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[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (70 children)

I feel bad that someone committed suicide, but the answer to his issues was not to pretend he was a woman.

Quite the opposite. It is the absence of gender affirming treatments that is associated with suicide in people with gender dysphoria.

Adolescents and adults with gender dysphoria without gender-affirming treatment might be at risk of thinking about or attempting suicide. - https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/gender-dysphoria/symptoms-causes/syc-20475255

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (35 children)

It is the absence of gender affirming treatments that is associated with suicide in people with gender dysphoria.

That study has been called into question.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (34 children)

It's not a study, it's the modern medical position of the mayo clinic based on all the research so far.

[–][deleted] 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (33 children)

The studies said antidepressants worked too. Gee, who would have figured the researchers at gender clinics didn't find their actions to be harmful. The fact is most of these trans identifying kids are obviously not trans, they're influenced by a social media fad and bad medical advice. Trooning out isn't going to help them.

[–]notafed 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I forgot, what's the count of people suing the Tavistock Clinic because they now regret their transitions and claim that they were basically rubber stamped into the procedures?

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Oh wow, I didn't even hear about that. 1000 families! Holy shit, that's a lot of mutilation! I feel like this is more than severe than a civil matter.

[–]Newzok 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah once you I saw the number I kind of zoned out. That's a lot of people who have been... Altered...

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (29 children)

It's not a study. It's the medical reality, based on all our current knowledge.

The fact is most of these trans identifying kids are obviously not trans, they're influenced by a social media fad and bad medical advice.

1) Most of which trans identifying kids.

2) Elaborate on "obviously"

3) Don't make shit up, link to the evidence.

4) What is "trooning out"

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (28 children)

It's not a study. It's the medical reality, based on all our current knowledge.

It's an agenda being pushed that warps science to fit its facts. We keep seeing it time and time again. Atypical antipsychotics, cox-2 inhibitors, and recently the covid vaccine were all bad bills of goods sold to us. There's a pattern here.

Don't make shit up, link to the evidence.

Go check out r/detrans for starters. I speak from personal experience though, I initially supported transgenderism until my niece started dating a pretend man, then her other friends started identifying as trans. The pretend man was obviously a girl. That means there wasn't a single masculine thing about her. She bound her breasts and peed in the wrong restroom. What a brave, brave man. We spent a lot of time with her, even went on family vacations together. It's ridiculous to humor her that she's a man. And the idea this is helping her in any form is ridiculous.

"trooning out"

It's when a person makes the transition from an autistic fag to a tranny.

Gender dysphoria is real, my friend u/Vulptex is pretty good proof of that, but even he doesn't like trannies. And these kids who make up the bulk of this movement, are just uncomfortable about puberty and confused. Many are autistic. Many believe transitioning will fix their anxiety or depression.

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I know of very few troons who are actually gay. They're all "lesbians" or obsessed with yaoi.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (26 children)

It's an agenda being pushed that warps science to fit its facts

No, it's just what he know about gender dysphoria. Nothing's being pushed.

Go check out r/detrans for starters.

No, I mean your specific claims. You've said "The fact is most of these trans identifying kids are obviously not trans, they're influenced by a social media fad and bad medical advice." What evidence do you have to support that, and what proportion do you mean by "most"?

It's when a person makes the transition from an autistic fag to a tranny.

Okay, what is an "autistic fag"?

Do you include transvestites in the term "tranny"?

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Most of those kids end up detransing, and there's way too many of them (trans people are a tiny minority of the population). It comes from its current trendiness, and schools pressuring them to transition if they don't fit a stereotype. What they're really trying to do is recruit people for something corrupt politicians have hijacked and made into a political statement. Why do you think right-wing Christians hate LGBT people so much? It's because in 99% of cases it no longer has anything to do with being lesbian, gay, bisexual or trans (why that's even included among sexualities I don't know), it's become more of a statement that you align with radical leftist agendas and also that you hate Christianity. Most of the people who hate them used to support them, until they were made into this sort of identity politics.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Most of those kids end up detransing, and there's way too many of them (trans people are a tiny minority of the population).

