all 74 comments

[–]magnora7[S] 22 insightful - 6 fun22 insightful - 5 fun23 insightful - 6 fun -  (39 children)

Doesn't even really matter, just one case among hundreds of thousands of similar types of bannings I'm sure. Just pissed me off. The censorship is very real.

[–]asterias 14 insightful - 3 fun14 insightful - 2 fun15 insightful - 3 fun -  (34 children)

Reddit has stopped being a decent place for discussion since a long time. They are just trying to hide their true intentions so that users won't flock away to other platforms.

[–]magnora7[S] 15 insightful - 2 fun15 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 2 fun -  (31 children)

Completely agree. I just worry other people are reading it and taking it seriously, and if the hivemind is too perfect and literally hundreds of millions of people visit it regularly... I worry about the mind of humanity. I feel an obligation to say something sometimes. But it's like pissing in to a tsunami, it feels so futile. Especially after all your comments get deleted because the mods don't agree with the scientific links you post... sheesh.

I'm glad we have saidit at least. I just wish more people came here, and more people told others about saidit. But I'm very grateful to the people who are here, we have a nice little community going here.

[–]ChillyChili 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (21 children)

I remember being on reddit and not knowing of any alternatives that weren't "full of hackers or crazy racists". It is extremely distressing to be shut down when even trying to question the narrative in communities that exist for exactly that purpose.

It was terrifying, and I too am very grateful for this community.

I guess, in a way, reddit is killing themselves off by going too far. With bannings and censorship becoming commonplace, people leave instead of staying and trying to "fit in" and "behave". Only problem is what prevents saidit from being the next target?

[–]IridescentAnaconda 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I find the "crazy racists" off-putting but you can't have free speech without that component. No crazy racists, no free speech.

[–]magnora7[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

But some people get it confused and think the more of that there is, the freer the site is. Which isn't necessarily the case. Voat is 99% racism and it's very hard to find real information in such a garbage heap. So there's a balance, you can't really have free speech if extremists hijack the platform. But you can't have it by removing all of them either. There's a happy middle-ground that can be hard to hit, and everyone also kind of disagrees where it is appropriate to draw the line exactly, so it's impossible to satisfy everyone in this regard.

[–]IridescentAnaconda 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I do not mean to imply that more is better. It's just a fact of life with free-speech zones. The antidote is either (1) ignoring and not validating [my usual approach] or (2) pushing back with facts, etc. I still emphatically believe they have a right to express their views (as much as I have a right to ignore and/or oppose the same views).

[–]magnora7[S] 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

That's all well and good, as long as they're actual people pushing viewpoints they actually believe. But when it's one person pretending to be 50 people, with the intent of poisoning the quality of discussion on the whole website and driving away new users (which does happen), we cannot allow that anymore than we should allow people to falsely yell "FIRE!" in a crowded theater. And it can be difficult to distinguish which is happening.

So it requires careful attention, and we have the saidit rules like they are because it helps prevent against this sort of cultural website hijacking that voat and many other sites experienced. Allowing one person's speech to drown out everyone else's, isn't really free speech for those being drowned out. So there's a balance that has to be had because of this cultural forum hijacking phenomenon that every social media site now has to deal with.

[–]ChillyChili 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I do as well and appreciate your reply. I'm just saying that, that is the narrative.

I believe that we should be able to talk about stats within races without being called racist or even that being racist isnt even a crime in itself. I think that folks can dislike a group of folks for whatever their reasoning.

Even if they are "protected classes" under legal bs, should not infringe on first amendment rights EVER.

Why is it ok for rape victims to have an aversion to males but not males of a race that raped them without being racist?

[–]magnora7[S] 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (8 children)

Only problem is what prevents saidit from being the next target?

Saidit is already, and has been for a while, a target.

To prevent these types of attacks we got rid of the downvote and have two upvotes. This gets rid of most the user-level censorship.

Then we have saidit moderator rules that limit what the mods can delete. The removal of relevant information in a thread about that subject by mods, is not allowed on saidit, unless the mod has specified they will do so in the sidebar, and takes the sub off of the /all listing on saidit.

So these two new rules help a lot in preventing the intentionally damaging fake hiveminds from building up in an effort to drive off normal users.

[–]ChillyChili 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

That does help a lot. How do you fix real disinfo?

