all 11 comments

[–]AXXA🙏🏿 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Today I learned philology is the historical study of literature and language.

[–]Electronic_Antelope 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

From philo- "love" and logos "word"

[–]IkeConn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Mammy.

[–]jet199 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Funnily enough Al Jolson still hasn't been cancelled because he was too good to hate on.

[–]Horror-Swordfish 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

On one hand, I get it - it's very jarring to see the photos and they could definitely be characterized as blackface. It's also strange that they don't just hire black singers (although, I don't know the racial makeup of Italy and how easy it is for them to find black singers).

On the other hand, I also understand what the festival people are saying when they say that they are not doing a "new production," they are doing a "historical production," and it's meant to be viewed more as a living museum piece. I don't think it's a good idea to erase history, even the bad parts of it, because that's how we all grow and learn.

[–]exiled_from_reddit 10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

On one hand, I get it - it's very jarring to see the photos and they could definitely be characterized as blackface

spare us your American 'sensitivity'. On what grounds you want to impose your very particular trouble with some obscure 19th century skits on the whole world? Because you have the strongest army? GTFO.

It's also strange that they don't just hire black singers

There is nothing strange in that, particularly in Italy you apparently know nothing about.

[–]Horror-Swordfish 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I get you - I don't really know Italian culture or the makeup of the population of the country. I think you may be reading my remarks as a criticism of the culture, but they really weren't. Just because I said "it's strange" doesn't mean I think anything in particular is wrong, I just think it's strange. I'm sure there are plenty of things about American culture that you find strange but I wouldn't think that means you think American culture is wrong.

What I'm saying is that, if you are going to have a global platform, it's at least worth considering how things might look to everyone that would be viewing your work. To an American, what's happening is objectively blackface. I personally think that blackface needs to have some element of malice to it, which this situation obviously doesn't, but I can see why Americans would look at that and say, "That's blackface."

I notice that you didn't bother to quote the second part of my comment, where I said I completely understand the viewpoint of the festival people and actually agree with their assessment of the situation and their reasoning behind the casting and makeup choices. It's an opera that's historically been done a certain way and they are showing that particular version. It's not a big deal to me. But I appreciate that the festival reps gave a thoughtful response rather than just "spare us your American 'sensitivity' ... GTFO."

Understanding why people think one way is different from supporting that viewpoint, and the festival reps gave a response that would hopefully help people understand their viewpoint rather than just saying "suck it assholes, I don't care what you think." That sort of thing only serves to keep people divided and hating each other.

[–]exiled_from_reddit 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Thank you for your thoughtful response. However no matter how conciliatory you are, you unfortunately fail to grasp that some non Americans are really, really tired of your cultural imperialism.

I'm sure there are plenty of things about American culture that you find strange but I wouldn't think that means you think American culture is wrong.

Yes. But even when I think it's clearly wrong the crucial thing is I'm not travelling to let's say Dallas to enlighten local population about the moral wrongness of their ways. I'm not in charge of some of Dallas media. And I'm definitely not sponsoring local Dallas residents to promote changing the Texans ways of life.

Yet that's definitely what happens in the other direction. The situation here is completely asymmetrical, you feel the opera owes you explanation why their scenic make up looks the way it looks. It doesn't. And you are completely not interested in explaining yourselves why you try to push your views on Europe.

The opera indeed unfortunately gave the thoughtful response, while 'GTFO' was a preferable one.

If you don't like the idea of being sent to hell over the issue, and you really want to stick your concept of 'blackface' up our ass, then we are at least fully in right to proselytise how deeply retarded it is.

[–]On_WheelsWe need to secure the existence of the gay race 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

The opera indeed unfortunately gave the thoughtful response, while 'GTFO' was a preferable one.

Based

Got to agree on the general sentiment. Americans believe they have this self-appointed right to moralize and correct cultures in other parts of the world, when they have barely a culture of their own.

[–]Jewishnigger 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Mm

[–]Horror-Swordfish 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You know, I actually agree with you on that. I don't think that I was making a judgment call, but my comment was informed by my personal worldview. Since I am an American, I obviously don't deal with Americans telling me I'm backward for my beliefs (well, I do, but that's more of a "this side vs that side" thing and not something that could necessarily be viewed as an attack on my culture).

I still think that the opera's response was the best one - again, if you're opening yourself up to everyone in the world, I don't think it's productive to just say "go fuck yourself" if you're met with any questioning. It's like going on your public TikTok account and saying something controversial and being shocked that there may exist people that disagree with you. And I think it's important to try and understand each other.

That being said, the people that typically complain about things like this are so militant and make no effort to try and understand the other side, so... yeah, I get where you're coming from. I would like to point out that I, personally, am not interested whatsoever in forcing the opera to stop doing what they're doing, and I'm actually disappointed that the end of the article they talk about making changes for future performances. But I think you're talking more about Americans in general than me in particular, right? If that's the case, you're absolutely right. I don't think anyone has any business trying to force their ideals on anyone else. And given the history of how Americans have treated Europeans... well, let me put it this way: I still don't think it's productive to be hostile to other people, but it's understandable.

I'd also like to thank you for a thoughtful response; it was actually pretty enlightening and helped me see your viewpoint more clearly, so I'm sorry if I seemed dismissive before.