I think you're mistaken about that "most of these kids" statistic. Certainly trans people are a tiny minority of the population. Maybe 0.7% of the population.

Still. There's about 1.4 million in the US alone, so you shouldn't be shocked to meet one, and certainly not to see a photo of one on reddit.

It comes from its current trendiness, and schools pressuring them to transition if they don't fit a stereotype.

That's very difficult to believe.

What they're really trying to do is recruit people for something corrupt politicians have hijacked and made into a political statement.

Batshit crazy grand conspiracy theories are even more difficult to believe.

Why do you think right-wing Christians hate LGBT people so much?

Studies show that Christians are more hateful to any out-group than atheists. Maybe it's fear of the devil in things they aren't familiar with.

Most of the people who hate them used to support them, until they were made into this sort of identity politics.

This, too, is very difficult to believe.

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Maybe 0.7% of the population.

Well if we get rid of all these gender role restrictions and anime fetishes it's probably more like 0.001% of the population. That's me, but I don't think I know a single other one. I know a few who think they are, but it's because it's their "identity" or because they watched too many traps in anime. That's clearly not the same thing. Another group only does it to join the community, which has become similar to things like furries. Most of them do not take hormones (or if they do, it's only so they can get tits and then they stop) and have completely normal behavior and sexuality for their natal sex. And they are usually literal Stalinists who have blind loyalty to the SJW movement and screech at anyone who misgenders them. Cis people get misgendered all the time, why don't they have the same reaction? Then there's all these weird pronouns as if people don't know which ones go with which gender, and completely made-up xenogenders that make us look like a joke. All they ever talk about is how they're trans, and horrifically, often they brag about how blessed they are to be so! Anyone who likes it obviously does not have this condition, or they would know how miserable and hopeless it is.

and certainly not to see a photo of one on reddit.

Why is it that they make up something like 95% of reddit mods? Surely they're not being influenced by their extreme SJW groupthink that says all cis white men are bad...but are they?

Batshit crazy grand conspiracy theories are even more difficult to believe.

It's not "batshit crazy", it's a fact. Don't tell me you haven't seen how the radical left has hijacked trans people and weaponized them, deceiving most of them into following their agenda. They're trying to recruit people through identity politics, plain and simple. Otherwise why would we even be relevant to politics?

Studies show that Christians are more hateful to any out-group than atheists. Maybe it's fear of the devil in things they aren't familiar with.

Or maybe it's because this radical agenda to destroy Christianity and infiltrate their opposition to it into everything else has made Christians frightened and angry. Fundamentalism is at an all-time high, because everything else is being painted as an enemy of God. And the more the radical anti-Christian left irritates them, the more radical they become to push back. If the same people who want to ban Christianity scream support for LGBT at the top of their lungs, what do you expect Christians to think? Of course they're now going to see LGBT as a threat, because their enemy supports it. If it weren't for this, I bet the majority of churches wouldn't have a problem with it anymore. But now they've flocked backwards and fled to 1950s gender roles because their persecutors are also persecuting that. Have you heard of the Streisand effect? The radical left is really asking for it. It's almost as if they want Christians to turn into the caricatures they've made them out to be so they can say, "See, look we need to get rid of them!". And unfortunately the bait is being swallowed.

This, too, is very difficult to believe.

I have seen countless people say "I used to support them, but the left changed my mind". Even irl people everywhere have become increasingly weary and hateful of anything the radical left associates with themselves, because everyone has had absolutely enough of it and they're ready to do anything it takes to fight it at this point. Three years ago no one was racist or sexist and few hated LGBT, some simply did not agree with it personally because of religious reasons, which is completely valid. Now they're somewhat afraid of black people and hard into 1950s gender roles and think LGBT people should receive the death penalty. And it's because the people claiming it for their movement are burning down entire cities and throwing tantrums on live TV about how everyone is a "bigot" and needs to be sent to the gulag for "hate speech", and saying religion should be banned because they're literal communists. Guilt by association.

