all 10 comments

[–]AmericanMuskrat 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

How do you define hate speech in a moderation algorithm (or manually moderate fairly) when there’s not a universally accepted definition?

I don't know what pornography is, but I know it when I jerk off to it.

I think an interesting idea is the freedom to hate. It's both beneficial and problematic. On one hand you should be able and free to feel as you wish. On the other it can incite bad behavior.

[–]speechduder[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Freedom to hate"... that's interesting concept for sure. I can honestly only imagine how that would be problematic to a respectful conversation with the "hated party", or used in any other way but to incite bad behavior, but I'd like to hear how it could be beneficial. As for freedom to feel as you wish, I completely agree with you.

[–]Xihaon 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

On one hand you should be able and free to feel as you wish.

The oppression here comes from nature, and the science to fight back isn't there yet. Organizations that purposefully incite hate without a disclaimer are violating our right to hate, lol. Epic, but hard to prove and prone to abuse.

[–]Xihaon 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Add that to how tech platforms have become just as powerful in controlling the modern flow of information as any tyrannical government throughout history, and we have a bit of a predicament.

Uh huh. Denying the opposition an ability to rent a server or to work with money surely had nothing to do with that.

The paradox of tolerance/intolerance states that unbridled tolerance of intolerant speech can only end one way…

When the government refuses to do its job and doesn't discourage/punish all physical violence.

Platforms like twitter, Facebook, and YouTube have simply resigned themselves to hiding behind generic community guidelines and conduct policies

What, you've never watched any documentary how the moderators on large platforms literally descend into madness? They do spend efforts, but it's never enough.

How much power are we willing to allow a company to have before we can agree it’s a bit too much for what’s reasonably acceptable?

Private armies are already illegal. What other advantages do you want the state to have?

How do you define hate speech

When hate is the only topic of a post/comment, its hate speech. Otherwise, it isn't.

to control the free flow and exchange of ideas and information

Free, yet controlled? Ha ha.

[–]speechduder[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Uh huh. Denying the opposition an ability to rent a server or to work with money surely had nothing to do with that. Who's the opposition and who's controlling the ability to rent a server? Are you referring to the IPV4/DNS situation? Shared IP host providers with allegiances?

When the government refuses to do its job and doesn't discourage/punish all physical violence. Are you referring to the riots and lack of police response? If so I completely agree. Violence is not speech. Although it's hard to tell what's actually happening out there with the level of censorship unless you've been watching live streams. Essentially why I advocate for the 1st to be able to applied to online mediums.

What, you've never watched any documentary how the moderators on large platforms literally descend into madness? They do spend efforts, but it's never enough. I honestly didn't know any documentaries like that were out there, but now I'm really interested in checking them out. If you could link some that would be cool. If not, I'll be searching.

Private armies are already illegal. What other advantages do you want the state to have? The only advantages I want the state to have are those based in protecting the rights of the people. In other words, the enforcement of the Constitution against what I see as something thats grown just as, if not more powerful than the state itself regarding threatening what I see as the purpose of the 1st Amendment.

When hate is the only topic of a post/comment, its hate speech. Otherwise, it isn't. Unfortunately, I don't think it's that simple. Unlike defining threats of violence, the problem lies in what people, with all their varying perceptions and experiences see as what defines "hate". Some think it's anything that offends others, some think it's racial slurs or derogatory statements etc.

Free, yet controlled? Ha ha. Yeah good call. Probably not the best choice of words. However, my point is that people should have the control of what they see or don't see rather than an information "proctor"

[–]Xihaon 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Who's the opposition and who's controlling the ability to rent a server? Are you referring to the IPV4/DNS situation? Shared IP host providers with allegiances?

I'm referring to the situations where large groups of people can't access existing infrastructure and are prevented from creating their own infrastructure. Such situations are more common than I'd want them to be. Sometimes this harassment goes all the way up to the state level. Lengthy fruitless investigations, freezing of funds. In the age of globalism, the dissidents tend to be despised by the powers globally.

[–]Xihaon 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Are you referring to the riots and lack of police response? If so I completely agree. Violence is not speech. Although it's hard to tell what's actually happening out there with the level of censorship unless you've been watching live streams. Essentially why I advocate for the 1st to be able to applied to online mediums.

You're underestimating terrorism, I think. People will show the middle finger, they will fight when not overwhelmed. But they will comply. Responding more often isn't enough. Any civilization that wants to avoid progressive enslavement will have to cut every instance of terrorism to the roots. Muslims and antifa know what they are doing.

[–]Xihaon 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The only advantages I want the state to have are those based in protecting the rights of the people. In other words, the enforcement of the Constitution against what I see as something thats grown just as, if not more powerful than the state itself regarding threatening what I see as the purpose of the 1st Amendment.

Power without an army is illusory. Even the strongest of them can be investigated and arrested. Constant real-time elections for some officials could make such cases more common.

1st Amendment is good, but don't underestimate the trolls. Bland enforcement can have unforeseen consequences.

[–]Xihaon 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Unfortunately, I don't think it's that simple. Unlike defining threats of violence, the problem lies in what people, with all their varying perceptions and experiences see as what defines "hate". Some think it's anything that offends others, some think it's racial slurs or derogatory statements etc.

Literally everything can be seen as hate. I'd rather not slide down this slippery slope. But constant harassment from trolls and advertiser can be bad for mental health.

I still think that the market can deal with this issue, with unrestricted access to infrastructure. So, just fight against the non-market harassment. Harder.

A situation when Trump gets half the votes and his voters are shown the door, shouldn't be possible.

[–]Xihaon 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I honestly didn't know any documentaries like that were out there, but now I'm really interested in checking them out. If you could link some that would be cool. If not, I'll be searching.

The Cleaners is the only big film I can find. I remember many shorter videos being there, but I can't find them for some reason. Google has a large selection of articles, though.