LifestyleMy lesbian friend is now trans and is trying to convince me that I am too

submitted by SillyGoose from self.LGBDropTheT

Hopefully this isn't formatted badly, given that I've never posted here before, but I thought I would share my story since I'm getting pretty frustrated. I guess this could be a rant, since I could never say this to anyone I know in my life. Anyway, as a 17 year old lesbian, I am pretty surrounded by the woke crowd, you could say. I don't know what it is like for older people, but everyone I know who isn't straight is pan, nonbinary, or occasionally bi. I have two good friends, both of whom were the only lesbians I knew, until that changed.

About a year ago, one of the two told me that she identified as trans. This surprised me, because it honestly came out of nowhere. She never wore feminine clothes, but she was never even butch and we had been friends for years without her ever expressing any kind of disdain for being female or lesbian. Now, I care about her a lot, so I call her by her new name and use male pronouns, since that is the only way I could keep her as a friend. Besides, it wasn't really hurting me at all, so it didn't seem like a big deal.

Maybe 4 months ago, the second friend who is dating the friend who is now trans told me that she identifies as nonbinary and pansexual now. I guess she had to ditch the lesbian label to stay with her partner, but being nonbinary also came out of nowhere. Again, we'd been friends for years and she was always pretty feminine and never once expressed discomfort with that. Still, using new pronouns didn't hurt me, and I care for her, so I did it. She still respects me as a lesbian though, and I am glad for that. The other friend does not, unfortunately.

Now, cut to the present. The trans friend and I spend a lot of time together, since it is the summer. Anyway, she knows I am a lesbian. However, as of late, she keeps trying to convince me I am trans. I get it, she may just want someone to relate to, so I can't be too mad, but I think it is disrespectful. She asked me if I "feel like a girl", commented that she thinks I'll use "she/they pronouns" in college, said she keeps subconsciously using "they/them pronouns" for me, told me she thinks I'll "figure things out soon", etc. However, the thing that bothered me most was when she implied that my body image issues are because of "dysphoria". The thing is, I'm currently struggling with an eating disorder and have body image issues because of that. She knows this. She watches me struggle to eat food and has listened to my rants about it. I hate my body because I feel fat, not because I'm "in the wrong body". There is a huge difference there, and I am honestly hurt that she can't see that.

My point in typing this out is this: why can't I just be a lesbian? I respect the identities of everyone at my school, regardless of whether or not I understand, so why can't they respect mine? It is not even just my friend who does this. I don't want to make this a book, but I get woke kids at my school asking me for my pronouns (they never ask my straight friends even if they are next to me), people using "they/them" for me without asking, etc. I'm just tired of all this, I guess. Is this sort of thing a common experience? Will things get better or worse in college? I guess I am just a bit pessimistic for the future and all.

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[–]hufflepuff-poet 39 insightful - 2 fun39 insightful - 1 fun40 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

I get woke kids at my school asking me for my pronouns (they never ask my straight friends even if they are next to me), people using "they/them" for me without asking, etc.

I'm sorry you have to deal with this nonsense. Stay strong, it's awesome that you know yourself so well at such a young age! I was just jumping back into the closet at your age, hope you can stay out and proud through these tough times. Same-sex attraction is natural and it's okay to be a lesbian! It's not ok for her to make you uncomfortable and try to force an identity onto you. Respect is a two-way street, I would tell her that it makes me uncomfortable and set a boundary on her "invalidating your gender identity".

This is modern day homophobia. If you're an out homosexual, you'll be punished for it or judged/othered by peers. This seems almost worse than the blatant homophobia I grew up with in the mid 2000s, cus atleast we could point it out, this is done in the name of our own "community" and if we call it out, we're "bad gays".

[–]SillyGoose[S] 19 insightful - 1 fun19 insightful - 0 fun20 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I guess I didn't say this, but the thing is that a lot of the people at my school who ask for my pronouns or think I'm nonbinary don't know that I am a lesbian. I'm not in the closet and it isn't a secret, but I also am just not a super public person and have never been in a relationship. I just wear men's clothes and look more "butch" even though I have long hair, so I think that instead of assuming that I am just a more masculine lesbian or even a "tomboy", they just jump to trans or nonbinary since it is what they are more familiar with. I'm not sure if it is homophobia on their parts or just ignorance.

