re privacy concerns on saidit

submitted by panel30 from self.SaidIt

from the welcome message I got:

WARNING: there are known law enforcement and/or intelligence operatives and/or paid manipulators present on this site. DO NOT REVEAL ANY PERSONAL INFORMATION or click on suspicious links without hiding your true ip address.

So what exactly are the concerns here? What happens if you don't follow this advice? How do you know if a link is suspicious?

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[–]Alienhunter 6 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

It's the public internet. Assume that anyone can see what you do. Since duh, you are publishing material that is accessible to the public. If law enforcement wants to find you they can. If the site owners want to give your IP logs to law enforcement, or anyone. They can.

Nothing you do is really anonymous online. You don't want to publish personal information not because law enforcement can get it, they can get it anyway. You don't want to do it because you'll get crazy people harassing you because they don't like something you said.

If I said my name was Marry Poppins and I lived at number 16 cherry tree lane. You can expect that I'd be getting signed up for annoying newsletters and junk mail and shite from some idiot. Could also send you harassment mail in real life. Death threats bomb threats whatever dumb shit insane internet types do.

Are they legit? Usually not, the problem is you can't tell the trolls from the truly criminal so you've got to take shit seriously.

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Thanks this is helpful. Who is it that the message is trying to warn us about though? intelligence operatives, law enforcement, paid manipulators ... that might or might not have the resources or interest to acquire IP information.

[–]Alienhunter 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

It's just typical conspiratorial paranoia. All those people exist and might be here. And nothing you do is truly private. But they also don't give a fuck about you unless you do something to bother them. They can't fuck with random people too much or else it will backfire on them.

The inner party doesn't care to police the proles so much as they care to control the outer party.

[–]chottohen 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

NordVPN is a good one.

[–]pandorasbox 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Sure, but who owns and operates nordvpn?

[–]chottohen 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

You have asked a really good question. As we approach the singularity, when all companies will be owned by BlackRock or similar, it will be impossible to have any privacy. For now, here is an answer: https://www.technadu.com/who-owns-nordvpn/295187/

[–]pandorasbox 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You are beyond the point of no return.. the war is well under way... The majority of our world governments are now controlled by a single entity, which appears to be the world economic forum and the world health organization..

Notice that both begin with the word "world"

You are wasting your time voting in elections.

Also, I do realize that this will be difficult to accept, but the new world government has in place a rock solid plan to reduce our world population down to ten percent of what it is, to less than five hundred billion.

Life, as we knew it even a few decades ago, is now only a memory.

Good day.

[–]chottohen 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

You know nothing of me or my history of not voting. You asked a question and I tried to answer it. Now you're on your own.

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Nonsense.

There are a small group of corporations that run most VPNs.

[–]LynchTheGroomers 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Why would the law enforcement and intelligence operatives be here? I can see why paid manipulators are here but the others? Don't be so timid, Kanye West says everything you whisper each other on here publicly on TV. So long as you're not a celebrity like Kanye or Andrew Tate they don't care to put you in the gulag.

[–]binaryblob 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They are here, because they would collect information on where the troll farms are.

[–]panel30[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

[edited]

that's a fair point about Kanye West but people do at least occasionally get gone after, right? Andrew Tate got gone after and I don't know if it's for actual crimes or to suppress something.

little people get gone after by the cancelers, if they are connected with intelligence or law enforcement.

[–]LynchTheGroomers 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Probably they've gone after Tate for the things he said. If you notice whether it's the media or the soy cucks on the street when asked about Andrew Tate's arrest they say: "HAHA GOOOD! HE WAS A MISOGYNISTIC BLAHBLAH". Media also the similar reaction. Hmmm? Why not "GOOD HE WAS A HUMAN TRAFFICKER!" He got arrested for human trafficking allegations not for "misogyny". It's like they know he's likely innocent. The reason they say they are glad he's arrested is not because "human trafficking" but because of the things he says. That's clown world. It's like they arrest a pedophile and the people are like "GOOOD! HE WAS SEXIST!" WHAT?

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (27 children)

The same concerns I'd have anywhere else on the internet. With respect to IP address, if you aren't taking measures to hide it, you are certainly being tracked by something. Just how concerned this would make me would depend on upon what I was saying here and what my other trackable internet activity was, and whether or not law enforcement might be interested in these things

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (26 children)

If I don't do anything illegal am I ok? Other than advertising profiling?

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

Yeah if your open-to-the-internet activities are not illegal, or associated with illegal activities, I would not be particularly worried. I don't care who wants to track me looking up reference tables, or posting news links, so I don't bother concealing anything for that

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

Is there a good way to hide your IP? Depending on who you're trying to hide it from? I had heard of TOR but somebody said that's not working anymore.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

TOR is a pretty good way to hide your IP address. Whether its good enough or not depends on the threat. Now, if you are making yourself a high priority military threat by frequenting terrorist sites, you are talking about a different threat model, and I would expect that you might be subject to techniques where TOR is not going to be foolproof. Someone with impressive capabilities would likely have to be significantly motivated to track you while using Tor. If you are pirating media or buying drugs on the darkweb or something for personal use, TOR is probably good enough for that threat. If you are doing terrorism or trafficking in illegal goods, I'd be far less confident in TOR alone

As far as other options to protect privacy. TailsOS is a very privacy focused linux distro, and running it off a bootable drive or virtual machine can protect you from some attacks that might break your anonymity when using Tor. A VPN also adds another layer of indirection, preferably one located in a very non-friendly place like Russia, as I don't much care if they know I'm breaking the law. Using public wifi is another option, though I would take care to spoof my MAC address in that case

[–]pandorasbox 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Tor sucks ass. It's glitchy.. it loses its connection... And, it is not secure... Who owns the relay computers..