[–]Femaleisnthateful 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

More so than Muslims? I'd like to see your 'studies'

[–]Haylstorm 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

It's def pushed.

https://segm.org/GIDS-puberty-blockers-minors-the-times-special-report

Entwistle was astonished when her clinical partner cited a female patient’s early love of Thomas the Tank Engine as evidence she should be referred to endocrinology. “This girl was horribly bullied and called a ‘dyke’,” she says. “It blew my mind that a toy was used as evidence for medical transition. My partner said, ‘Oh, but she hates her periods.’ I said, ‘But so do many girls.’ ” This patient was not referred and later, at sixth form where she ceased being bullied, told GIDS her dysphoria was resolved. “Yet she could easily have been put on a medical pathway,” says Entwistle

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

SEGM have an agenda.

I don't know anything about the anecdote in question, but it's an anecdote. It's neither data nor policy.

[–]Haylstorm 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's an article from the times that they've archived, the clinic in question is having over 1000 families suing it for shit like this. 1000 families. That's more than just an anecdote.

https://www.medscape.co.uk/viewarticle/1000-families-sue-tavistock-gender-service-2022a10021ac

Accept that it's pushed. If it wasn't they wouldn't be being sued by that many people for PUSHING it.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

No, it's just what he know about gender dysphoria. Nothing's being pushed.

I'm telling you it's bullshit, like the other bullshit narratives I mentioned. Come on man, develop your critical thinking. Don't trust the official bullshit, it's hurting kids.

what proportion do you mean by "most"?

It's defined as "greatest in number."

Do you include transvestites in the term "tranny"?

It's just a negative term. Celebrating deviancy is not a fantastic idea, that's how we end up with kids aspiring to adopt identities they do not actually have.

Okay, what is an "autistic fag"?

It's literally what it sounds like. Autism + homosexuality. Read r/detrans, see what your bullshit is causing.

What evidence do you have to support that,

My thinking comes from my niece and her friend group and her experiences with the overall student body and then overall interactions online. You can call that a sample group. These are my conclusions from observing their behavior. You can read whatever you want and say, look this article says this so it must be true, but I can't ignore what's right in front of me.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

I'm telling you it's bullshit, like the other bullshit narratives I mentioned.

I'll take on board that that's your opinion.

But the evidence is that you're wrong about that.

It's defined as "greatest in number."

And in this case, what is that number?

It's just a negative term. Celebrating deviancy is not a fantastic idea, that's how we end up with kids aspiring to adopt identities they do not actually have.

Suspect you're wrong about that causes of transexualism.

It's literally what it sounds like. Autism + homosexuality. R

Would you consider yourself and autistic fag?

These are my conclusions from observing their behavior.

I question your ability to make sound conclusions from your observations.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

And in this case, what is that number?

That's not how that works person who may just be yet another socks account.

Would you consider yourself and autistic fag?

I have been called autistic. I've never been diagnosed as such. Fag? Well, I mean, ten years in prison without women, and I'll learn to love the cock.

I question your ability to make sound conclusions from your observations.

Watch the shit I call and how it comes out true. You don't have to take my word for it.

[–]jet199 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Nope, suicide rates increase after transition and more so after surgery.

No point linking to an article written by lobby groups, look at the actual research.

https://segm.org/ajp_correction_2020

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/

[–]alladd 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

because it doesn't fix the narcissism that creates their delusion. so the second they experience any kind of hard self-reflection and realize how far they've gone, their ego will be so damaged that they are provoked to suicide.

most people who attempt suicide can at least walk back or reverse some of their issues with time. but you can't undo mutilation.

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

It can go both ways. It's because they realize their last hope was a false one.

[–]jet199 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Also partly not to do with transition at all.

Most trans people have a personality disorder and they have very high suicide rates. BPD is 20% die by suicide.

[–]Haylstorm 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's actually quite sad. Some people are clearly genuine and being sold a lie about how this will make them a woman. Then the reality hits. It's really irresponsible by the medical practises.

[–]alladd 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

it's just narcissism. wanting to be the main character + exposure to sex from the internet or whatever = wanting to be the bestest sex object ever and tying all your pride and self-worth to being a pervert.

transitioning feeds the ego for a little while, but the delusion needs more and more to maintain itself, often in the form of compelled speech or increasingly extreme behaviors. if that momentum is interrupted, and the person has a moment of self-reflection, suicide is not far off. you can only lie to yourself for so long.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

I don't think that's what narcissism is.

