When did men decide that feminists are required to believe in gender identity?

submitted by WhyDoesHeDoThat from self.GenderCritical

Back during the first wave of feminism the concept of gender identity didn't exist but the women back then were still very successful in their feminist activism. The fact that they were unware of gender identity didn't stop them at all.

Male sexologists invented the concept of gender identity back in the 1940s and it was popularized by more male sexologists during the next decades.

In second wave feminism women are described as a class, not a gender identity. Gender is mentioned in the context of gender roles. Second wave feminists were often successful in their activism despite not putting a big emphasis on gender identity.

So when did this change? Why did liberal feminists all of a sudden start believing that they must defend the concept of gender identity in order to acheive their feminist goals? History has shown that it's not necessary at all. Feminists don't need gender identity but men who pretend to be women need women to believe in gender identity. Men like to convince women that whatever the man needs is also what the woman needs and what's best for the woman.

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[–]VioletRemi 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

gender theory

It was invented by paedo sadist.

Good feminist will want to abolish gender roles/gender identity/gender, so women can work where they want, wear what they want and do what they want, instead of "playing gender role". All those speaks about gender theory is all about sexist stereotypes. And sexism and sexist stereotypec can be called directly, without using additional words.

Why did liberal feminists

They are making sure their men are happy. Liberal feminism is for everyone but women. Why it is called feminism when it is clearly not? I have no idea. Maybe it gives them some shield? Like TQ+ are using LGBT when demanding and making injustice, and hiding behind homosexuals as a shield (while attacking and erasing them at same time). Maybe here the same? Both in idea and how it works.

[–]MezozoicGay 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And sexism and sexist stereotypec can be called directly, without using additional words.

If transgenders will be calling it with real names as "sexist stereotypes" and "sexism", then no one will listen to it. While replacing those words with more neutral "gender" which don't have such negative connotations attached to it, they may even sound reasonable to some people.

Difference between "transwoman is a woman because transwoman is performing sexist stereotype of woman" and "transwoman is a woman because transwoman has woman gender", or difference between "transwomen are woman because transwomen are feeling that sexist stereotypes about women is about them as well" and "transwomen are women because transwomen are feeling as woman gender" is huge.

That is why they are replacing words, to hide the real meaning, to confuse other people.

[–]woodrup 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I rarely post here, but as the OP practically invites a male opinion I’ll weigh in. I work in construction with a lot of different age, and education background, co-workers (most, but not all men). I think it’s a mistake to view men going along with the current trans religion as evidence of their misogyny, on this subject anyway. I’ve come to notice three particular reactions among co-workers when the subject comes up. (And, it only comes up when I happen to remark on something in the news, etc. Nobody, absolutely nobody wants to talk about this stuff. It’s dangerously radioactive when we’re constantly dunned about creating unsafe work environments by the office folks.) But when in small groups, talking freely while having lunch on a jobsite, there are three basic takes that I see over and over. (As I’m over sixty, I’ll start by age seniority...) Guys my age, or younger married guys with kids, just want to keep their head down and not make waves. One friend confides in me that he finds the issue as insane as I do, but he can’t say a word at home because his wife and two high school daughters are super-woke. 30ish guys all seem to accept the new regime as something they didn’t originally sign on for, but front office is calling the shots, so whatever. Young guys just out of college.... Jesus! They are all primed to parrot back what their girlfriends have just told them, in order to answer questions I sometimes pose. That’s true, they’re just going with whatever their girlfriends are saying.... High school girls in Connecticut trying to compete against other girls... Olympic athletes, same... Incarcerated women dreading newly trans sex-offender cellmates... Rape crisis centers ... Boardrooms breaking the glass ceiling with trans execs... “Well, my girlfriend says...”

All these issues become take-home assignments to be answered by their woke girlfriends.

I know the 1984 comparison gets way too overused these days, but at 62 I can say I’ve re-read that book in every decade since 1974, and it’s never seemed so prescient (and actually being played out!) until the present.

2+2= 3, 4, or 5. or any other sum... and whatever sum (or sums) must be believed fervently (not simply accepted for expedience). I never completely understood that as something one could consider outside the novel, on first reading and studying 1984. I now understand the tragic truth of that logic.

[–]woodrup 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Replying to my own post above, It’s just occurred to me that most of the world seems to inhabit the same collective brainpan as my work chums. The choices are: keep your head down and say nothing, adopt the new regime even if you can’t figure it out, or, enthusiastically sign up because someone said you should.

But those are decisions made by me and a bunch of my fellow peons, knowing we could get fired if we stick our neck out... Who’s holding the big stick over the extremely powerful people who have the same scaredy-cat mindset??? Something has gotten completely out of whack.

(I respect that this is a forum for women to discuss among themselves. I won’t make a habit of inserting myself.)

[–]IridescentAnaconda 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Meh, I comment here often as a gay guy, I think it's fine as long as you respect women as people and not try to "mansplain".

I really believe that some extremely powerful players (even above the ones you call extremely powerful) are intentionally trying to disrupt society at a fundamental level. I have my hypotheses about why.

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I welcome your input. You didn't strike me as "inserting" yourself. I'm not clear whether this is indeed a "forum for women" or for all people who are GC. In any event, gender ideology tyranny and the campaign against free speech and idea diversity affect men as well as women, so I hope you will post more here. But then, I'm of your age group, so I'm long accustomed to and appreciative of hearing the views of people whose ideas and life experiences are different to mine.

[–]jet199 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It changed because TiMs actively started pushing to "help out" the feminist movement in much the same way Jimmy Saville offered to help out hospitals and charities. A lot of feminists then felt they had to support and defend these TiM allies out of personal loyalty.

Dr Em has just done some good essays on it.

https://uncommongroundmedia.com/what-was-happening-before-just-be-nice-feminism-part-ii-beth-elliot-1972/

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Banned from YouTube, Queer Theory Pedophilia Jeopardy with Derrick Jensen. Amusing for the students' reaction: https://web.archive.org/web/20190130070058/https://www.youtube.com/embed/2u3hmZCsXoE

[–]windrunner 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They started believing and defending the concept of gender identity when liberal feminists started pushing real feminists to accept that feminism was for 'everyone' cough, men but women.