all 10 comments

[–]itsnotaboutewe 22 insightful - 1 fun22 insightful - 0 fun23 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

So, they started out with some good intentions and with sensible people writing their policies but were themselves captured by transcult activists? Or was this just phase one of their plan to trans the world? I wonder if it began changing direction around the time Susie Green joined?

[–]jet199[S] 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

I think it started out as a charity to help kids then it was taken over by the likes of Green/Islan and became a charity to help abusive mothers.

[–]MarkTwainiac 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Just to be clear: Mermaids isn't just a charity for abusive mothers. It's for abusive parents and other adults too, many of whom are not parents themselves. Such as the Webberleys; the volunteers who go around giving trainings about gender ideology and the Barbie-GI Joe spectrum to teachers, the police and corporations; and the trans groomers like the odious Fox Fisher who directly indoctrinate kids into the cult at RL camps and by making propaganda materials that Mermaids funds and puts out.

Also, neither Green nor Islan started out as single mothers; they had (have?) male partners, and in Green's case we know her decision to trans her son Jackie was driven not just by her own twisted ideas, but by her husbands pronounced homophobia and inability to accept little Jackie's desire to play with dolls.

The mothers might be on the front lines and be the most visible, but they are often acting in concert with - and sometimes acting on behalf of - the fathers, too. I know there have been some well-publicized cases where mothers have been the sole driver behind the transing of their kids. But usually two parents are involved, and the mother only appears to be the main or sole driver coz the nitty-gritty of childrearing is still mostly left to women.

[–]jet199[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It's so sad to see someone here triggered and actively trying to distract from the issue.

Munchausens by proxy offenders are almost all female. The transing of kids follows exactly the same pattern.

You can't blame the men for that one.

And you can't solve that problem and protect children unless you admit the truth.

It really is arch hypocrisy to call sexual assaults a men's problem because they make up 98% of offenders and then not accept the same for munchausens or trans kids in relation to women.

[–]MarkTwainiac 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's so sad to see someone here triggered and actively trying to distract from the issue.

Not triggered, not trying to distract. Was responding to your claim that Mermaids is for "abusive mothers." I said it was for abusive adults.

Munchausens by proxy offenders are almost all female. The transing of kids follows exactly the same pattern.

I agree that those accused of Munchasen's- by-proxy offenders are almost all female. But no one mentioned MbyP on this thread until you did just now. Also, lots of questions long have been raised about the MbP, which some have called "a disordered diagnosis" and others have suggested is a another way of demonizing mothers:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2004/08/09/the-bad-mother

The transing of kid appears to follow the same pattern at first glance, meaning that it seems like the mother is the sole or main driver. But in a lot of cases that might mainly be because women do the majority of hands-on childrearing, take kids to the doctors' appointments, read childrearing books, take the lead in doing research when a child develops mental or physical health problems.

Whilst as I mentioned earlier, there are indeed cases where mothers have transed children against the fathers' wishes, leading to court cases in Canada, the UK and the US, the fact remains that most of the kids being transed have two parents, and the dads are not passive lumps. Most of the mothers are heterosexual women acting in concert with the children's fathers; unless a mother has sole legal custody, she cannot make major medical decisions for a child all by herself - both parents have to agree to interventions like puberty blockers. Hence, all the consent forms have signature lines for two parents/guardians. (Lots of the forms are online.)

Susie Green has been very vocal in her claims that her husband was the one who couldn't accept that their son Jackie liked to play with dolls, and she felt compelled to go along with him. She has said that she personally didn't have a problem with Jackie's toy preferences - that she figured Jackie would grow up to be gay, and that was fine by her. Not sure she's telling the truth, but that's beside the point at the moment. I think what she has done to Jackie is monstrous, but she didn't do it alone.

Also, even when mothers are the main drivers of transing their kid within their family or household, these mothers are acting with full support of the medical establishment, schools and the authorities. They are being told by the medical professionals, school counselors and social workers they consult - as well as by all the literature they read, by pop culture, the mainstream media, Dr Phil, Dr Drew, Oprah, the BBC - that transing their children is the right thing to do. In fact, they're told it's the only thing to do - coz of the faked suicide stats that are always invoked to scare the bejeezus out of them and get them to believe "better a live daughter than a dead son."

This is a very different scenario to mothers with MbP. Yes, those mothers get attention for faking illnesses in their children. But they are not being actively encouraged to abuse their children by the entire culture and they're not celebrated the way moms of trans kids are. If Dee Dee Blanchard, who was killed by her daughter Gypsy Rose's boyfriend at Gypsy's behest, were still alive there's no way that after the horrific things she did to Gypsy were revealed she'd be invited to give TED talks and media interviews to educate the rest of the world about her terrific child-rearing methods or be held up as a champion for children's rights and an expert in child health care the way Susie Green is. And there's no way she would've been appointed CEO of a charity for kids with leukemia, muscular dystrophy, brain damage or any of the other conditions she pretended her daughter had the way Green was tapped to head up Mermaids.

So what happens in cases of maternal MbP and transing of kids doesn't follow "exactly the same pattern" after all.

You can't blame the men for that one.

I wasn't trying to "blame the men." I said within the immediate family, both mothers and fathers are usually involved, and both parents must sign off on medical interventions on minors. And I said that in the transing of kids, a lot of other adults outside the immediate family are involved as well. Such as "gender therapists," medical doctors, teachers, school administrators, the people who run organizations like Mermaids, support groups IRL and on social media, and extended family such as grandparents, aunts and uncles.

