you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–]Vigte 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Obviously real estate on Earth is a limited resource. If you wanted to live on earth, you would need somewhere to live. But without money, and no pay (they all serve in starfleet to 'better themselves') this presumably must be allocated to you. How do you get a bigger house? Choose where to live? And how about if a house has been in your family for decades? Will the government take it away from you and give it to someone else? How are these limited resources allocated without money?

How can you know that anything you possess won't be taken away by the sinister Federation government in the name of 'the greater good'? Wouldn't this be an invitation for corruption since only political forces can allocate resources rather than a free market?

What do you guys think? Would you be happy giving up all your possessions - including those of sentimental value - for some vague notion of self-betterment?

Source

In any case, although millions of people have strong opinions on "The Communist Manifesto", very few of them have ever had the misfortune of actually reading this irrational gibberish. I am one of the unfortunate few who has read it (click here for the gory details), and it is definitely the blueprint (albeit with some modifications) for the Federation's socio-economic structure. If we disregard some of Karl Marx's dated agricultural ideas, the abridged version of the basic tenets of marxism are as follows:

Abolition of property rights. Government intervention in the buying and selling of goods increases by an order of magnitude. Investments are verboten. The concept of private property is virtually destroyed. Neo-marxists are quick to point out that Marx only wanted to eliminate "exploitative" capitalist property, rather than the personal property of the "artisan and craftsman". However, Marx never explained how to preserve one while eliminating the other. For example, at what point do Grandma's savings become exploitative capitalist investments? How do you criminalize one without criminalizing the other?. The result of his half-baked idea is a proposal which is impossible to implement, so real communist states have historically abolished all forms of private property (thus creating a vacuum which black marketeers sprang up to fill).

Source

The fact that Reddit users must argue for hours about whether money even exists or whether or not people can keep and bare arms attests to the poorly constructed psuedo-space-gommunism that some how goes

1) Sentient Robots being property, no money, barely any land ownership and only a single example of private gun ownership (without being called a "terrorist" ie: the Maquis Insurgency)(almost 50 years after the show began)

2) Work for self-betterment and apparently, no pay

3) ?

4) Space utopia/profit.

It's just not a good example, it fails to account for current human nature.

Yes it's possible - but quite literally not unless the world becomes severely depopulated and some kind of... one world government were to take control and "re-educate" the survivors into a new way of being human.

Doesn't sound like utopia to me, in fact it sounds like something I've heard joked about before:

Fully automated luxury gay space communism

[–]Mnemonic 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Star Trek Enterprise deals with the transitional period, political infighting (TNG also has a Federation infight episode as does DS9), other races with 'money', luxury. In Enterprise the family of the navigator are freighter workers etc.

Only in TOS it can be somewhat presumed to be a communist utopia.

One of the main things is, The Federation has (somehow) listened and 'fixed' the critiques on capitalism. For Americans critique on capitalism somehow equals commu/social/Marx-ism(s).

but quite literally not unless the world becomes severely depopulated and some kind of... one world government were to take control and "re-educate" the survivors into a new way of being human.

This happend in the ST universe.. There was the war with Khan, the genetic enhanced humans (TOS, TOS movie, Enterprise and the shitty reboot movie deal with this). There was a Global nuclear war and after that First contact with the Vulcans was made [See the Movie 'First Contact' from the TNG line https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_First_Contact {One of the, if not THE, best Star Trek movie}].

Step up your Trek game!

[–]Vigte 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

This happend in the ST universe.. There was the war with Khan, the genetic enhanced humans (TOS, TOS movie, Enterprise and the shitty reboot movie deal with this). There was a Global nuclear war and after that First contact with the Vulcans was made

Exactly my point! This kind of shift in society can only be seen through great suffering. The ends do not justify the means however and such a thing is to be avoided - especially since we know no intelligent people are waiting in the wings to develop what we see in this picture - rather, they intend something else.

Don't get me wrong, it's a fine idea - but it's not for us and if we set it as an end-goal there's only two things that can happen: failure or success - neither of which is desirable (as success requires the reset button on the collective human psyche and failure is... well failure.).

We as the people alive now need to focus on the bad shit and prevent it from happening. I'm not down with genetic war with Kahn and shit just so we can get to fly around in space gobbunism.

[–]Mnemonic 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Earth:Final Conflict suits this narrative.

Aliens who 'help' us (humanity) get better but they also have their own agenda and black ops going on.

Political intrigue including presidential rigging of elections and all, but the acting isn't on par with Star trek productions.

Edit: Thanks for making me think of this serie, I still have to watch the last season I just found out about :)

[–]Vigte 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Or... It can't happen here... I mean "V"

I'll check out Final Conflict now though, thanks for the suggestion!

I just don't think aliens are coming (not unless they are part of blue beam). It's another false saviour meant to quiet the anger while they get the final pieces in place.