[–]RedEyedWarriorGay | Male | 🇮🇪 Irish 🇮🇪 | Antineoliberal | Cocks are Compulsory 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Just tell them that you’re a lesbian.

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They don't deserve to know that about her. They'll treat her poorly regardless because she doesn't fit the straight mould.

[–]reluctant_commenter 34 insightful - 1 fun34 insightful - 0 fun35 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Hey. Just wanted to say, I'm a few years older than you but same generation I think, and I relate a ton to this and I know others who are a similar age who are in the same boat. I've also gotten shit from people my age for calling myself "lesbian" because it made them uncomfortable.

Your trans-identifying friend is being extremely disrespectful, and hurtful. Especially about your eating disorder; I am so sorry that someone you reached out to for support is sitting there trying to diagnose you with gender dysphoria instead of listening to your own lived experience.

#1. First, I think it's important to set a boundary with your trans-identifying friend about identity. A few possible responses, if she's bothering you:

  • "I am happy living as a woman. My identity is important to me, and I happen to be lesbian. Can you accept me for who I am?"

  • "I understand that you identify as transgender, but I do not."

  • "My relationship with my body has nothing to do with gender dysphoria. Please stop insisting that it does."

  • "My relationship with my body is different than your relationship with your body. It's just not gender dysphoria for me. You have to trust me."

If she truly refuses to respect your boundaries about your identity and body, and keeps insisting that you must be trans, then it may be a good idea to start spending less time with her-- or at least, to not talk about your body image with her. That sounds like a really vulnerable subject (and BTW, I'm proud of you for talking about it with someone and thinking about it!), and it's hurtful that she's not listening to you when you say it's not gender dysphoria.

#2. To answer your question...

Will things get better or worse in college?

...it depends. On several things:

  • On the college you go to. Some have a lot more pressure for people to identify as trans.

  • On the people you hang out in college. I hung out with some alphabet soup crazies, some cool LGB people, and some straight people who shared my hobbies. I had a great time with the latter two groups, and avoided acquaintances who tried to pressure me into doing things that I said I was not comfortable with. Actually this extends beyond just LGB issues, your "friends" should not be pressuring you to say that you are X or to do Y when you're not X or are not comfortable with Y.

  • On the courses you take. I did a lot of STEM stuff in college and took 0 gender studies classes and I think I avoided a lot of bullshit that way. Reading course descriptions or syllabi BEFORE enrolling in the class helped me a lot in avoiding TQ+ nonsense.

  • On the college's location. Some countries, and some regions of liberal countries especially, are just more likely to have TQ+ people who pressure LGB people into identifying as transgender.

Please feel free to comment or message if you have questions or want to talk more. This is a really hard position to be in, but I believe you can get through this-- and that more broadly, we'll all get through the TQ+ craze and to the other side of the tunnel. :) I'm rooting for you!

edit: added a few details

[–]SillyGoose[S] 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I really appreciate how thorough this is. I think you are right. I have been very gentle with telling her that I am content in my womanhood since I do worry about upsetting her, but I suppose it is within my right to be honest if she is upsetting me. She is a really good friend when we aren't talking about all the gender stuff though.

In terms of college, I am pretty deep in the research process, so I'm not going to change my plans, but I realize that the schools I am interested in may not be the best for LGB in hindsight. I know they are really liberal, but that may mean TQ would dominate over LGB. I know pronouns in email signatures, introductions, and even pronoun buttons are things I have seen in marketing and on college visits. I don't really have other options though, since I know I want to go to a selective liberal arts school and they are pretty much all the same in terms of being woke and social justice hotspots. Anyway, if I may ask, do you know how bad things are with non-STEM classes/humanities classes? I am good with science but I kind of hate it so I was considering studying history/political science since that feeds well into law school, but I realize that poli sci probably attracts a lot of woke people. I'm not super invested in the subject I suppose, I just know I want to be an attorney. I know that may vary from place to place, but I'm sure you know a lot more than I do. Sorry for the longer response.

