LGB HistoryReminder who fought for many of the rights we currently have. We stand on the shoulder of the Generation of the Gays that came before us. #OlderGaysofTiktok

submitted by Happy_face_caller from vm.tiktok.com

all 34 comments
sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 2 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 4 fun3 insightful - 5 fun -  (31 children)

I don't stand on the shoulder of anyone. Nobody else gave me anything, nor do I owe anyone for my present, and shitty, circumstances. No one, past or present, is standing up for me. And that's fine as long as they don't demand I kneel for them. Let me go my own way.

[–][deleted] 20 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 0 fun21 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Don't stand on the shoulders of anyone then, who cares?

You refuse to recognize that LGB before you fought for your right to even express your opinion to do so.

You're so wrapped up in your own personal feelings that you can't even appreciate that you would be destroyed, literally, without the efforts of those who came before you. You just gotta keep pissing and moaning that we aren't doing it your way and aren't solving your personal problems.

GO YOUR OWN FUCKING WAY THEN. PLEASE.

YOU CAN DO IT ANY TIME.

Why are you pissing and moaning about us not doing it for you? Take some responsibility upon yourself, Salty. Your weak will is not our problem.

You shun LGB constantly, don't cry to us because of your decision. You made the choice, so deal with it.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 6 insightful - 5 fun6 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 5 fun -  (6 children)

What a pathetic response. "You would be destroyed without the efforts of those who came before you!"

Literally, as in killed? Or metaphorically, as in mentally devastated? Either way, that's a lot of hyperbole. I'm already suffering a lot, as I'm sure you know since you seem so hung up on me. So it really can't get that much worse.

Also, WHO came before me? Who? Who exactly is standing up for the "rights" of people like me? Go on. I can wait.

Who stood up for me when I was mocked and harassed as a child for "looking gay," and had to deal with other kids making invasive sexual jokes about how I liked it up the ass and was essentially a male whore? No one.

Who stood up for me when I was sexually abused by men who saw me as "exotic" and therefore a trophy? No one.

Who stood up for me and defended my rights when, even as an adult, my sexuality became a topic of invasive and humiliating rumors and public "jokes" because I was the weird and androgynous, therefore gay one? No one.

Who stood up for me when the gay community tried to groom me as a teenager? Or as an adult, where I was insulted and called a bunch of names because I wasn't afraid to turn down guys, and didn't believe in gender horseshit or other overdramatic, trivial nonsense? No one.

Who stood up for me when the LGBT+ community effectively called me a bad person and evil because of where I was born? No one.

Don't you dare say I emotionally "owe" people who supposedly did work for me. Because they didn't. No one did. American activists from decades ago waving a rainbow flag did not make my life any better. It did not prevent me from suffering nor make my life any less of a shitshow than it is today. There is absolutely NOTHING that I have that came from any "activism", and I don't just mean my sexuality. Nothing. I don't have any special rights. I don't have protections. I don't even have support.

It's extremely disrespectful, condecending, and close minded of you to say that you think my life has been improved by "activists" of another country, before I was born, that did not do anything to improve my life.

This is why people like me have low opinions of LGBT. It's literally just privileged people telling those of us who have suffered that we should be greatful because at least we don't have to deal with (first world problem), or we're not allowed to feel bad anymore because (random nonsensical claim here.)

[–][deleted] 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

You feel awfully sorry for yourself. Which I get, I feel sorry for myself at times too. There's nothing wrong with that.

The thing is, I don't blame LGB because my life sucks. I didn't choose this life, but I'm in it, so I've got to do something about it. No one else will do it for me, it's not their responsibility.

Maybe you should try doing something instead of blaming others for not doing it for you.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 3 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 4 fun4 insightful - 5 fun -  (4 children)

I don't blame LGB for my life sucking, either. I blame the people who raised me, the men who mistreated me, the people who belittled me, etc... yeah. You seem to be confused.

Just because I'm anti LGBT doesn't mean I blame them for all of my problems, lmao. I mean, arguably, yeah, some of my problems involve them, like gay and bi guys sexually mistreating me, or gay and lesbian communities attacking me and being toxic instead of being welcoming. But that doesn't mean they caused my life to go to shit.

And me saying "As someone who is Russian, young, and currently suffering, I don't owe American older gay rights activists any support for supposed rights and help I never recieved, because nobody supported me in my life to this day" does not equal saying "LGB community is reason my life is shit!"

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

If LGB are not to blame, then why are saying anything about how we didn't help solve your problems?

You really need to examine your own hypocrisy, you are speaking in circles just like TRAs do.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Because you brought it up?

You are saying that some mysterious group of people before my time magically made my life better, so I owe them and need to somehow, I don't know, metaphorically kiss their ass even if they're dead.

