From lesbian to 100% straight. British author Bernardine Evaristo.

submitted by paleolithicat from self.Lesbians

Heard it on the radio today and had to stop in my tracks. And then come here to discuss.

Link:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/sep/20/bernardine-evaristo-living-as-a-lesbian-made-me-stronger

So long story short: she had an "angry feminist lesbian period" in her youth (10years). Now she is completely straight and married.

Well now that bs makes ME one angry lesbian. 😂

You always talked about "political lesbians" but I hadn't seen it or heard it. But here it is. Perpetrating multiple of my favourite theories/accusations towards lesbians: 1. Being angry at the world so being gay as an act of rebelling. 2. Having a lesbian Period, so basically mutable sexuality (or nowadays favourite term, fluid <3). 3. As a result from the previous two, being a lesbian means you are unbalanced, neurotic, hateful, unmature, confused etc etc.

In defense of the woman I must say she didn't sound like a moron and probably if I hadn't heard this part of her life-story literally first thing as I turned on the radio, she might have left me with a positive impression.

Ps. What happened to bisexuality?

Please share your thoughts.

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[–]whateverbeaver 28 insightful - 3 fun28 insightful - 2 fun29 insightful - 3 fun -  (5 children)

Bisexuals have the highest rate of mental illness among LGB, by a lot, and I think it's even nearing trans, at least anecdotally speaking (even w/ hormones and surgeries, the suicide rate for trans is still 20x the national average, according to at least one study done in one of the Nordic countries. It also found high rates of de-transition-- it was a longitudinal study). I'm starting to think with bi and trans, it's not just a correlation when it comes to mental unwellness. I never would have thought this in my younger years when I was a little more green, but with more life experiences and wisdom and literally seeing so much...stuff....I'm starting to think they're both two effects (this crazy rollercoaster bi expression and a mental illness) that stem from the same core causal mental problem. Just my opinion. Regardless, these people are truly hurtful to gay people, but we're tough, we can withstand their issues and live our best lives in spite of them.

[–]homosomes 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Bisexuals have the highest rate of mental illness among LGB, by a lot

Do you have a source for that? I read a study that between lesbians and bisexual women, bisexual women face a lot more abuse (because they partner with men who are more prone to physical abuse than women) in their relationships. But I've never heard that bi people overall suffer more from mental illness. I'd heard it's about even across the board for LGB people (not counting the T). I would like to read more about that if you have a link.

[–]whateverbeaver 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

https://www.hrc.org/news/bisexual-health-awareness-month-mental-health-in-the-bisexual-community

40 vs 25 percent suicide stat. Given it’s HRC and the top result on google, given more digging I’m sure you could find even worse, less biased stats.

Edit: For the sake of a hypothetical, lets say this is “the” stat, the only one, the correct one—IMO, the 15% margin are the rollercoaster bis. The rest is from social discrimination, which for bis is really just a different kind of homophobia :)

Sorry to reedit this a hundred times lol, but just look at the stupidity of the HRC in saying the mislabeling is coming from the others—we all know it is they who mislabel themselves.

[–]whateverbeaver 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I correct myself on the trans stat, the Dutch corrected the Swedes lmao. Looks like with transition or without it suicide is relatively the same at 3-4x higher for trans than general pop

https://genderanalysis.net/2020/06/swedish-study-meet-the-dutch-study-suicide-rates-among-trans-people-are-elevated-but-not-by-20-times/

[–]homosomes 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Some of the links that HRC provided were broken (mostly links to their own site). The links leading to other sites do provide support for bisexuals experiencing higher rates of mental illness/suicide attempts though. Thank you for sharing sources!

[–]whateverbeaver 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Hey np! And obvi my opinion as to why is just conjecture. More evidence is needed methinks :)

[–]VioletRemi 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

Such podcasts, interviews or videos are super harmful to lesbians, especially lesbian youth. Both straight men and lesbians themselves are being told that it is just a "choice" and period in their life, so straight men can hunt for lesbians and "convert" them to straight women, and young lesbians thinking it is just bad period in their lives and they must try to become at least bisexual. I suffered myself from this...

It is just clear lesbophobia and lesbian erasure, gay men are never believed to be "just a period", while lesbians "can't exist, so it is temporarily". Argh.

[–]paleolithicat[S] 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I agree completely, it was an interview about her new book so it didn't center around that but if you are a lesbian you are sensitive to such sentences and topics even when on the side.

You make a very good point about gays too. Men are also never considered to be gay "because of a cause". And they do not get labeled as "angry womanhaters".

What troubles me is that there seem to be real women spreading this nonsense as their personal story. I feel it really does contribute to less real (mostly closeted) lesbians identifying with the label and thus it is a step backward. I personally meet almost only bisexual women in my country of residence (in Western Europe) and almost all girls I have met from "homophobic" countries in Eastern Europe, South America etc seem to be more comfortable with being exclusively attracted to women.

[–]VioletRemi 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Karen started looking more about lesbian problems (and a bit gay men issues too) on her channel (she is straight, GC feminist), and there about what you said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s0KTm1vSyo & https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piJyDa6EW7A

And yeah, one West it seems to be bigger pressure nowadays on lesbians, and how Karen noticed there - that lesbian comes online, and seeing that tag "lesbian" is either on pornography, or in places like /r/ActualLesbians, which focuses on penises and straight men in wigs - so such lesbian thinks "yeah, it is not what I am, I gues I am not homosexual woman after all, but something different and will call myself something different, as I don't want to be associated with this".