People with NPD aren't transexual.

[–]alladd 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

yes they are. NPD and BPD are the most common comorbidities found in trans patients.

but you said yourself you don't know what narcissism is. so maybe you don't know what i'm talking about.

narcissism is main character syndrome. in practice it manifests as lack of empathy, selfishness, and a preternatural entitlement to one's chosen "story". for some narcissists, this means being treated as famous. for some, it's being treated as an object of desire.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

yes they are. NPD and BPD are the most common comorbidities found in trans patients.

Are you making this up?

Among TGNC adolescents, depressive disorders were most common (transfeminine 49%; transmasculine 62%) compared with other diagnostic categories.

[–]alladd 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7084367/

an overall prevalence of PDs of 52% was found, with 22% prevalence of Cluster B PDs (with narcissistic PD showing the highest prevalence in the overall sample)

your linked study doesn't appear to have studied for NPD or doesn't differentiate between it and "personality disorders" in general.

also narcissism is hard to detect and narcissists don't self-report it, so in lieu of a more critical approach i could see it being grouped under "depressive disorder".

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

also narcissism is hard to detect and narcissists don't self-report it, so in lieu of a more critical approach i could see it being grouped under "depressive disorder".

I couldn't. There are diagnostic criteria.

[–]alladd 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

the prevalence of comorbid NPD is well documented elsewhere and widely acknowledged among trans communities.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Just not as prevalent as depression.

[–]alladd 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

you know how diagnosing depression works right? there's no medical test; they don't draw blood.

they just ask, "are you depressed?" - or worse, you show up having self-diagnosed, and they accept it because they don't get paid unless they diagnose and medicate.

a narcissist would be the first kind of person to link all their problems to a nonspecific "depression", because they are depressed by the cognitive dissonance they experience when the world doesn't validate them and tell their story the way they want. it is a symptom of their pathology, not a disorder in itself. there is no such thing as a chemical imbalance.

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

And then the treatments barely work and they still commit suicide. There is no escape.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Quite the opposite. Hormone therapy and social transition generally resolves suicidal ideation, as well as other mental health issues.

"Transgender young people often present with severe depression, anxiety, and even suicidal ideation related to their gender dysphoria. Although some clinicians might consider these diagnoses as a contraindication for a major medical procedure such as hormone therapy, frequently their symptoms are significantly alleviated by social and physical transition. Even major psychiatric disorders such as major depressive disorder and bipolar disorder are frequently “cured” when gender identity issues are addressed." - https://www.psychiatryadvisor.com/home/topics/gender-dysphoria/is-it-just-a-phase-what-to-do-when-transgender-youths-ask-to-transition/

(Reference at the linked site)

[–]jacques1102 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

And does that make it morally right?Why is it that when it comes to other mental illness that the cure is for the person to seek psychological help and not play into their delusion?I know a person that was obsessed with pokemon and was depressed about the fact that he wasn't born into the world.You know what made them happy?Making them a character and then deluding them into believing that they were apart of the world.Does that make it morally right even though the person was happy believing in his delusion?

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I would say that stopping them being unhappy and in particular, killing themselves it does make it morally better.

It also implies that its not a delusion. If the treatment is works, it's likely that the diagnosis is correct. Delusions aren't a symptom of gender dysphoria.

I don't know how the pokemon disorder is best treated. It's unlikely to be related to gender dysphoria, so plausibly the best treatments would be unrelated.

[–]jacques1102 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

"It also implies that it's not a delusion".How does believing that you're the opposite sex despite the obvious evidence to the contrary not a delusion?The entire brain argument falls apart when nobody can define what a female brain is.Does it make you more likely to be into feminine things?If so then what about tomboys who never show any gender dysphoria?Are they trans in denial?Or does it show something else?Can you give an answer that doesn't resort to gender stereotypes?This is where i feel trans activist are trapped cause they can't do that,but then act like said stereotypes shouldn't define someone's womanhood.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How does believing that you're the opposite sex despite the obvious evidence to the contrary not a delusion?