You tell me. I don't know what the hell you mean by that, so, if you could clarify that'd be great. All I'm saying is no, nobody ever stood up for me, nobody "gave me rights", trans or LGB people, nobody made my life better and nobody prevented my suffering. So I don't owe anyone anything. I am not "standing on anyone's shoulders" because nobody nor their actions elevated me in any way. I have been left to suffer and groups continue to trample over people in my position, what exactly do we have to be "thankful" for??

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Because you brought it up?

Nope I didn't. You commented first.

You are saying that some mysterious group of people before my time magically made my life better, so I owe them and need to somehow, I don't know, metaphorically kiss their ass even if they're dead.

Never said that either.

You tell me. I don't know what the hell you mean by that, so, if you could clarify that'd be great. All I'm saying is no, nobody ever stood up for me, nobody "gave me rights", trans or LGB people, nobody made my life better and nobody prevented my suffering. So I don't owe anyone anything. I am not "standing on anyone's shoulders" because nobody nor their actions elevated me in any way. I have been left to suffer and groups continue to trample over people in my position, what exactly do we have to be "thankful" for?

I already told you. I'm not going to repeat myself when you aren't listening.

You're just salty and hateful that some magical group of people didn't rescue you from your own demise, and who aren't going to take take the blame on behalf of those who caused it. You're pointing fingers at the wrong people, and have become homophobic towards people who had absolutely nothing to do with any of it. And putting the responsibility on them to absolve themselves for the sins of the criminals of your past.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You brought it up after I commented. You got all angry about how I owe people and all that crap.

Okay, so what are you saying, then?

I already told you.

No, you didn't. Not you or anyone else on the thread. You just keep dodging the question.

You're just salty and hateful that some magical group of people didn't rescue you from your own demise,

No, I'm just salty that a bunch of rich, privileged assholes are demanding that I and every other person happen to be gay repay them, when they've really achieved nothing and not affected us in any way. I'm annoyed that, people like you demand that people like me pay emotional labour and services to people we don't know, never met, and don't know anything about, all because of the wild claim that they gave us something to be thankful for. But they didn't.

There is a word for it, a word everyone on here should know because TRAs do it - historical revisionism.

I don't care if LGB people don't do anything for me. As long as they don't expect anything from me in return, it's all good. But it's the fact that, people like you are demanding that people like me "pay" or "stand on the shoulders of" these people, when they have turned a blind eye to people like me, that's when it's a problem. They are free to do nothing, just like everyone else has done nothing, as long as they don't pretend that they did something. No one else is demanding my undying respect and obedience other than trans people.

And people wonder why LGBT acceptance is going down...

[–]InLaymansterms 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Woah, mic drop 👏

[–]Happy_face_caller[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

If you are a Gay person you absolutely stand on the platform someone else fought for you. Stfu insolent turd

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

No, I do not. Nobody "fought for me." Don't be ridiculous. I have nothing, aside from what, embarassing "Pride" events? People making jokes about "tops and bottoms"? "Gay culture?" I never wanted any of that or asked for it. This is not good things.

I don't owe anyone anything. I don't stand on anyone's shoulders.

[–]Happy_face_caller[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Why is this troll still here lying? Get gone

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

Lying about what??

[–]Happy_face_caller[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

This troll is still commenting. Go away

[–]bald-janitor 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

You are being reported dw

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Pot and kettle...

[–]Happy_face_caller[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How are you not banned

[–]bald-janitor 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Look her comment history u/magnora7, she insults everyone including posters on her own sub

[–]bald-janitor 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

You repeatedly drag down discussion, should we start reporting you?

[–]wafflegaffWoman. SuperBi. 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Maybe nobody you personally know gave you anything, that you know of, but maybe the subject just hasn't come up, either. Generations which preceded you, however, gave you everything. It's important to be aware of that so you realize that none of us were born having these things. They had to be fought for, over and over and over again, and they can just as easily go away if we relax, as we are currently seeing. It's very easy to not get this if you weren't the one in the trenches. That's normal, so it's important to have those reminders.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

No they did not. Name a single person who did - I bet you can't. I am also in hell right now so don't you dare imply that I "have it easy" or should be greatful, or that people before me somehow had it worse

I don't owe anyone anything, regardless of my life situation. But I ESPECIALLY don't owe anyone seeing as nobody ever stood up to me or supported people like me, or did anything that made my life better. Don't try to gaslight and rewrite my history. It's just as bad as being told that "trans people fought for my rights." They did fucking not.

[–]wafflegaffWoman. SuperBi. 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

This whole response makes me think we're not even having the same conversation. I'm talking about entire generations of people fighting for gay rights. The list is so long and obvious and entails so many people, well-known and otherwise, that it isn't necessary to pick out one name. Of course, I can just pick out my name, but you're clearly looking for something other than what you're stating. The notion that those people don't exist is so odd that I don't think listing a thousand of them would satisfy you.

