I appreciate that this may seem trivial in /s/censorship, though for what it's worth...

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[–][deleted]  (11 children)

[deleted]

    [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

    Yes - though the stated reason for my removal from 2 subs (from d3rr) was "that chipit post removal".

    I am trying to stay on the POD with this question, which is why I do not wish to mention names. But if you note that I antagonized anyone, we're onto a different topic, wherein I can easily argue that I constantly get angry low-POD responses from users like Chipit, to which I respond - not with oh, Chipit, I love you, you're awesome - but with a counter argument to Chipit's abuse, without abusing Chipit (in all cases I can think of, but perhaps not every case). Mods are also not prohited from arguing, or alternatively, thanking people for their abuses. But this is not what I've asked about in the present post. I was removed as mod from 2 subs because of a duplicate removal. In order to properly debate the censorship of mods who argue with users, I'd have to make another post. But I did not know that that was related to the censorship of my mod activities.

    Regarding apologies - should I apologize for removing a 24-hour exact duplicate (under its duplicate) on the front page of /s/politics? That's related to the OP question.

    [–][deleted] 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

    I constantly get angry low-POD responses from users like Chipit

    I get that from Chippy too, and I already lost my temper over it once. I don't comment on his posts anymore. But he's a good contributor even if I'd rather go to a dental appointment than talk to him, I still upvote his stuff I like.

    I'm sorry you were removed as mod, I think you did a great job although I get what Axxa is saying, you do get in a lot of protracted fights with people and these are people you now have power over.

    On the subject of post removal, I don't think that was a big deal but I don't think that's what this is about either. Although there's really not enough volume to be caring much that 5% of the posts are dupes. Either way I mean.

    We do have different ideals of moderation. You seem to want a heavily curated space, and that's fine, but there's already so many of those out there. I favor a more hands off approach, let the people decide what they want to see and not have me tell them what they should see.

    One isn't necessarily better than the other. It's just we already have so much of the one and so little of the other.

    [–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Thanks. I see your point. Two issues I've not already addressed in other comments:

    these are people you now have power over.

    The duplicate post is the first one I've removed (and did so by accident). In other cases I've helped the sub by reporting spam (not by removing it), and I've asked people to avoid being abusive (as I would ask in any other sub). Absolutely no one on Saidit was worried about my role as a moderator, and I am certain they did not see that role as having any power over them. This is very different at Reddit - where one knows that there are shill moderators who will look for and remove (without comment) certain comments or posts that are critical of Pakistan, India, Israel or China, in that order. Some of those posts survive the shill moderators, but there is a Pakistan moderator or two who are removing items and banning users without explanation. In any event - does anyone think I have power over them at Saidit? I would be really surprised if so, especially because I've not done anything to develop such a fear in any user. By contrast, I am the Libtard some users want to harrass, tag, question &c. They're not worried in the least. (Nor am I.)

    You seem to want a heavily curated space,

    No. Even /u/d3rr was annoyed when I told him that I didn't want to change Saidit - I wanted users to carryon as they are, so that I can learn from them. I also explained that I'd like to help with the spam (which was the main problem back then). Thus I was appointed as a spam deleting moderator. I think an old duplicate post with no comments on the front page is a form of spam, or at the very least, that the removal of a duplicate will give users an opportunity to see more of the legitimate posts (80% of which are Chipit's on some days, so I helped show more of his posts by removing a duplicate).

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      It's not antogonistic to reply to someone and disagree with them. That's certainly not the point of a debate. Did Chipit feel antagonized? I doubt it. He antagonized me and I responded. It's known as a debate. Regarding M7, he had many additional comments on what he wanted Saidit to be. If you've not seen those other comments, I can potentially find them for you, in his posts from long ago on Saidit and Reddit. Saidit - parts of it - did not become what he wanted it to be. And regarding "respectful, rational, conversations", that has happened. And given the amount of abuse I receive, especially from Chipit and others - without my prompting them to be abusive - I've had the patience of Job with these people, in order to develop conversations that will tell me more about their way of thinking. Thus I've learned a lot at Saidit, which as I've said many times before, was my reason for being here. Learning develops especially with debate and questions (per Socrates &c). I've had the thick skin that you note here.

      The question I've asked is related to moderation methodology, and you've not addressed that question. What you indicate in your comments is that you will interpret what is considered the "higher standard" for the moderator, and that you will interpret who is antagonistic, and that you want a 'wall' between the mod's actions and the user's actions. None of these are requirements for the moderator on any other sub. The tradition with moderators - as I've seen in the past 15 years at Reddit and as I've seen here at Saidit - is that they can and do argue with others in the subs, as you've done quite often. Do you see a double standard here?

      Did you follow a higher standard when you supported the ban of a moderator who had merely done hiw job? Did you see this as 'respectful' of the mod team and of a user? Did you unfairly see me as the the 'antagonistic' one in these conversations? Did you not appreciate that I do indeed have a thick skin on Saidit? (How many Democrats are here?) Did you - as a mod - consult the other mods when you made your decision? Have you deleted duplicate posts at /s/politics? Have you argued with anyone at /s/politics? None of my questions here about you specifically, but about the methods of a moderator. Per my original question, and per the points here, I've not done anything as a moderator that would qualify as a reason for banning me.

      [–]Chipit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

      Sure, with answers like "Asshole" https://saidit.net/s/NotTheOnion/comments/8dtd/public_servant_aoc_wears_tax_the_rich_dress_to/v3j8?context=3

      And "Bullshit" https://saidit.net/s/NotTheOnion/comments/8dtd/public_servant_aoc_wears_tax_the_rich_dress_to/v3j7?context=3

      And "You have anger issues, Rob?" https://saidit.net/s/politics/comments/8dc9/aoc_by_allowing_any_person_to_financially_destroy/v2i2?context=3

      And many other insults and violations of Saidit TOS.

      Not to mention the hardcore hate of Jimmy Dore specifically, which is what precipitated the mod abuse. "Dore acts like he's concerned about the 'left' while DEFINITELY supporting the extreme right wing, because he's constantly attacking politicians on the left."

      Get that, folks? Attacking a politician from the left means you're a nazi.

      [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

      Chipit - you're again conflating points in these arguments. None of this applies to the question. You seem not to know or want to know about any of this. Should I explain? Two of your links are taken out of context from other subs where I am not a mod. One of your links an example where I confront someone about their aggression, as mods can do. It's OK. And then you have factual errors: no there aren't "many other insults and violations". No there is no "hardcore hate of J. Dore" that relaes to anything. My disagreement with Dore or you or anyone else is not "hardcore hate". You apply here constant emotional reactions to what I write, as if you're a victim, whereas I am merely disagreeing. (This too is OK; it's not hate. People can argue.) And your other note here is that I am attacking someone and that I am a "nazi" or whatever. Really, Chipit.

      [–]Chipit 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

      Two of your links are taken out of context from other subs where I am not a mod.

      They are personal insults and in clear violation of Saidit TOS. This happens often from the socks account. Did one of the other people who posts under this social media influencer account write those?

      So, when people criticize AOC, it's hate. When Jimmy Dore criticizes the left, he's a nazi. But you are capable of disagreement.

      Everyone see why this user has no problem with censorship - as long as he/she/zir is the one doing it?

      [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

      No Chipit - none of this is related to the question about duplicate posts or the banning of a mod. It's that simple. Moreover, no one censored you. Removing a duplicate post helps you show more of your other posts on the /s/politics front page.

      [–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      You abused your moderator powers to remove a Jimmy Dore video just hours after stating in public how much you hate Jimmy Dore and that he's basically a nazi.

      [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      No Chipit - for reasons already discussed.