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[–]GConly 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

GC's canon and ideas as they are derived from radical feminist thinkers

Anything that didn't follow radfem canon was excised ASAP on Reddit.

Any dissent with the (minimal and shoddy) science they posted was crushed.

Sorry GC, but the overwhelming majority of scientists researching the human brain will tell you sex differences do exist, they do matter, and they aren't from socialisation. You can see them in neonates.

Just because you've found about four authors who say otherwise and you post them repeatedly in a cycle does not make them correct.

We've known how how induce male aggression, play patterns and sexual behaviour in females via extra androgens in the fetal stage since the fifties. You look ridiculous insisting that all the differences are down to socialisation. Fine and Joel are laughing stocks and their work is widely criticized. For a start multiple people have pointed out Joel's work demonstrates male and female brain can reliably be identified even with the limited criteria she used. Fine just omits huge chunks of data about testosterone and prenatal exposure because it disproves her.

Don't worry we ladies, the latest research debunks the wrong brain sex BS pretty thoroughly, but it does so while accepting brain sex differences exist, and proving homosexuality is hard wired into the brain at the same time.

It means that radfems don't get taken seriously when professionals get involved, which is a terrible thing because it's the paediatricians and scientists pulling this apart the who will eventually sort all this out. If GC keeps contradicting them and undermining them, it's just going to prolong a bad situation.

We need to move on from GC being a radical feminist sub, and make it over into an activist base for women's rights with a coherent policy that's based in good science. Not junk science.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

an activist base for women's rights with a coherent policy

I might be able to get behind something like this. maybe it should be a new space though and women from GC can join if they want. & GC's contributions to womens rights should be credited if things do go in a different direction.

I wonder now though, if this is really inconsistent with GC. And brain differences can also be due to non-genetic factors and epigenetic factors and all that. "man" and "woman" are not static things, we're always in the process of evolving. GC doesn't claim all men and all women are the same, but says these differences are due to individual personality.

They do seem to be pretty against any biological origin origin of behavioral differences though, which does seem probably not right to me, and I wish we could talk about it.

A bit off-topic, but what does the latest research say about homosexuality/sexuality?

We've known how how induce male aggression, play patterns and sexual behaviour in females via extra androgens in the fetal stage since the fifties.

did people actually... do this?? this is a bit disturbing.

It means that radfems don't get taken seriously when professionals get involved, which is a terrible thing because it's the paediatricians and scientists pulling this apart the who will eventually sort all this out. If GC keeps contradicting them and undermining them, it's just going to prolong a bad situation.

How do you think this interaction could work better?

[–]GConly 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

did people actually... do this?? this is a bit disturbing.

Did it with quite a few mammal species including primates. Started in 1953.

And brain differences can also be due to non-genetic factors and epigenetic factors and all that. "man" and "woman" are not static things

Well, you can see the brain of male and female fetuses are different upon autopsy from preterm stillbirths. That paper was quite a grim read.

You can also find that puberty levels big hormones make alterations to the brain. Which debunked the old Swaab paper that started this wrong brain sex area BS back in 94. Long story but will explain if asked.

How do you think this interaction could work better?

They've really got to drop the 'all differences are all socialisation /no brain sex' stuff. It makes me cringe every time I see it.

I know why they stick to it. If it's socialised into them you can fix it, if it's innate you give them an excuse to shrug their shoulders and claim it's natural and therefore okay/forgivable. There's also the issue that accepting innate differences exist means people accepting unequal representation in positions of power is inevitable.

From my POV, you have to know what actually causes a problem before you have a hope of fixing it, or at least coming up with effective coping strategies.

The data coming out lately is showing straight TIMs have normally masculinised brains. And that's the ones who had a childhood GD diagnosis. It's also showing sexual arousal when cross dressing is definitely an issue with a lot if them.

Personally I think we need to focus on a workable strategy based on what the public believe after being fed TRA bullshit for years.

From a lot of arguing with the average Jane libfem, they believe that all TIMs have gender dysphoria as kids, they are mostly gay, and they have wrong sex brains. They also believe most have had SRS, are in hormones, and have female violent and sex offending behaviour. They think TIMs are dying by the thousands from hate crimes, and gd kids are committing suicide all over if they aren't instantly transitioned.

They also believe all kids turning up with GD are permanently trans, don't know about the high desistance rates, and genuinely think puberty blockers are safe with no long term negative effects.

I think strategically we need to stick to presenting people with the facts in a consistent non hostile manner, carefully documenting how the TRAs are actively lying or being disingenuous.

A bit off-topic, but what does the latest research say about homosexuality/sexuality?

Varies. With females it seems to be down to getting excess testosterone. For example,, my female family members have a condition that means we produce excess t, a lot of the girls are gay or bi.

In men, they seem to be getting normal male T levels, but epigenetic changes that lower the response to it in the brain are the issue. They also seem to have an overall lower response to t because the average gay man has subtle differences to his face, and they average out at a cm or two shorter.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks for sharing this, it's all pretty interesting.

I think strategically we need to stick to presenting people with the facts in a consistent non hostile manner, carefully documenting how the TRAs are actively lying or being disingenuous.

This seems pretty doable. And it will probably help.