Like, you can't really because if you were reddit, their definition of disinfo is just the info challenging the desired narrative. Is upvoting good content enough? I mean, it might be, but just posing the question.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

I just simply apply our rules: https://saidit.net/s/SaidIt/comments/j1/the_saiditnet_terms_and_content_policy/

I don't judge the truth content of things, I merely judge the quality of discussion and moderate based on that, as per the site rules.

[–]ChillyChili 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Ok. As a former digg/reddit/voat member, what happens when you leave or are forced to leave? What canary can you put up that is legit that wouldn't be compromised? I mean, hell, the conspiracist in me thinks that saidit is the new corral. While thats something that I have to decide, if you aren't, what means do you have to prevent that?

Like, on one hand I shouldn't know what your backup plans are since if I were a disinfo agent, I'd use it. On the other, if I'm not (and am) I'd like to know that there is a plan to prevent you from being strong armed into censoring or handing over user data. Silly tough balance in a "free" world that shouldn't even exist.. :(

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

I have a canary at /s/saiditcanary

We back up a lot. We have no reason we'd ever hand over user data, and we don't keep any extra data we don't need to operate the site.

If we got censored, we'd change server companies. We've already done it 3 times in the last 3 years.

We're prepared, don't worry.

[–]ChillyChili 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

What guarantees do we have that the canary is and remains legit?

[–]whistlepig 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Reddit use to be full of hackers and some crazy racists back when it was good. That freedom of speech thing is what attracted everyone else. That was why the voting system was created. It allowed people to hide comments/posts below a specific voting threshold so the nervous people could avoid seeing most of the unpopular opinions like racists. That was the whole point of the voting system. It allowed the normies and the free speech zeolots (like me) to hang out together. And it worked great. Unfortunately there are too many who aren't interested in not seeing things they don't agree with as much as they want to forcibly stop others from thinking at all.

[–]ChillyChili 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The problem is that you can't just simply search on controversial or bottom and keep up the convo anymore.

Unpopular by reddit investor standards can not remain. Bots/shills downvote until nonbot nonaligned views are beaten or beaten, but also users are banned/removed so that they cant participate and other like-minded folks dont even know they have an ally when they face banning/removal.

[–]whistlepig 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

exactly.

My point was just to say that for those first 3 years or so reddit was plenty fringe. For the sake of historic perspective.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I agree, but voat is the counter-argument about why having it too open can leave it open to having the site culture hijacked by extremists.

[–]whistlepig 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

perhaps.. or you just have to attract enough of the right community early on

Of course.. easy for me to say, since I haven't actually tried to do it like you have. ;]

[–]roguecanine 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Reddit didn't have the voting system right from the start?

[–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It didn't? I know reddit had votes before it even had subreddits, which would've been 2007-2008 or so, when I started reading it.

[–]roguecanine 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

You need to advertise & market it somehow. Some subreddits I've seen post link to saidit with auto moderator, but surely there's more that can be done. I heard there was once a mass migration from Dig to Reddit. So it seems like it's possible, since it happened before.

[–]roguecanine 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Also I was thinking the other day. One of the problems with reddit is that mods have total control over subreddits. Maybe the way to change it and attract new non-politically motivated users would be to introduce some voting system where active users of a sub could vote for mod...

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I am thinking about making another new site similar to saidit that is focused on "no politics" as a core rule

[–]roguecanine 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That's an interesting idea. Though I wonder how would one attract non-political people if most of the reddit refugees seem to be political.

[–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah it might be tough going at first, but the most-requested thing I've heard about reddit alternatives is the desire for a "no politics" one, so I think a few hundred will be interested right off the bat. And then some of those can become content administrators to make sure it stays no politics and doesn't get hijacked.

[–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Word of mouth. People just need to mention saidit on other sites. Not even advertise it, just mention it.

[–]roguecanine 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Personally I hesitate to mention it due to fear of being labeled as alt-right even though I'm not. When I go to my front page there is mostly politics; I'm subbed into some related subs but still I don't want the front page to consist of most of their posts, despite being subscribed. Reddit needs to do something to piss off lots of non-political people I guess, that would be the moment to seize.

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I appreciate your candor.

Personally I hesitate to mention it due to fear of being labeled as alt-right even though I'm not.