I wish you well with whatever fight it is that you're having, but it isn't with me or the people who fought for us all to have a safer world to live in while also being LGB.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Okay, but I don't have "gay rights." Not in my home country, not where I live now. I don't have any "rights" that aren't granted to all people by default. And if you are seriously implying that I need to "owe" people because of gay marriage, in this current country which again I will state I wasn't born in (and may not be able to marry in anyway) that's ridiculous. I don't support marriage and I don't think it's a "right", nor will I ever use it.

And of course you cant specify, because let me guess, you DONT actually know what you're talking about and this is akin to the "trans women gave you rights" claim. As in, they never actually did, you just want people to believe that.

So that's like telling me I need to thank medical workers in the maternity department for giving me and others the right to safely have babies even though I'm a guy and that's literally never going to happen to me.

I am Russian, by the way. You people can't seem to make your minds up about my nationality. Like, which is it - that us Russians are gay hating gay killing barbarians, or am I an ungrateful young person who has tons of "gay rights" and privileges I need to be thankful for? Because it can't be both. And the truth is also neither.

[–]wafflegaffWoman. SuperBi. 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Okay, that makes more sense. The detail about you being in a different country hadn't become apparent (I think it is elsewhere on other threads here now, though).

The rest of what you're saying is either mixed up in that miscommunication or otherwise garbled so I don't think resopnding is going to help much. You're really angry and it sounds like you have good reasons to be.

As for Russians, couldn't tell you, as each one is an individual like everybody else in the world. But here's a stupid example anyway: I have friends who fled to the US from Russia. They seem like pretty cool people. So I'm not inclined toward generalizations. But again, that argument is one that is clearly going on for you already, not with me.

In other words you have a lot to fight about and it clearly doesn't matter with whom you do that, making most of this non-productive or miscommunication. I don't think it's helping you.

But yeah, you are in the wrong country for the gay rights argument if you are not in the US (or maybe another more enlightened European country, or Canada).

And of course I can specify, I just don't see the point because when it comes to what I was actually referring to, the quantity of people involved in moving things forward for gay people is vast. If you are saying those people don't exist—and I can't tell if that's what you're saying or not but it kinda sounds like it, but that'd be weirdly divorced from reality—then we are definitely not going to be able to converse.

Again, I hope you sort out the stuff you are going through, it sounds like it really sucks. And if you are saying you are currently in Russia, yeah I hope you are able to get the F out if that's what you need to do. Can't recommend the USA at the moment, though, either.

[–]OPPRESSED_REPTILIANIntersex male | GNC | Don't call me "a gay", "twink" or "queen" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thing is, OP didn't specify America. OP implied that ALL gay people owe American older gay rights activists, because reasons. I know it's a problem on the internet, though. Americans think they literally are the center of the world.

But hell even in America I don't think it's true. Younger generations don't owe older ones anything. Younger homosexuals don't owe old people for "giving them rights" which isn't even true.

I also disagree there. I don't think there was such thing as "moving gay rights forward." I think it's all a scam and things progressively get worse, not better. Plus I do not agree with the definition of "rights" that many LGBT activists claim. I don't think marriage is a right, I don't think "representation" is a right, I don't think Pride is a right and I don't think forcing bakers to make a cake for you is a right. I think these are all privileges, ones I strongly oppose.

I'm not saying the people didn't exist (This is reminding me of when trans people claim "omg are you saying I don't exist?" when you tell them you don't believe in gender) I'm just saying they are not "heroes" or inspirational. They are no different to the useless "activists" of today.

Nice subtle xenophobia. I'm not in Russia, and that implication that Russians are leaving to go to the US like it's some kind of sanctuary is laughable. I have lived in the US and I can tell you it's definitely worse. I'd rather go back to Russia than the US, and if I was in Russia and it was too bad for whatever reason (note: "gay killings" are not that reason because it's literally an urban myth. At least criticize Russia for real issues like a dystopian government and terrible treatment of women) the logical move would be to flee to somewhere in Europe.

I just think it's depressing that, not only did you miss the part where I said I don't currently live there, but also you assume that I need to get out by default... Do you know how long I've been away from my home country and how I often wish I could go back, because I feel unwanted elsewhere? And a lot of people feel the same way about America, especially in Europe. Personally I find the LGBT stuff way more tolerable in Russia than elsewhere because at least with the conservative environment people don't ramble incessantly about gender identity and how being gay is stunning and brave.

[–]wafflegaffWoman. SuperBi. 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Indeed. I might not be 50+ plus but I have been in those trenches year after year since I turned 20, fighting for these things. I didn't make a list that I can now recite—the problems were everywhere and varied. If you were alive and LGB during that time you kept your boots on and you kept showing up to fight for some semblance of fairness—the semblance we only have now because of what we did then. That's been LGB life for a long damned time until (only less so) very recently.

[–]ArthnoldManacatsaman🇬🇧🌳🟦 1 insightful - 5 fun1 insightful - 4 fun2 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

buT WhAt aBoUT TrAnS WoMEn oF COLouR?