[–]paleolithicat[S] 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Omg she is awesome!!! Thanks! 😂👌👌

[–]VioletRemi 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah, she deserves all the subscribers and more people to know about her! New Magdalen Burns, just less direct and more cozy. Karen was banned on Twitter and Facebook for defending women.

[–]NerveActive 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

gay men are never believed to be "just a period"

It's even the opposite. I've seen many people saying that even if a man is married to a woman and has kids it means nothing, he can still be gay and is using his family as a facade. They say this about feminine men.

[–]censorshipment 9 insightful - 6 fun9 insightful - 5 fun10 insightful - 6 fun -  (1 child)

Totally makes sense. She's 61... she was growing up during both the civil rights and women's rights movements - which were connected by black female activists who realized black male activists were misogynists who didn't give a shit about women ...similar to the connection between abolitionists and suffragists in the 1800s and early 1900s. My mom is 60 and went down this path except her desire for having a daughter was much stronger than her desire for being with a woman, so she dumped her lesbian girlfriend in 1979 to date my dad during their second year of college... and I was born in 1983 when my mom was 23 and dad was 24 after they were financially prepared to be parents. I'm named after my mom's lesbian ex. My mom doesn't identify as a former lesbian nor bi, even though she loved her ex and has been having sex with women during her marriages (she married my stepdad in 2006 after divorcing my dad in 2001). She identifies as straight because she's married to a man.

I say that to say black feminists born in the 50s/60s, who may have identified as lesbians, likely "hated men" because of black misogynists. Fannie Lou Hamer should be the face of the civil's rights movement, not Martin Luther King Jr. who may have watched a black woman get raped by his friend. Lyndon B. Johnson feared Fannie Lou Hamer... Johnson didn't fear MLK.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/martin-luther-king-rape-fbi-tapes-video-mlk-laugh-files-a8932206.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/retropolis/wp/2017/10/06/civil-rights-crusader-fannie-lou-hamer-defied-men-and-presidents-who-tried-to-silence-her/

[–]paleolithicat[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That's very interesting! Thank you for the comment. I don't have much more than general knowledge about these movements in America as I have grown up in a completely different setting. I don't doubt the credibility of her words but it doesn't make sense for me what she did to be labeled "lesbian lifestyle" nowadays. If I was her, I would tell the story as "I didn't want to be sexually involved with men as a form of protest" or something like that but in any case, it is her responsibility to not lead on her public by claims like "I was a lesbian 10years because I was an angry feminist and since then I have been leading a happy life as a straight woman".

The thing with MLK would be quite shocking if it is true but I wouldn't be so sure. It could easily be fabricated in order to discredit him. And there certainly are people who want that and would profit from that.

I will read into Fannie Lou Hamer nonetheless, thanks for the tip.

[–]Hello367 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I'm very young and I'm gay, and when I read things like this it really messes with me mentally and makes me insecure, was she on the radio today or was this in the past because the article is labeled four months ago?

[–]whateverbeaver 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

A lesson I learned and you will too: never let the sick convince you you are ill. The sick are the sick, and those of health need not feel intimidated by the madness of the sick. This woman is mad and of the sickness, and you are not, love. Now go out and live a great life. Shame on this sickness for making you feel anything less than the health that you are. Good luck to you.

[–]paleolithicat[S] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I heard it on the radio during a show they have where they present books and add interview excerpts with the author. This was yesterday but it is not a UK radio show so it is normal that there were already British articles on the topic in the internet (probably that's how the radio journalists found out about her new book as well). After hearing it, I had to check what I heard so I "investigated" a bit on the web and posted this particular article on it.

I will join whateverbeaver and reassure you that there is nothing to be insecure about. You will see with time that there are constantly such attacks on our sexuality and identity with the sheer goal of convincing you that lesbians do not exist, all women are either bi or straight, and that being a lesbian is some sort of a choice because you have a certain problem with men. Like trauma, hate, aversion to sex in general because according to them sex is only sex involving a male (notice, gay sex is sex! Lesbian sex on the contrary doesn't exist or is not a real thing) or even disobedience which is mostly an indirect message and only clear to see after analysing the deeper context of their accusations.

You will see and hear a lot. Don't worry, you are not alone. Probably each of us lets it get to their head from time to time - the attacks are at every turn after all! But it gets better with time because you stop caring about morons and their stupidity and realize you don't have to fit in their narrow view of who you are supposed to be or how you are supposed to act.

I have said it in another posts already but with the years to come you will see that lesbians are the only people on the planet free of men. It will be a big revelation and you will realize how much of how the human world functions is dictated by men's desires and opinions. This gives us a special power as we are able to see things outside of the male box which men (straight, bi or gay) and women (straight or bi) all over the world inhabit. I believe that is why a lot of the most prominent and independent women in history turn out to be lesbian women. So fuck expectations and go strong!

There are many others like you and you are one step forward because you have already at least found an online space where you can communicate with other lesbians. :)

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]Hello367 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Thank u, it's comforting to know there are people that can relate to how I feel and stuff

    [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Those kind of stories always get posted on the guardian...I wonder why. Once I read about a woman who got kicked out of there and censored because she was deemed ''transphobic'' just because she dared say something about a trans women...No wonder they're trying to always push this narrative that a lesbian can turn straight Its not the first time trust me

    Edit : Here's what I'm referring to : https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-8987293/SUZANNE-MOORE-writes-riposte-bullied-job-unwoke-views-trans-rights.html