There's lots of aspects to a person's sex. There's genitalia, which can be indeterminate. But the brain also different between men and women. When that's also indeterminate, or opposite to the genitalia, then you have a problem that can be diagnosed and treated. If you treat it with gender affirmation, you get much better outcomes, and you usually alleviate other psychiatric disorders that might be present.

The entire brain argument falls apart when nobody can define what a female brain is.

We know what a female brain does. So the test is to ask the patient. You certainly have to do it over a period of time, and look for consistency.

If so then what about tomboys who never show any gender dysphoria?Are they trans in denial?

No.

Can you give an answer that doesn't resort to gender stereotypes?

Again, the diagnosis is established by talking to the patient.

[–]Vulptexghost fox girl ^w^ 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Hormones and surgeries might work okay if you're FtM and don't have major problems with your genitals. Otherwise you're fucked because once you're male there's really no way to go back to female. If you're extremely lucky you can disguise yourself to look like it but that won't fix you on the inside.

What we really need is a way to prevent this, and for those already afflicted only very extreme treatments could work, like changing their gender or putting them in a different body.

[–]Femaleisnthateful 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Jazz Jennings must be an outlier

[–]TaseAFeminist4Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

What a crock of shit.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

... because ... ?

[–]TaseAFeminist4Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Well, for one thing that's not a study with an experiment or sources, it's just an articulation of the official "party line." And it's coming from an organization that wants to sell us goods and services. I've seen paid ads from the Mayo Clinic trying to sell disgusting crap like "gynecological services for trans men."

Beyond that, the claim made is so lukewarm that it's meaningless. "Adolescents and adults with gender dysphoria without gender-affirming treatment might be at risk of thinking about or attempting suicide" - yeah, and I "might be" Joe Montana. Hey, he's not dead and he probably has internet, right?

I know the whole suicide thing is being used as a cudgel to get parents on board with the idea of sexually mutilating their kids. "Let your 'AMAB' child take titty-making pills or, well, guess 'she' will just kill 'herself.'" Try it on me and I'll call your bluff. Or maybe I'll just punch you in the nose.

You people should be driven into the sea for this.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Well, for one thing that's not a study with an experiment or sources, it's just an articulation of the official "party line."

A single study might be misleading or not. This is the position of the Mayo Clinic. They don't have a party line.

I've seen paid ads from the Mayo Clinic trying to sell disgusting crap like "gynecological services for trans men."

If that disgusts you, don't buy it. But if you wan't people who want those services to stop using them, you should get over yourself and stay in your lane.

yeah, and I "might be" Joe Montana. Hey, he's not dead and he probably has internet, right?

In the medical sense they mean that some of the adolescents and adults with gender dysphoria without gender-affirming treatment will be at increased risk of thinking about or attempting suicide, but not all of them.

I know the whole suicide thing is being used as a cudgel to get parents on board with the idea of sexually mutilating their kids.

No one is sexually mutilating kids ... except religious people doing circumcisions.

And they should be driven into the sea for that.

[–]TaseAFeminist4Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

some of the adolescents and adults with gender dysphoria without gender-affirming treatment will be at increased risk of thinking about or attempting suicide, but not all of them.

That's equally meaningless. How much is "some"? My take is that "some" means "fewer than are driven to suicide by so-called 'gender-affirming care'." I don't have any data on that, but I've shown you what a meaningful statement looks like. The Mayo Clinic doesn't have the data to support their claim, either, or they would make their own meaningful statement on the matter.

A single study might be misleading or not. This is the position of the Mayo Clinic. They don't have a party line.

WTF do you even think a party line is that is different from a position?

If that disgusts you, don't buy it.

"Disgusting" is an objective quality, not a personal preference.

No one is sexually mutilating kids ... except religious people doing circumcisions.

This is just neckbeardy as fuck. Circumcision didn't turn me into an objectionable public spectacle. Didn't do much of anything.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Wanted to let you know that i read this.

I didn't think you raised any new points that aren't prima facie wrong.

[–]TaseAFeminist4Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Que ridículo.