Saidit's level of discourse seems to be back

submitted by RuckFeddit from self.SaidIt

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[–]JasonCarswell 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

Truth.

I'd like to see a more democratic process. However Socrates has a good point that the uneducated with the power of democracy is dangerous. So perhaps M7 could distribute and delegate to his trusted aids who have earned his trust for a kind of high council to oversee a dedicated open forum for finding solutions.

[–]send_nasty_stuff 8 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 3 fun -  (5 children)

The problem is that the 'pyramid of debate' is a ruse. I believe in spirited debate that's devoid of fallacy and attack but not all social media is a 'debate' much of it is comedy, rhetoric, propaganda, art, etc. Creating a pyramid of debate as the metric applied across all communities essentially allows what ever king who is in charge of applying it an ultimate power to decide what is and isn't comedy or rhetoric or bad faith argument. A 'council' doesn't solve the problem. Maybe create a two tier site that has 'debate' subs and 'open' subs. Open subs would have their own space and their own rules. "debate" subs would be required to follow the pyramid.

It would be a little like reddits 'quarantine' function but with no negative stigma.

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

I agree that too much of the "judgements" are arbitrary, without clear examples, but I do like the simplicity and clarity of much of the Pyramid. For example, name-calling is obvious, refuting the core idea is obvious, etc. However, "downward" is not always so cut and dried with much undefined grey area leaving a LOT up to subjective authoritarian use/abuse. To add more confusion, "comedy" is all in the eye of the beholder.

Correct: A council does not solve ALL problems. It diffuses it and make it a systemic problem. Instead of fighting a single "enemy" you'd be fighting an entrenched "system". However, considering that SaidIt is an anti-authority platform (my words, not M7s) run by one dude it needs all the help it can get. If that means delegating the problem-solving to his minions under his veto-powered control, then that might lessen his burden, give him more time to do other things, make things run smoother - and remove much of the "human error" that is inevitably going to happen under one person.

Anyone can make their own instance of SaidIt, federated or not - or other similar forum platforms. With two-tiers or more.

I've considered starting a sub to discuss building a new SaidIt clone, how it would be open, transparent, democratic, etc. including predetermining new rules, how subs are created, managed, a new voting system, bot rules, and the need for metatags. Whether it's using SaidIt code or not, it would be nice to federate it too.

[–]send_nasty_stuff 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Have you looked into lemmy?

https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/hhce69/lemmy_an_opensource_federated_reddit_alternative/

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I know about it, but I don't know the community. I hear they've stalled in their federating efforts. I also heard they're commies though I don't know if that was a joke or exaggeration of the old-left or if they really are far left.

I don't like communism (nor capitalism), I have respect for some Marxism (ie. authentic informed democracy, authentic ground-up movements, all open cooperatives), and deeply care about decentralization.

[–]send_nasty_stuff 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think they 'stalled' on the federation efforts on purpose. Some fascists were starting to mess around with the platform and liked it (me and the boys) and I wouldn't be surprised if they were bought off to essentially halt the project.

People that design decentralized systems need to know that they are going to attract all types of groups but especially dissidents. That just goes with the terf. If your platform doesn't support/allow genuine dissidents then it's not a truly decentralized platform.

[–]justcool393 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

this is already the case somewhat. there are rules for moderators but if you don't want to follow them you can get off /s/all. using the quarantine function has much larger implications and is way more restrictive than removal from /s/all.