[–]gadflyinajar 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

It depends on the quality of school, but I don't mean to discourage you when I say that any non-STEM classes that I'm aware of are currently barely even what they say they are. Things like poli-sci and history border on the worst, next to Sociology. My sociology class (which was mandatory) taught me, directly from the textbook, that there were two kinds of research in the field. The first is the scientific method. The second is "Intuitive Retrospective", where you look at data, and try to figure out through your "lived experience" what you think the cause of the correlations are. This is a logical fallacy, and they are currently filling up scientific journals with drek based on this reasoning at a lightning pace.

This is maybe fine, just a bit frustrating for a while, keeping in mind that you don't seem to care much about the classes this impacts. Just keeping your head down and answering the questions the way they want you to answer will get you through it. I never took any classes on law, but I imagine when you get to something based on the concrete present rules of law they can't gaslight you. Try to keep in mind that teachers are people too, I'm in my early 20s and already many of my friends are on the professor track. I love them, but these people are not the brilliant genius tweed-jacket intellectuals who can never be wrong that academia thinks they are. These people are not much older than you. If you've got a good head on your shoulders you can often realize whether or not what they're saying makes any sense at all, so do your own research and remember how to think. That should also serve you well as an attorney.

[–]reluctant_commenter 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

My sociology class (which was mandatory) taught me, directly from the textbook, that there were two kinds of research in the field. The first is the scientific method. The second is "Intuitive Retrospective", where you look at data, and try to figure out through your "lived experience" what you think the cause of the correlations are. This is a logical fallacy, and they are currently filling up scientific journals with drek based on this reasoning at a lightning pace.

Holy shit! That is a real trip. I've heard some crazy stories out of friends' sociology classes (don't want to risk doxxing or I'd share lol), but that's really extreme. I took an anthropology class and it wasn't that bad, but I think there may be different norms between the two fields.

Try to keep in mind that teachers are people too, I'm in my early 20s and already many of my friends are on the professor track. I love them, but these people are not the brilliant genius tweed-jacket intellectuals who can never be wrong that academia thinks they are. These people are not much older than you. If you've got a good head on your shoulders you can often realize whether or not what they're saying makes any sense at all, so do your own research and remember how to think.

Agreed, it's important not to idealize professors. Research is awesome, but humans in every field are fallible.

[–]gadflyinajar 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah, we wonder why our arguments aren't getting through to these nutjobs, but it's because they're basically taught a 2+2=5 approach to reasoning. I could scarcely believe it, I might try and find the textbook this is taken from. The fact that I could so easily read the paragraph describing this "method" and see it as plainly ridiculous, and yet it made it into the book feels like gaslighting. Somehow it made it through enough editors, professors, and schoolboard committees to be "prescribed", so what right have I to criticize it? Is it more likely that I'm right and all these people are wrong? These days I worry more and more that I'm the crazy one, browsing tiny forums like this while the rest of the world revels in the smell of their own farts. Sure can't help but want to call out the emperor for his missing clothes, though.

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Intuitive Retrospective", where you look at data, and try to figure out through your "lived experience" what you think the cause of the correlations are

Yeah that's neo-Marxist thought. "Different ways of knowing." https://newdiscourses.com/tftw-ways-of-knowing/

I bring it up, because critical social justice is, to a degree, behind the trans movement. Or, they're at least cut from the same cloth.

[–]emptiedriver 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Try to keep in mind that teachers are people too, I'm in my early 20s and already many of my friends are on the professor track. I love them, but these people are not the brilliant genius tweed-jacket intellectuals who can never be wrong that academia thinks they are. These people are not much older than you.

And, correspondingly, remember that a lot of professors are struggling with the exact same issues that students are, i.e., they're caught in an academic world where being "woke" is expected. For them it's a livelihood issue: they're concerned they could lose jobs or anyway opportunities in publishing, presenting at conferences, networking and so on, if they're too blatant in disagreeing with what's considered progressive.

It's hard to actively fight the standard if you don't have money, stability, power, or some kind of established position. I encourage you to take the risks when you're a student since it will not matter as much - you can "innocently" ask questions or push back a little with fewer repercussions. And there will be some teachers who appreciate that you do (others, not so much, but usually the worst they could do is not write you a recommendation or something...)

[–]blargus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My parents were in college in the 70s and the way they talked about stuff when I was growing up, sociology was on par with underwater basketweaving.