See that's the problem though... it's really not an alt-right site. They've put chilling effects on you, so you don't speak, even though you do believe in what's here, simply because you're afraid of a false label being used against you.

We can only have freedom of speech if people actually stand up for it. And if people won't stand up for saidit out of fear, then saidit will eventually fail. So I recommend overcoming that fear of how others label you, and instead help others who seek real information, to find that information, so that humanity might progress forward.

[–]copenseethe 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It would be interesting to know what percentage of people fear being labeled as right wing vs. fear being labeled as left wing. I think there are likely many more closet right wing as opposed to closeted left wing people. The shrillness and hysteria of the mainstream left has silenced many people.

[–]madcow-5 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

They stopped being decent, but you could at least still communicate and engage wuth them. Last spring they went all out and just started banning anyone questioning anything from the site entirely.

[–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I asked the mods why they deleted scientific information after I got blocked, and they just responded "No." and muted me

[–]Tom_Bombadil 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The actual "Inconvenient Truth".

[–]sdune 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The OP was appropriately banned from /r/scarysigns as i have just spent about a half hour reading their posts it is now obvious that his post was way off topic and inappropriate in the /r/scarysigns sub.

/r/scarysigns is not a place to post a spreadsheet containing covid death statistics, but instead it is a place to post weird and strange and scary signs, perhaps signs that say "dont go in water, you will be electrocuted and eaten by alligators", or some other similarly weird scary sign.

the OP was appropriately banned.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

There was lots of discussion about covid in the thread. It was on the front page of r/all. It was on-topic, and I was not being rude.

[–]tomatosplat 12 insightful - 5 fun12 insightful - 4 fun13 insightful - 5 fun -  (8 children)

Yup. You present facts, they present hate. That's what all the cool communists do these days. There's a few that stray over here too. You'll probably be hearing from them soon. Welcome to saidit!

[–]magnora7[S] 9 insightful - 4 fun9 insightful - 3 fun10 insightful - 4 fun -  (5 children)

I hope some come more come over to saidit soon from reddit. More people need to help get the word out. Thanks for the welcome haha :)

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]Tom_Bombadil 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    He said, "Welcome back."

    [–]icebong 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    I love the seeing the difference between reddit and saidit. Reddit is just full of shill memes theses days attacking people who don't go along the narrative, and when I come over here, I just see sanity again. Gives me a little hope.

    Though we need to figure out of to keep online conversation safe.

    My idea is having different moderators that you subscribe to and trust, so you allow multiple moderators for a subreddit, and if one of them goes rouge, you can always switch, are start your own moderation team.

    [–]Intuit 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

    SpReAd LoVe, NoT hAtE!

    [–]jet199 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

    I don't think you should be spreading anything you've got.

    [–]Dial-up-tone 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

    I thought the reason everyone was on here is because we realised Reddit is a cesspool

    [–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Sometimes I forget how bad it is and have vivid reminders like this

    [–]passionflounder 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

    misinformation [ mis-in-fer-mey-shuhn ]

    noun

    1. Any data, scientific or otherwise, that places the established narrative in doubt.

    2. Unapproved facts that expose hypocrisy if not properly and rightfully censored.

    [–]beyoncepaddock 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

    the mods are just going to make it a echo chamber for pro lockdown covid crap. They either are too supid or they dont care and they want it that way. echo chamber social media site will further divide the people, so personally i think they want that. i was using counter data just like you back in april and i got the same treatment you are not alone. if they censor us they create the fictional narritive. you see how that works...

    [–]magnora7[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

    It just blows my mind how 10 years ago reddit was the diehard "Science!" website. And now they're literally banning scientific studies about an ongoing epidemic... such a slap in the face

    [–]beyoncepaddock 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    2020 the year when science became political policy.

    [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

    sHIT! I'm safe, I made it. I escaped reddit. thankyou thankyou thankyou!!! I've just had 3 days of arguments about the bloody virus with a herd of brainless sheep, I can still smell their dung. I thought if I stayed any longer I'd be ordered to wear a mask while I typed. Now I'm gonna look around, and relax!

    [–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    Welcome! We strongly value people who drag the quality of discussion upward on the pyramid of debate! https://saidit.net/static/PyramidDebate.jpg

    [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    It's quiet in here, I like quiet, it reflects I think the fact that there is a small minority of people who actually think! As apposed to the board masses who just follow each other in a herd, led by the establishment media. Thanks for the welcome.

