Supporting the veil?

submitted by Maryam from self.PinkPillFeminism

Very controversial opinion coming up -

Im an exMuslim woman in Pakistan. Im a teenager and honestly I consider myself far more sane about male depravity than most Western pick-mes and libfems - which are the majority population of women in the West. Blackpilled and radfemmed to my core - possibly even more than the average radfem. thereotically i should be against the burqa and the niqab. And im not sure how i got here. But -

The more I learn about lookism the more I find myself supporting the niqab / burqa / veil.

The more I learn about male sexuality the more I find myself supporting burqa / niqab / veil.

The more I learn about beauty standards in the West the more I find myself supporting burqa / niqab / veil.

The more I learn about fetishes and porn the more I find myself supporting burqa / niqab / veil.

The more I learn about male strength and violence the more I find myself supporting segregation.

The ideal situation would be to have men wear it too - to decrease sexual dimorphism between the sexes in public eye. Ive read that when women were veiled men got aroused by the rustle of a dress dragging across the floor. And I bet you a thousand dollars there'd be an extreme decrease in sexual harassment in places like Egypt if no one could tell whether the person behind the veil was a man or a woman.

Sure - theres a safety concern. But we got through covid. Technology is getting better. And places in Gulf Arabia - which enforce the niqab - have no terrorism. Plus, you can identify someone from their voices.

But im just finding myself supporting thr veil day by day. Porn freaked me out. 4Chan freaked me out. News Articles describing rape and sexual trafficking have me fainting or traumatised for months. Ik i sound insane, but im at my wits end right now. Ive grown up prioritizing my success. Knowing that men will hinder me and humanity from progress makes me increasingly vicious day by day. Seeing what happened to Greta Thunberg, AOC, and women with loud opinions - the way they get sexualized, fetishized, and have their legitimacy lessened because a cursory google search can lead you to find depraved shit about them, freaks me out. Deep-fake technology freaks me out. Rule 34 freaks me out. This is the shit Ill have to endure if I dare speak up. And I find myself wishing to get veiled more and more.

And i know most women are forced into it. But thats a symptom of a bigger problem - male violence, fear of male violence, and male authoritarianism. Being against the veil wont get rid of the problems - it gets rid of a symptom.

I would adopt it myself, but i find it futile because i plan to immigrate to Europe ig. I cant wear it there...... which makes me strangely angry, but I digress. Im generally dreading it because I grew up segregated from men and getting dropped in an environment where Ill be forced to interact with men makes the hair at my back prickle. But anyhow I digress - sorry

Generally though, men told us that they'd respect us if we veiled, and that they despise women who dont. I think we should be inclined to pay heed to that.

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[–]LilianH 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Men don't respect you no matter how much you conform to whatever brand of patriarchy they are trying to sell you.

[–]Maryam[S] 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Its patriarchal because men consider it covering up their property from other men. But im not going to be anyones property - and ill fight tooth and nail against male tyranny.

It should be worn because male sexuality is vile and the Western insistence that it isnt is viler.

[–]bbbarbican 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

So on top of everything else women go through, we should also wear an uncomfortable and ugly piece of clothing that restricts our movements and makes us hot in the summer. Brilliant. That's what men want.

[–]Maryam[S] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Almost as if a young child can figure out that theyre multiple types of veils without being actively told that. Whats clouding your judgment here?

[–]misstropica 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Hmm, I kind of understand what you're saying. I'm not Muslim or from a culture that practices it at all, but I kind of wish that the veil didn't have such negative connotations, because I like the idea of being able to keep men from looking at me...unfortunately, that's not the result you'll get from wearing a veil, at least in the West. I want to be invisible in their eyes, and I don't want them to interact with me or bother me. I want anonymity but I also want to be able to speak up. At least the internet is pretty good for that purpose.

[–]Happy_face_caller 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Male respect of women is “conditional” either they have to tokenize you and and pretend you are an anomaly or somehow use you to help them get laid. They have an expectation by gracing a woman with their presence there has to be some ulterior motive Becasue we are all so silly headed right?

[–]fork4k 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

I'm Indian and Hindu - I'm not sure if that would somehow colour my opinion on this but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

The more I learn about lookism the more I find myself supporting the niqab / burqa / veil

I've actually always been more sympathetic to the niqab/burqa style of oppression over the western "makeup for myself" style of oppression for this reason. That being said, the fact that it's only women who wear this stuff still seems fishy - the root of the problem is in men's objectification of women, so why is it on women to try to render themselves less likely to be targets of objectification? Moreover, given how high and absurd the standards of femininity are, I think merely being a normal human female (i.e. not shaving, not wearing makeup, not being actively thin, having a conveniently short haircut etc.) are sufficient to escape the male gaze, without having to take up practices created by objectively sexist men (e.g. wearing a niqab or burqa).

The more I learn about male strength and violence the more I find myself supporting segregation.

Segregation is pretty based, but the issue is muslim societies don't seem to go far enough (in the end, women still end up married to men and having babies with men, so they drop the segregation pretense when it really matters).

[–]Maryam[S] 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

That being said, the fact that it's only women who wear this stuff still seems fishy - the root of the problem is in men's objectification of women, so why is it on women to try to render themselves less likely to be targets of objectification?

I feel like its like carrying a gun, or being segregated from men, or being a feminist in the first place. We'd be destroyed from the get-go if we didnt carry precautions from the get-go.

And female prosperity seems to exclusively come from how wealthy a country becomes (and even that somehow doesnt work - check out the Gulf.) So unless your country is super-rich, you have to save yourselves from men doing whatever you as an individual can. You have to claw your way out if youre a poor woman or someone from the third-world.

(Or maybe wealth of a country comes from female prosperity. Im not sure... what do you think?)

Moreover, given how high and absurd the standards of femininity are, I think merely being a normal human female (i.e. not shaving, not wearing makeup, not being actively thin, having a conveniently short haircut etc.) are sufficient to escape the male gaze, without having to take up practices created by objectively sexist men (e.g. wearing a niqab or burqa).

Men fuck animals, fruits, children. At least the veiling makes it unlikely that they fantasize about you as the person you are, with your features and your body-type and everything, getting raped by someone.

Segregation is pretty based, but the issue is muslim societies don't seem to go far enough (in the end, women still end up married to men and having babies with men, so they drop the segregation pretense when it really matters).

Yeah :(

Is there some segregation in India too?