[Vent] Vent about myself

submitted by iloveyou from self.GenderCritical

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[–]jelliknight 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I have a friend who works at a place who makes her wear a dress? What could I do if I were there?

As i said before, a lot of things you do will be a negotiation between what you want, what you need, and what other people want from you, and you have to draw your own line on how much you're willing to compromise. In most countries it's not actually legal to require women to wear dresses specifically, so if you live in one of those you could start with an e-mail to HR about the guidelines being a breech of equality law, (I'm just looking out for the company!), and they need to offer pants as an option. Or contract your union, it's their job to fight these battles for you. Or, you could simply wear thick leggings under the dress and a jacket over it, so you're more comfortable without making too many waves. You could talk to a boss or a senior person who seems cool and ask them about changing the requirements. But because I'm older, I'm more financially secure, and I'm experienced at being stubborn now I'd probably just buy business pants and a top that matches everyone else's uniforms in color and style and just start wearing it. This is what I mean when i talk about acting as if the rules don't apply to you. If challenged, i'd just say that I don't wear dresses and none of their offerings fit me properly, and I'm wearing professional attire that meets the dress codes. If they pushed, I'd make it an issue of sex discrimination, let them fire me, and then make a legal claim. They probably wouldn't because firing you and going through a court case is way more work than adding pants to the dress code. But it is a risk, which is why I say you have to pick your own line and I probably wouldn't make the same calls in every similar situation.

Something similar to this actually did happen to me. I worked on a mine site where you were required to wear a specific type of work pants. However, they were only provided in mens sizings. Because i have wide hips only the biggest mens sizes fit over them, and the pants were like clown pants around my waist and legs. So i just refused and wore my own jeans. Broke the uniform rules, and probably some OHS codes, but no one said a word for years, and when they did i just replied that the other pants don't fit me and im fine wearing my own. Later, when there was more women working there we were able to start ordering women's cuts.

Shaving is not a requirement. If you don't want to, don't. I don't get comments on it whether i shave or not. I take a pretty laid back approach to it, i shave if i feel like it and not if i don't, and the people around me seem to follow that sort of 'whatever' vibe.

I wanted to go in shorts like everyone else. I dreaded doing it though, I dreaded both shaving because my parents could see and comment, and I dreaded not shaving because I might have been seen totally different. I think that people will think things like...

My heart breaks for you and all other girls. You realize that this fear is not natural, it was taught to you as a way of making money? Darling, it's just hair, it grows back. Shave or don't shave, let people make their comments for or against whatever you do. But whatever you choose to do with your hair please wear the shorts and go for the swim. Life is short, youth is much shorter. Don't waste your precious time in fear of what other people might say about some tiny little hairs. As a compromise, you could try clippers and trim the hair without shaving it. It'll look like you're always a day or two after shaving and you'll get less itch growing back.

and I know people find it odd and even laugh and joke about it on her back - they accept that she doesn't abide by the rules, but they still can't help but judge and comment. This is what I'm afraid of, as well. I don't find her particularly flattering, but I know women who I do find flattering with short hair.

Oh people are absolutely joking and openly negative about my hair, behind my back and to my face. And it's not particularly flattering on me. I used to live in the tropics and kept my long hair in a pony tail ever day and one day i just realized how ridiculous it was. Every single day i'm washing it and brushing it, all just so I can tie it away for the whole day. What's the point? Might as well just cut it off. And it feels physically good, shampooing short hair. It dries quick, it doesn't get caught in stuff, it doesn't knot, it's great. When people I'm close to are negative about it I tell them "if you want to come to my house every morning and wash it and braid it for me, I'll grow it out. Otherwise you're asking me to do work every single day for something YOU want to look at. If you want it long, you look after it. No? That's what i thought." I don't care if it's flattering or not, I'm not looking at it all day. I would bet there's plenty of people making jokes behind my back but they're all too chicken to say it to my face ;) so who cares?

To be continued...

[–]iloveyou[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

As i said before, a lot of things you do will be a negotiation between what you want, what you need, and what other people want from you, and you have to draw your own line on how much you're willing to compromise.

That's a good call. There might always be something. I wouldn't wear my hair down, and I don't think I could dress a uniform that was too fitting because of sensory issues. But I totally would prioritize the sensory issues over embarassment and shame and could maybe wear a dress if I had to. I can't expect a workplace to just fit to my demands. But really I need to dress more professionally, which is also something I don't know how to do because I need baggier clothes again for sensory issues and comfort lol. I don't have makeup as well, so I wouldn't wear it to work if I were asked, just because I would have to learn how to do it and also use money on it. I could always make an excuse in that case to say it's bad for my skin if I wanted to negotiate.