    [–]Kyto113 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

    Why can't people understand that it's not just about lethality... You fuckers have clearly not seen the strain on our medical system (even from those who survive)

    [–]jet199 10 insightful - 5 fun10 insightful - 4 fun11 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

    Yeah, my uncle went in to have a stint fitted a couple of months back.

    He was the only person on the ward with 12 staff.

    [–]magnora7[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    Even if you do only look at it from a lethality standpoint... suicides in Japan surpassed covid deaths last month, yet they're still doing lockdowns. How is that helpful to human health?

    [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    i think even tho covid is not dangerous it does possibly have the potential for rich people to catch it, unlike how they can't catch a suicide disease from someone in japan so they don't care about that

    [–]cheesefart 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

    Why cant you understand that its not about the virus. Its about control, ya dunce.

    [–]Kyto113 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

    Of course it is. Our hospitals are not full of critically ill patients. We aren't running out of beds. It's all just a big spooky conspiracy. Get out of your basement and actually visit an ER.

    As a side note, did you know one of the key predictors of believing in conspiracy theories is diminishmental capacity? (https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0963721417718261)

    [–]whistlepig 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

    Show me someone who doesn't believe in a conspiracy theory and I'll show you someone who doesn't know what they two words mean and is apparently unwilling to look it up before making a fool of themselves.

    [–]JoGooD 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

    MK-Ultra was an operation led by the CIA which led to making sex slave kid and other completely non-ethical non-sense and the Canadian government did finance this project. Edward Snowden did warn the world about a surveillance program by the government and still isn't welcome in America to this day. Bayer did sell heroin as cough syrup to kids and sold blood containing HIV knowingly.

    I am not saying that the whole thing is made up, but how much exaggerated is it? What if the worst has already happened but we keep these toxic measures for years just so they can make vaccination mandatory?

    [–]Kyto113 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    So here's the thing, there's a difference between having healthy skepticism and being a conspiracy theorist.

    We all should recognize that we are often lied to and sometimes conspiracies turn out to be true.

    But conspiratorial thinking centers on a few cognitive mistakes, primarily unfair comparison of theories. The official story will be put through the ringer, and held to the highest evidentiary standard. The conspiracy theory will be given an extremely lax evidentiary standard. Often, holes or falsehoods in the official story will be sufficient evidence for the conspiracy theory.

    And you see it all the time, a single wacko doctor that confirms the conspiracy theory is believed 100%. Thousands of doctors confirming the official story are dismissed in favor of the one. It's an evidentiary double standard.

    So I totally agree that we aren't being told the whole story about covid. Hell, a great example is that in March we were told that masks didn't work for the express purpose of preserving stock for medical professionals. But to go from that to claiming that it's all a hoax, it's all about control, or that it's just the flu, is entirely unjustifiable.

    [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    show us proof, let us go into hospitals and upload live video, this being outlawed tells me it's fake

    [–]VirgilGriff 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Plus the survival rate drops if people can't be admitted into the hospital for supplemental oxygen and other treatment.

    [–]hfxB0oyA 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    It's a worthwhile topic of discussion, even if you're on the side of lockdowns, which I am. I have some immune compromised family who are much more likely to die of it than the general population. I appreciate what people are doing (masks, etc) to try and protect others, but yeah, the facts are the facts.

    [–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Yeah I'm not even anti-mask or anything, I just want to have the discussion about what is actually happening. You know, the actual science.

    But instead I'm censored, called an insensitive hateful person, and banned from the platform.

    So broken. Reddit is literally anti-science, and it's disturbing

    [–]Niggerboy 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

    Why do you retards still complain about it and stop using it lmao? People are so fucking cucked it's hilarious. Muh youtube. Shit's for boomers. All the competition is full of retards also, the whole internet is full of retards now, barely worth using.

    [–]cheesefart 6 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

    Youre fucking whiny

    [–]GConly 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    CDC IFR was given at 0.2%

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]magnora7[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Well the tests are notoriously unreliable, and this is known

      [–]Tiger_Diamond 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      reddit is CCP controlled & CCP is controlled by guess WHO? 💬

      [–]blowininthewind 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      ah, behold, a white horse.