"Trans Women Are Men … Including Me" - Debbie Hayton

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[–]absoluteblasphemy 21 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 0 fun22 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Super interesting video. If all trans identified folk thought like this we wouldn’t be in such hot water right now.

Thought it was very poignant how Debbie says he wouldn’t have wished to transition as a child because then he would not have had children. It’s very counter to the huge swathes of the trans community are pushing for early transition, because testosterone “ruins” them or some such, they don’t understand what it is to wipe out people’s fertility for no good reason.

I saw a video from a TW the other day who had been on hormones for a few years, and he seemed to genuinely believe that he could become fertile again because his doctor told him so. Literally never happens, Gigi Gorgeous and Blair White both took time off estradiol/blockers and it didn’t happen.

Never heard of it happening in the short periods TW come off hormones, only ever for detransitioned men post a couple years.

Doctors need to be laying out very clearly this is basically a one way street to sterility. AND that it seems to benefit trans IDd people to spend at least a portion of their life trying to live as their biological sex. I hope someone is taking notes.

[–]MarkTwainiac 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Thought it was very poignant how Debbie says he wouldn’t have wished to transition as a child because then he would not have had children.

But tellingly in Debbie's ret-conned account of his life, he emphasizes how important having children has been to him without ever mentioning his wife not even once. Debbie never acknowledges that he has children only thanks to the woman who conceived, gestated and gave birth to them.

Nor does Debbie ever note that his wife is the one who held their family together whilst Debbie went through a mid-life crisis in which Debbie was solely concerned with this own self, his AGP & his "transition" - and that Debbie's wife is also the one who got stuck helping the kids deal with their distress over dad announcing he's now a woman.

[–]lefterfield 10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

I don't really care about his personal life. Any time a man announces he wants to dress like a woman, his wife should leave, no further questions asked. But whatever their relationship now is their business. All Debbie can speak to is how he feels about his experiences, and that's all that's told here. What I think is more important is that his interview may give a lot of non-radfem people a new perspective and reason to believe that they're not being "mean" by telling the truth about transgenderism.

[–]MarkTwainiac 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

All Debbie can speak to is how he feels about his experiences, and that's all that's told here.

But over many years, Debbie has been on many public platforms in which his lack of concern for his wife and children (both of whom are daughters, I believe) has been on display for all the world.

If Debbie is to be extolled for speaking about "how he feels about his experiences," and nothing more can be asked of Debbie, I still have to wonder why the Triggernometry guys and nearly all other press accounts - by Debbie & by others - fail to probe or even mention that what drove Debbie to go trans is AGP. Debbie has publicly come out as AGP, but beyond that crickets.

Any time a man announces he wants to dress like a woman, his wife should leave, no further questions asked.

This suggests to me that you are very poorly informed about what it's like to be a woman & mother of children in a heterosexual marriage/LTR where the male partner/father is an AGP.

[–]lefterfield 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

None of what you're saying changes in any way my lack of concern for the relationship between Debbie and his wife. I'm sure he is dismissive, egotistical, and has little regard for her support. Just like the vast majority of married men toward their wives. What I care about is the lies being told to children about transgenderism, the laws being passed to silence critics, the rights that women everywhere lose.

This suggests to me that you are very poorly informed about what it's like to be a woman & mother of children in a heterosexual marriage/LTR where the male partner/father is an AGP.

It's unfortunate if it's hard for her to leave, but she is not my responsibility. You want me to support shelters for women, cool, awesome, I do already. And keep the men out of them. You are mistaking my exasperation with the desire of radical feminists to lose the war in favor of winning every tiny battle with not being aware of what her life may be like. No, I am. I just don't care. She's an adult, and she's one woman. Hundreds of thousands of people will see this interview, and be introduced to a perspective they are not allowed to discuss on social media. That is a GOOD THING. And that's what I care about.

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Huh? I never said Debbie's interviews & articles shouldn't be shared. I agree with you that it's a GOOD THING that Debbie's current views & recent columns get as wide an airing as possible.

I was just pointing out that Debbie's narrative of how Debbie came to be is artfully crafted to leave out certain very important aspects - and to exclude entirely the impact of Debbie's AGP & selfish behavior on Debbie's wife & children.

I just don't care. She's an adult, and she's one woman.

To me, this just shows that you have no idea how widespread AGP is, and how many women (wives, partners) & children there are whose lives these men's sexual fetish & narcissism have wreaked havoc on.

[–]lefterfield 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Again, you insist on confusing my disagreement with you as being a matter of ignorance. She is an adult, and she is one woman. If her situation is intolerable, she should leave. My opinion on the interview or their marriage will do nothing to help with that.

Bottom line: I don't care how his behavior affects his wife. That is a question for a divorce attorney, a support group, or a women's shelter. I care about the people who will benefit from the interview, and I'm tired of radical feminists focusing on anything other than the larger, political battle.

[–]absoluteblasphemy 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, excellent comment. This is something I find with even the most agreeable and quote unquote “nice” trans identified people; they seem to not have much in the way of understanding where their thought paths lead when absorbed by younger generations.

Moving away from the problem of what his transition did to his wife and children, which I’m in full agreement with you and others here about. Debbie likes having children, young TIMs are basically not going to have that option, at least if they’re transed as children. Lots of TIMs won’t do sperm donation either because their dysphoria, uwu.

And whomst exactly do we think pushed in this legislation for mass transition and social acceptance if not the OG transsexuals? There is still a lot to be answered for.

This is why I reiterate that it’s a pathology.

Also don’t get me started on the TW who think they’re worthy of having their genetic material passed on. Or having women carry and raise their children. Actually just enrages me beyond rationally, let’s not further burden our evolutionary progress by producing offspring for men who chose to sterilise themselves, please.

Edit: ahhhhhh words

[–]lefterfield 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I thought this was great. I can't think of a single thing he said I disagreed with, and it struck me as a much, much psychologically healthier outlook than the current gender cult.

[–]censorshipment 6 insightful - 6 fun6 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 6 fun -  (3 children)

Then don't identify as trans women. Don't use female pronouns nor a feminine name, like "Debbie", and don't use hormones.

Straight women, stop making concessions with these men who say things you agree with. As a lesbian, I don't want to be fooled by men on hormones. I want to know that a man is a man by looking at him. And it can be quite hard to tell the difference when I look at older white people.

For example, whenever I hear Joyce Meyer on TV, I think she's a man, and she could easily be mistaken for a trans woman using hormones.

https://youtu.be/0mCHr6epdOE

This confusion shouldn't exist.

[–]AlexisK 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Am I understanding it correctly - you are against gender non-conformity and want people to look and act according to "classic" gender roles?

[–]WildApples 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I did not get that at all from that comment. I took it to mean that medical transitioning and claims of being the opposite sex are making things confusing, not plain gender non-conformity.