I took a sociology class as my ethnic studies requirement and it was pretty interesting. It was about different groups in poverty around the world--favelas, homeless in NYC, bush people in Africa, Pacific Islanders, and Appalachia. The dept was aware it was the class for outsiders. The professor basically said that sociology doesn't have a direction or know what to do. Old fashioned sociology is like Victorians doing National Geographic type trips to gawk at non-Europeans and modern sociology is stuck in the "I can't judge anyone" thing and the professor was older when I took that a decade ago so she was probably from the 60s or 70s mindset which is a different generation to now as well.

[–]reluctant_commenter 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I really appreciate how thorough this is. I think you are right. I have been very gentle with telling her that I am content in my womanhood since I do worry about upsetting her, but I suppose it is within my right to be honest if she is upsetting me. She is a really good friend when we aren't talking about all the gender stuff though.

No problem! I hear ya. I have often struggled in the past with asserting myself. But, I think of it this way: A good friend cares about me and wants what's best for me; someone who cares about me wants to know if I feel hurt by something they say. We might not always agree but I can trust them to care about me and to actually listen to me. And, moreover, the phrases I stated (not saying you have to say those directly! just as examples) are not being mean. They're just statements about the truth, and I think they're all consistent with respecting your friend's experience and identification.

If your friend gets upset when you set a boundary-- well, a boundary is a boundary. It's OK for her to feel whatever she's feeling, but once you set that boundary, it is NOT ok for her to keep breaking it.

I don't really have other options though, since I know I want to go to a selective liberal arts school and they are pretty much all the same in terms of being woke and social justice hotspots.

I wouldn't say that's necessarily the case! Are you in the US? Liberal arts colleges in the US are generally be predisposed to harbor TQ+, but I'd say there are a few that are a lot worse than others, and probably some that are more relaxed than others as well (again, region really plays into this).

Anyway, if I may ask, do you know how bad things are with non-STEM classes/humanities classes? I am good with science but I kind of hate it so I was considering studying history/political science since that feeds well into law school, but I realize that poli sci probably attracts a lot of woke people.

From my experiences talking to friends, poli sci is kind of a mixed bag, a lot are far left but some are far right actually, haha. My experience with humanities classes was that many had a very liberal perspective, e.g. messages of equity, but there was relatively little mention of gender identity nonsense; if it ever affected discussion pertaining to demographics, it was almost always about race. (And those discussions tended to have way more nuance than the echo-chamber posts I see on Reddit.)

There are actually a couple of users on this sub who are/were in law school; if you're interested, I can PM them and ask if they'd be down to talk with you about it. But, whatever the case, you should pursue something you're interested in and not STEM just for the sake of avoiding TRAs! My field has its own problems, lol.

[–]SillyGoose[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah, I'm in the US. I can only really apply to schools in a certain region though, given that my parents don't want me to leave the country or go to a college too many hours away from home. I don't want to go into too much detail on here at risk of doxxing myself. I appreciate the offer about the users in law school, but I think I'm good for now. I have a few years before I would go to law school and I suppose there is always the chance that I would change my mind while I'm in college.

[–]reluctant_commenter 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Makes sense! Good luck with everything. :)

[–]chazzstrong 23 insightful - 1 fun23 insightful - 0 fun24 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah, they're trying to convert you. Your existence as a woman sexually attracted to other women means there is a defined binary scale in regards to sexuality. This very fact challenges their insane mindset. I hate to say it so bluntly, but their attempts to 'convert' you into their cult is the last stage before they turn on you completely and blast you as being transphobic.

Then again, this is all from some old-ass dude who thankfully never had to grow up with this craziness. For me, there will never be 'middle ground' with people who think like your friends, because I exist on a plane where science is based in reality and they do not, so my responses to that kind of ideology is more absolute.

Suffice to say, if your friend isn't willing to respect you and your sexuality, they don't sound like much of a friend.

[–]SillyGoose[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't think she is going to turn on me, but I guess we do have another year until graduation so I can't be sure. I have never said anything that could be remotely considered transphobic to her and I don't think she has an issue with me being a lesbian. I think in her mind, she honestly thinks that she is helping. We have been good friends since elementary school and it is a valuable friendship when the TQ stuff is avoided.