And I pointed out that many of the adults outside the immediate family who are involved in transing kids are men. Men came up with the idea of gender identity disorder and gender dysphoria in the first place. It was a man in the Netherlands who first came up with the idea of using puberty blockers to prevent "trans kids" from going through "the wrong puberty," and it was a man who got wind of the Dutch guy's work and introduced the practice in North America.

"Sex reassignment surgery" is a field invented and pioneered by male surgeons, and even today most of the surgeons doing both genital surgeries and other surgeries on young trans-identified people are men. Norman Spack, the MD in the US who prescribed puberty blockers at age 12 and cross-sex hormones for Jackie Green, is a man. So is the surgeon in Thailand who did Jackie's genital surgery. All the physicians who treated Jazz Jennings, advised the Jennings parents and whom Jennings saw for consults are men, with one exception - and Jazz saw the one female physician involved in his case for a replacement puberty blocker implant well into the transing process, after he had been on both PBs and estrogen for years. Yes, Jazz saw a psychotherapist of some sort who was female, but that was very late in the transition and only to get pro forma approval for genital surgery, years after Jazz's medical transition had commenced. But all the doctors who first put Jazz on blockers, prescribed him estrogen and did his genital surgeries were men.

And you can't solve that problem and protect children unless you admit the truth.

Agreed. Which is why I pointed out that that the transing of kids is not being done solely by women/mothers acting entirely on their own. Putting this entirely on women is a distortion of reality.

And it's not just true that these mothers are acting in concert with men (fathers, husbands, male doctors), it's also true that the whole philosophy behind "child transgenderism" involves a whole lot of men. Yes, a lot of women are advancing the notion of "the transgender child" today, but women aren't the only ones behind it. Members of both sexes are playing various roles.

In fact, the idea of "gender identity" was first cooked up by men, and the idea of the "transgender child" specifically was first invented by men too. Specifically by autogynephilic men for the purpose of discrediting what the sexologists had learnt about them, and obscuring what their own behavior was showing the world - namely that males who go trans always have sexual motives for doing so. These guys figured that if they could convince the world that young children are trans, and that being trans can be discerned long before puberty, then being trans would come to be seen both as innate, something people are born with, and as a phenomenon that has nothing at all to with sex. The whole reason "transsexualism" was changed into "transgenderism" was to take sex out of the picture so as to cover up men's sexual motives.

https://www.cambridgescholars.com/inventing-transgender-children-and-young-people

It really is arch hypocrisy to call sexual assaults a men's problem because they make up 98% of offenders and then not accept the same for munchausens or trans kids in relation to women.

Huh? What's arch about it? You think I'm being playful and teasing?

Are you really suggesting that 98% of the people involved in the new mania to label kids trans and to put them on medicines that will sterilize and stunt them and leave them with sexual dysfunction and all sorts of health problems are women?

But again, we didn't start off talking about - and disagreeing over - Munchasens by proxy. The original topic here was the transing of kids. You're the one who brought up MbP.

I disagree with you that that the transing of children is being done solely or almost exclusively by women (mothers) acting entirely on their own, and that no men - or hardly any men - are involved or culpable. I think the mothers who are involved in transing their kids have bought into regressive sex stereotypes that men and a male-dominated culture over time have had a large hand in cooking up and enforcing in the first place, and they've been further indoctrinated into the cult of transgenderism, a project that a whole of men and men-led enterprises are behind and actively pushing.

Here's Norman Spack, founder and co-director of the child gender clinic at Boston Children's Hospital and the physician who put Jackie Green on puberty blockers, and the one who introduced the idea of using puberty blockers on kids as early as possible:

https://youtu.be/302y7QVxrqA

https://youtu.be/ePKo8RvvxBw

You think men like this have no influence over mothers like Susie Green? Or or the women who attend or listen to his talks?

Human Rights Campaign (an organization founded by and run by men) has a video series about fathers involved in transing their kids and pushing the koolaid:

https://youtu.be/rl7RLbt_OOE

Celebrity athlete Dwayne Wade of the NBA talking about how great it is to trans his gay son Zion, now Zaya. Sounds like he's playing a pretty active part, along with his current wife, the kid's stepmom. (I've read that the child's mother is very much against this child being transed, but apparently the father has sole legal custody and thus only his say-so counts.)

https://youtu.be/4t186lHX4Ds

[–]denverkris 13 insightful - 2 fun13 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

"Gender identity disorders in infancy..."

These fecking people.

[–]MarkTwainiac 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Not to excuse these fecking people, but my understanding is that in the UK "infant" and "infancy" have broader, looser meanings than they do in the US.

On Mumsnet, children generally are often referred to as "infants." Wikipedia says:

In British English, an infant school is for children aged between four and seven. As a legal term, "infancy" continues from birth until age 18.[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infant#:~:text=The%20term%20%22infant%22%20is%20typically,to%20two%20years%20of%20age.&text=In%20British%20English%2C%20an%20infant,from%20birth%20until%20age%2018.

[–]jet199[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The standard British reading of this would be young children.

[–]ArthnoldManacatsaman 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Indeed. 'Infant', to me, comes before 'toddler'. So a child of about ~18 months tops is 'infant'.

[–]verystablegenius 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

hooooly shit lol. what a bunch of assholes.