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[–]Nona_Biba 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Great post!

In almost none of these societies did two-spirit people born male identify as women.

This is a very important point. The other day I read the two spirit wiki entry after someone else brought up Two spirits in this sub. It seems like it's pretty controversial in native communities. A quote- "While this new term has not been universally accepted—it has been criticized as a term of erasure by traditional communities who already have their own terms for the people being grouped under this new term, and by those who reject what they call the "western" binary implications, such as implying that Natives believe these individuals are "both male and female" is a pretty scathing indictment of transgender appropriation.

Look at the "traditional indigenous terms" section. Pretty much every definition is "acts/ looks like a man/woman." ACTS. They didn't believe those people actually WERE real women or men. Not like transgender people today are insisting. You can't use two spirit people as a historical "proof" that transgender people always existed.

In a society in which women are routinely starved for the benefit of men, no man is going to dabble in the delusion that he is 100% well and truly a woman, with no differences whatsoever.