I promise that if you host a site on for and start selling dope, the authorities will know who you are within about ten minutes.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I promise that if you host a site on for and start selling dope, the authorities will know who you are within about ten minutes.

Thats pretty much what I said dude, can you not read?

If you are doing terrorism or trafficking in illegal goods, I'd be far less confident in TOR alone

[–]pandorasbox 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Do you ever wonder why every site on the net requires an email to register, but saidit does not?

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I thought saidit was just removing an annoyance from reddit. Since you can just make a new email address anyway. I don't like it when those sites try to make you give them an email and phone number.

[–]pandorasbox 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I have tracked clicks on this site a couple of times.. as soon as I post a link that is able to log accesses, aa Russian server hits it immediately

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

that means it's indexing links on this site?

[–]pandorasbox 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

109% correct. The Russian server accesses my tracker links within a few minutes or moments of my posting it.

It could be cloudflare that is sending them to search here, I don't know what causes them to know about my posts here as quickly as they do.

[–]Vulptex 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Reddit didn't do this until after the last open-source commit, which is why saidit doesn't have it. You actually don't have to give your email to reddit either, they just make it look like you do. If you leave it blank it'll still work.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

That's the FBI. They're able to access private information via subpoena. Usually they can't with TOR, but in a limited number of cases they pulled it off, when they got lucky. This has always been the case and should not come as a surprise.

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I didn't realize they'd compromised it before. It sounded like this poster knew about something recent and new, though, something more than has happened before.

[–]Vulptex 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The FBI probably operates their own TOR circuits. If you happen to get one of theirs, they have your real information.

There's other clever tricks besides just getting client information. Investigators have filled suspects' content with zero-width spaces, which are normally invisible. The FBI even runs illegal websites themselves to catch criminals.

[–]Alphix 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I use TOR-on-VPN.

[–]binaryblob 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, use a VPN from a private citizen from a different country.

[–]Vulptex 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

It's impossible not to do anything illegal with technology.

[–]panel30[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

impossible?

[–]Vulptex 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And if someone hacks your device and does anything of these things, you are just as guilty as them simply because it is your device. It's impossible to avoid breaking the law a lot of times, even if you could somehow keep track of all of them.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

There's so many laws for the digital world that practically everything is illegal in some way. It seems the government decided the Bill of Rights doesn't apply to technology.

Did you use the internet in any way before you were 13? You broke the law. Did you view an image or video containing copyrighted material, even unintentionally because it just showed up online? You're a filthy criminal. Have you ever used anything in a way that isn't exactly as the creators intended? You violated DRM laws. Ever ban evaded? You're a hacker in the eyes of the law. Did your web browser download anything illegal in its temp files or caches? The government is now allowed to destroy all your data. Ever come across an illegal website by accident? You're guilty of all its crimes. We use anonymous usernames on saidit and other sites. For that we're frauds, because technically you are required by law to use your real name (don't do that though). Of course in most cases these things are never enforced, but they are technicalities. Even just breaking the rules on a website is usually illegal. And pretty much anything you say can be labeled misinformation or libel or something of that sort. There's just so many laws it would be shorter to list the things you are allowed to do than the things you're not allowed to do.

On a really technical level you can barely turn a gadget on without breaking some ridiculous law. And you definitely can't get online without breaking the law.

[–]Alphix 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

WHAT? Where's the law that says you have to use your real name?

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

IIRC it's geared at frauds and impersonators on websites like Facebook where everyone uses their real name, but they forgot about anonymous sites. I've never heard of anyone getting in trouble for having an anonymous username.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh, and using public wifi is as serious a crime as first degree murder, and "cyberbullying" and "hate speech" is illegal too. Or even anything "disturbing" or unpopular. Seems the first amendment doesn't apply to the digital world.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

By the way, some of these technicalities were used to justify killing Aaron Swartz.

[–]In-the-clouds 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Nothing you do online is anonymous.

Soon, no financial transaction will be anonymous, either. Today we could use cash as legal tender for a private debt, but soon that option will be gone. Then the mark of the beast will be forced on all that want to buy or sell anything. A mark will be in their right hand or on their forehead, as Jesus warned us.

People should fear God and not anyone else. If people realized that God sees everything they do and even think, they would be ashamed of themselves. (I am ashamed of my own sins, but thank the Lord for his act of salvation on the cross so that my guilt is removed.)

Every idle word that man speaks, he shall have to give an account for on the day of judgment. Fear God, not man.

[–]Vulptex 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Use TOR, and the IP grabbers and such will only be able to see fake identifiers.

Never click a link from a troll or known bad actor without knowing what site it leads you to. Don't go on their personal or private websites without first masking your identity.

It's very unlikely that someone will be able to track you down using just your IP Address. You'd have to subpoena the ISP to do that. However it will reveal your general area, which still isn't good.

[–]pandorasbox 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It is really not terribly difficult to inject links into an off the shelf forum like saidit that track hits and ip addresses.

I find it interesting that every tracker that I posted was Russian in origin.

[–]SoCo 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

VPNs and TOR help, but they do not give you full anonymity. Fingerprinting can track you across browsers, webpages, and even machines. Matching you up between them is much easier for a web page you've gone to with both. Such as going to Reddit from both your TorBrowser, then later your Chrome Browsers without logging in, likely has a chance that Reddit Admins could match the two visits up. If you do both at the same time, you are much more likely to be matched up. Click some links and you expose similarly opportunities to the website owner.

[–]panel30[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Interesting, and helpful to know. Thank you.

[–]Shoah_Kahn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If people aren't using burner e-mails and posting actual, private details on forums, they deserve to be e-raped as much as Branch CoVIDiots deserve express charter vaxes to Valhalla.