[–]GConly 17 insightful - 6 fun17 insightful - 5 fun18 insightful - 6 fun -  (0 children)

said she keeps subconsciously using "they/them pronouns"

Subconsciously my ass.

[–]SuperGayIsOkay 18 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 0 fun19 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

She asked me if I "feel like a girl", commented that she thinks I'll use "she/they pronouns" in college, said she keeps subconsciously using "they/them pronouns" for me, told me she thinks I'll "figure things out soon", etc.

And this is exactly how social contagion happens. There's a peer pressure element to confirming to the group, and apparently being lesbian isn't acceptable whereas being trans is considered superior.

You've already told her you're a female lesbian, and if she keeps making these incredibly invalidating and homophobic remarks as if trying to undermine your own sense of identity, you have every right to tell her to fuck right off.

people using "they/them" for me without asking

What the pronoun crowd don't realize is that they can't police other people's use of pronouns. None of us here look at a man who identifies as trans and uses "she/her" in our heads to think of them. The only time we'd use their "preferred pronouns" is in a social setting where we can't safely rock the boat.

[–]boypower 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This person is currently trapped in a prison of her own making, and is trying to drag you down with her. Don't give her that satisfaction, and point out how invasive and disrespectful her actions are.

[–]NeedMoreCoffee~=[,,_,,]=^_^= 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm sorry you are going through all this.

You seem like a strong woman. And that is probably the reason she treats you like this. Somewhere deep inside in her conscienceness she knows she is not trans. But if you , her strong lesbian friend will be trans too then she is right in her decision.

Do not give in and stop being nice to her and be nice to you.

Look her straight in the eyes and tell her you are a lesbian. That you respected her new choices and pronouns and that you expect her to do the exact same thing for you and if not you have to rethink this friendship. Mention you will not have the conversation again.

Remember "No." is a full sentence.

Like someone else said your entire existence is a walking billboard that she is doing something very stupid. Even if you are polite i'm not sure she will be able to stay friends with you if she doubles down on the trans thing.

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I get it, she may just want someone to relate to, so I can't be too mad, but I think it is disrespectful.

Anyone trying to make you trans should make you mad, doesn’t matter the reason. She’s ignoring who you are as a person.

why can't I just be a lesbian?

you can ask your friends that. They should respect your identity since you go out of your way to respect theirs. let them know you know who you are already. Transitioning doesn’t make weight issues disappear.

I don't want to make this a book

This is the place to rant so go ahead.

Don’t let people misgender you, even if you don’t care. You can let them know you don’t do the pronoun thing. I’d like to say it gets better at college, you’d have to ask someone in there now, but from what I see it won’t be. Just keep true to yourself, find people who think like you for friends, and stay strong. Also, stay away from sjws

[–]SnowAssMan 13 insightful - 4 fun13 insightful - 3 fun14 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

I guess responding with "quit misgendering me, sexist homophobe" would be too much?

If the suicide rate is what's concerning them (it usually is the only reason they never question the self-id BS) then they should know that the rate of self-reported attempted suicides among LGB youth is also 40%.

[–]RedEyedWarriorGay | Male | 🇮🇪 Irish 🇮🇪 | Antineoliberal | Cocks are Compulsory 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It is really heart-rending what has happened to our children in western society. Especially to homosexual children. It’s disgusting.

Anyway, you need to stand up for yourself. Tell your friend, who is female and will always be female, that you are a lesbian woman and you will always be that way. Tell her that she needs to accept that you’re a woman if she wants to remain friends with you. If she keeps this shit up, drop her as a friend. She’s a toxic influence on your life, and it’s better to have no friends than to have a "friend" who clearly does not respect you. I know it’s hard to make new friends, but it’s harder to maintain your sanity when you’re around people like your "friend".

Avoid these woke kids at school. They are also toxic. Say you are lesbian woman, and demand that they respect your pronouns - well, your biological reality, but apparently these idiots don’t speak a proper language so you have to translate for them. Just hang out with people who know this is bullshit if you can find them.