In most countries it's not actually legal to require women to wear dresses specifically, so if you live in one of those you could start with an e-mail to HR about the guidelines being a breech of equality law

After your reply I tried researching for it, but I couldn't find any law specifically mentioning this, in fact I found articles saying this was almost a non-issue except in some exceptions. (which is a lie because my friend who's required to wear a dress is in a major company, not an unknown small one). It's tough. There is probably some equality law that could vaguely address it but I couldn't find it. It's weird how few are the articles that I found about this, and none were informative enough to help you defend yourself; they were mostly the kind of article that's a pat on the back of someone, "we are a gud country, nothing is bad, 100 years ago it was worse".

Also great story about the pants in the mine site. You're rad, working in a mine site, by the way.

My heart breaks for you and all other girls. You realize that this fear is not natural, it was taught to you as a way of making money? Darling, it's just hair, it grows back. Shave or don't shave, let people make their comments for or against whatever you do. But whatever you choose to do with your hair please wear the shorts and go for the swim. Life is short, youth is much shorter. Don't waste your precious time in fear of what other people might say about some tiny little hairs. As a compromise, you could try clippers and trim the hair without shaving it. It'll look like you're always a day or two after shaving and you'll get less itch growing back.

I feel so bad. I do feel like I'm wasting my youth. I even was imagining, today, being in my death bed and doing things I never did before without caring. I don't know if I would if it actually happened, because I might not magically stop caring, or I might not even be able to do it. Anyway, it's tough, because while those girls might think they wish they didn't care about me not shaving, I also want to belong - you know? I don't feel woman enough. For the more weird reasons. I see a girl with short hair - dang she's so cool, she's cooler than me, she's more woman than me. I see a girl wearing a baggy hoodie, she looks prettier and more womanly than me. I see a girl wearing fit pants or long hair, she's also more womanly than me. I see a girl with like... I'm sorry but it happens or has happened - with bigger boobs and her bra fits and I'm like, dang, she has a bra that fits and I don't, she's like 12 and poor girl for having them, but like, also cool because my mom never went buy a bra with me and when one time I wanted one, and asked her to go with me, and I said my size (I made measures at home), the lady laughed at me, and my mom just piled up on me saying that wasn't my size. But now some years later I think yes it is. But I am still too ashamed to order them home, and also I don't want to do it with my parents paying for it because once my dad even came in the living room chuckling and saying he had a movement in the bank that his card was used in a lingerie store, and it made no sense, he was very puzzled trying to solve a mystery. (Meanwhile, he lends me his card so I can buy clothes when I need to, SO WHY WOULDN'T I GO IN AN WOMEN'S UNDERWEAR SHOP?) - but I feel really scared and ashamed in those shops and also can't find my size, but it's the only way to get a bra nearer my size, because I can't order online because I don't want my family to see the package.

And like lots of things are a problem and I want to belong, but everyone else belongs more than I. And maybe not caring would be what would make me belong, but I still have gone to weddings in a dress and didn't shave, but just because I did it and might have seemed to others that maybe I didn't care, doesn't mean I didn't care and felt self-conscious.

I meet new people and I want to impress them so I am scared of showing my body, even less the unshaved body. I'll think of the trimming - but to be honest I feel that it's prettier and softer to have full grown leg hair that when people have those tiny little spiky hairs. I can try a trimmer - does a brother's beard trimmer work? (I can buy one like it and so I don't have to research)

[–]jelliknight 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I do feel like I'm wasting my youth

It's a terrible feeling. I sometimes have the feeling that I'm wasting time. It is so precious. Go and have fun, doing anything. And if you don't know how to have fun, just go out and be around other people. Have experiences, even if they're all bad ones it's still worthwhile.

...she's more woman than me

Woman isn't a scale. You can't be more or less. My mentor (70+) says to me "There's no wrong way, only your way."

That bra story, oof. Yeah I get it. I wish you had a cool aunt or someone who could take you. Bra sizes are pretty variable depending on cut. They're supposed to be a "measurement" but there's a lot of wiggle in different styles. I tried on 10 recently before i found one that fitted properly, and needed different sizes in different brands. I know it's a bit too intimidating to go into a lingerie store for a fitting. There are online fit guides you can look at. Basically get the band comfortable first so that it's going straight around and not pulling up at the back or digging in too tight, then try different cup sizes (A, B, C etc) with the same band size. And it's just about what's comfortable to you. if it's technically not how it's supposed to fit but it feels and looks great, buy that one. And try the lingerie section of a bigger store like a walmart, that way it won't specify what you're buying. Your parents are a bit weirdly uncomfortable about normal stuff like underwear lol. I'm guessing you have a large cup and small band? They can be hard to find.

everyone else belongs more than I

Haha, i just had a discussion with a friend recently about being a teenager and always feeling like there was a massive party happening off somewhere where the cool people all go and you were the only one not invited, but since I've been an adult I've never met anyone who was actually AT that awesome party, I've only ever met people who were also 'not invited'. In reality its just a pretty universal feeling. It's made worse today by the internet and people not actually going and connecting with each other. You can have 1000 online friendships and you'll still feel very alone. Real life friendships are irreplaceable.