douchebag known as "professor dave" on youtube.

Those debunkings of flat earth appear to be kryptonite to flatters, as not a single flatter has been willing to engage or offer a flat earth rebuttal to those debunkings.

If flat earth theory could refute those debunkings, then I and many others would take it more seriously. But the problem, and reason why flatters flee, is because that's where FET falls apart.

Professor Dave, on youtube. Look through his 'debunking' playlist and find around 7 videos that leave flatters with nothing to say in response.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQl8h7Aa75s&list=PLybg94GvOJ9GEuq4mp9ruJpj-rjKQ_a6E&index=3

I found it for you. This is the "10 Challenges For Flat Earthers" video, after some previous and more casual exchanges with flatters. If you'd like more of a challenge, he follows up in that playlist with some more specific debunkings, that flatters just have to avoid because they have no answers.

Get back to me with your destruction of his debunkings. :)

u/Horrux

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

literally avoided all my questions..

and made up your own

is that how debate works where you are from?

[–]Node 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

literally avoided all my questions... is that how debate works where you are from?

Of the 51 question marks in the post and replies, the question mark quoted here is the only one appearing in your comments.

If you're interested in furthering your understanding of English, I could direct you to some helpful instructional pages.

https://prowritingaid.com/Question-Mark

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/question-mark/

https://www.thepunctuationguide.com/question-mark.html

Let me know if you have any questions. You can most effectively do so by replacing the period at the end of the sentence with a question mark.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

i made statements that violate ball earth theory

and your response in nothing

because you cannot contradict my statements, they are true

yet they violate ball earth theory

you don't volunteer information to destroy mine

yet they violate ball earth theory

you cannot refute my statements as they violate ball earth theory, and you have every resource available to you to prove it (my side is severely handicapped by those that don't want it to be known .. by people possibly like you.. are you worth my time? are you just a bot? have you sold your soul? mine is free)

doesn't make me right, but it makes you wrong and .. maybe you should keep your mind more open

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (17 children)

I would vote this post for Low-IQ award of the day. But we don't have such a thing. Jesus. You must believe in the tooth fairy, too... Sigh.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

you can't refute my arguments

sigh all you want

you are the one bringing up tooth fairies while I post videos

OF THE FIRST GUY THAT CLAIMED TO WALK ON THE MOON SAYING HE DIDN'T DO IT

oh, and then the suez canal .. 100 miles .. suppose to be 100 foot of 'curve' - -- but this isn't so.. it is nearly perfectly level (variation of a few inches)

find me the curvature of the earth formula used by engineers

oh wait.. there isn't one

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

sigh

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

lol, you fuckers are incredible.

prove the curve .. show me the curvature formula

.. and shove the sigh up your ass

or shut the fuck up

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Sunsets. Seasons. Length of day variations. Eclipses. Tides.

WE don't have to prove anything to you. The spheroidal Earth is the accepted paradigm. If you want to challenge this paradigm, prove something. But you can't.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

prove something. But you can't.

proving the curvature of the earth formula doesn't exist, isn't used....

isn't proof?

i can also prove the shadow drawn by eclipses is impossible to reproduce on a ball earth (but makes perfect sense on a flat earth)

so there are things I don't know...

but there are things you think you know I can prove are wrong

your side is dominate.. i see not reason for 'gaps' in logic

flat earth has been suppressed, and even reasonable reasons are destroyed with anti-logic .. and videos are removed from youtube without cause

FIND THE CURVE .. IT SHOULD BE IMPORTANT TO BALL EARTHERS .. yet you don't seem to care it doesn't exist..

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

2 tides a day.. 1 moon ..

moon causes the tide

wut?

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Length of day variations.

can't say .. but I bet we could know

imagine the sun may be moving up and down as well as in a circle

the full moon visible with the full visible sun always has hurt my brain

can you explain how the moon is facing us.. and the sun is facing us.. and we have a full moon?

can you explain the 'orbital lock' that is apparent? because orbital lock isn't actually an explaination.. it is an theory based upon what is

you seem lost that just because the theory surrounds a fact and is apparently true.. doesn't make it true

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It's called A TIDE. But I welcome you to my list of blocked users. Good job.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

stay mad kid

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

and you shall remain an idiot, until you return to God's Truth

love isn't mad, annoyed perhaps, finding what seems a ridiculous barrier to an obvious truth

perhaps we should address the main issue, you have been brainwashed unless you deliberately ascertain each of your motivating forces..

peace, namaste

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

hold the L kid

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

sigh

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

the fact you fail to understand the significance, isn't my fault but your own

if you can't prove the curve, why not?

try and utilize that brain God gave you

[–]Node 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

moderator reports: Dragging down discussion on Pyramid Of Debate

That's kind of a stretch, and even claims of flat earth fit within the purview of s/conspiracy.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebPFRNzJeD4

just a crack in the damn .. maybe you'll start to consider you don't know what you think you know

[–]kapootapottay 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I like this part: "this event would divide our past and future into a before and after. The US might respond with draconian measures, scaling back civil liberties, allowing wider surveillance of citizens, detention of suspects, and use of deadly force."

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

  • "But it's not all the Jews, only a small number of us..."
  • OK then why don't you denounce them?
  • "Why would I?"
  • They're committing evil in YOUR name, that of "Jews"
  • "Oy vey! We are victims of everthing, it's not going to change anything if we do"
  • So you actually side with them and therefore are as evil is they are...
  • "Antisemite! How dare you! So much hatred!!!!"

[–]Jesus[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

It's not all Jews, no, it's not all non-Jews either, although, it's probably the majority of non-Jew Zionists who support the Likud. It would however be hard to find a Jew who would admit that certain Jews orchestrated 9/11. The ony two I know who admited this are Jeremy Roth-K. and Barry Chamish, who claims, "yes Israel did 9/11 but it was the Labour party who did it, not the Likud" my beloved party, not them!

Bollocks.