In fact, in September you’re going into your final year of secondary school, and it will be all over then. Be careful what you say or do, but if you become a pariah around the woke kids, so what? It’s only one more year, and these assholes never respected you, so why would you want them to like you? Stand up for yourself, speak your mind, and you will eventually find a few people who will respect you and want to be around you. And sadly, it does get worse in college. But you don’t have to go to college. You can join a trade. You can get a part time job which can become a full time job or lead into a full time job. And if you do go to college, pick a degree in STEM or business, and avoid the LGBT stuff like the plague. But if you don’t know what you want to do in college, then don’t go. At least don’t go until you know what you want to do, know how to stand up for yourself, and figured out how you are going to pay for college.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I wish I could hug you right now!!! Hope this doesn't sound weird lmao. But I read everything and I only thiought RUN!!!!!! I find this to be very dangerous for you to be honest, the fact that every non straight friend around you is coming out as trans or non binary or pan is very scary but the most scary of all is the pressure they're doing TO YOU for you to identify with that as well. I know this might be very hard for you to deal with, and if you want someone to talk to you can always pm me, if you want. I'm from a country where the TQ ideology isn't that bad luckily. But I would say in college things can get better if you go to a STEM degree or something of the sort. If you go to an arts or literature and even psychology for example, you're prone to found a more "woke" environment. I wish you the very best and keep strong! Those are not good friends to you believe me. I know you like them and know them for a very long time, but currently they're not good for you at all. And you need to have your eating disorder properly cured and find balance in your life. Not more mess and mutilating your body, which I'm sure it's great just the way it is. Best regards.

[–]SillyGoose[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I should have been more clear, but the friend who is nonbinary actually is respectful of my identity. I only included her in the story since it still is worrisome that she felt the need to reidentify herself. Anyway, she has called out the trans friend for pushing me on the trans issue before when we have hung out together. I appreciate your comment though, you seem like a nice person.

[–]Q-Continuum-kin 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You really can't let people think you are with them on the ideology because this stuff is literally a religion and all they are going to do is endlessly proselytize their religion to anyone they think they have a foothold with. Once they join the cult they need to keep convincing themselves they made the right decision by bringing in more people.

[–]slushpilot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

My point in typing this out is this: why can't I just be a lesbian?

Honest question: at 17, how many sexual relationships have you had? How many long-term relationships?

Maybe you are a lesbian, and that's great. I just can't understand the need to label yourself, and the same goes for your friends who think they'll use such-and-such pronouns as if it's a fashion choice you can pick out out of a hat—rather than a deeply-felt sense of self, which ultimately takes some time to reflect on through experience and figure out for oneself.

This obsession about identity labels is immature and short-sighted. Just be for now, and figure out where you land once you've lived a bit more. Tell your friends the same.

[–]SillyGoose[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I have struggled with this a lot, since I feel like I have to prove myself, but I know that I like women and I have no interest in men in the same way that my straight friends know that they only like women or only like men. Nobody questions them even though they have not been in a relationship. Honestly, I don't think I have an obsession with labels. I don't go around talking about things like that because I have much more interesting things to talk about, like my hobbies or goals in life. I only really mentioned it here because it is relevant to what I am experiencing with my trans friend. My point in saying "why can't I just be a lesbian" is that my sexuality is a big part of why my friend is pushing me to identify as trans, the other part being my tendency to gravitate towards men's clothes. In my day-to-day life, I don't think about my sexuality or talk about it with people since it isn't a big deal to me. I understand what you are saying though, I just don't think that is what I am doing here.

[–]slushpilot 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That's good. You sound like you have your head on your shoulders, and you don't have to prove anything to anyone. I just wanted to push on that because I've seen kids start to label and hence limit themselves with a sexual identity before they've even kissed someone. I'm not saying that's you, but be wary of it.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Labels are very useful, ESPECIALLY when you're a minority. It's a practical way of letting people around us know something about us. For example, I'm also a lesbian and have known since I was a teenager. It was highly annoying to have everyone around me constantly asking me about boyfriends all the time or guys when I was not only totally uninterested in that but also wanted to express my interest in women. Saying "I'm a lesbian" is much easier than "I'm a woman sexually attracted to other woman and not sexually attracted to men" for example. Saying you're homosexual is exactly the same thing as saying you're a female, you have brown eyes, you enjoy sports or any other characteristic of ours. It isn't being "obsessed with identity labels". There are some people very obsessed with a crazy amount of identity labels, though. This doesn't seem the case.