all 56 comments

[–]Lady_Montgomery 37 insightful - 5 fun37 insightful - 4 fun38 insightful - 5 fun -  (12 children)

The patriarchy doesn't understand that stuff like this only proofs to women that we are considered subhuman and more and more are joining the frontline because we are sick off it. I'll risk it all!

[–]rusalka 38 insightful - 2 fun38 insightful - 1 fun39 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

I hadn’t shared my radical feminist views with anyone in person for fear of being misconstrued as a “bigot”, but recently my close friend came to me with doubts and questions about gender identity/transgenderism, born from all the recent mensuration/JK Rowling talk and her own critical thinking. It felt so good to finally speak about my views with another woman, out loud, and be understood and agreed with. I think this kind of solidarity is so important, and that many women are having these kinds of thoughts but we are all too afraid to speak of them. The opposing side may be very vocal, but our numbers may not be as small as we think. It truly is time to start speaking out if we want to elicit change.

[–]SameOldBS 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I dream of this. I really need some GC friends cos all of mine are left wing and saturated with be-niceness.

[–]fogellegof 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

To be honest: I think most people are on our side, especially those not involved in social media or politics. It's just common sense. But either they are afraid to say it because it's not PC to say a man isn't a woman, or for those 'normals' who are not involved in lots of debates it's so obvious that it doesn't need to be stated, because... a man isn't a woman.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

So true. My parents have no idea about this being an issue. I just had a talk about this with my mom. I couldn't even imagine talking to my Abuela about this. It's so over their head.

[–]fogellegof 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Just last week I talked to my mother - my parents live in a non english country in a small village. Even they heard the JKR thing and didn't get it, so I explained it in great detail and she couldn't get it how the world has gone so crazy. But to know that even there, in this tiny village, it was covered by media and it spreaded the word, gave me lots of hope. The people aren't as stupid as one might think they are. And even if "the media" here was mostly very critically against JKR, most people I talked to didn't get it and read JKRs statement and had the feeling like most: "If stating biological facts is transphobic, than maybe being 'transphobic' isn't a bad thing". Which was the reason for the rising of GC reddit (and for the banning).

[–]LasagnaRossa 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Definitely. If I talk with people in real life nobody believes in that bullshit, not even the most LGBT friendly. The view that TWAW is something only believed by a niche group.

[–]fuckingsealions 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I'm trying to gently peak my friends without alienating anyone. Liberal feminism seems to be working ok for a lot of people.

[–]Finnegan7921 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It'll work ok for them until something happens to them involving a TRA and they get doxxed, reported to their employer, harassed online, etc. All it takes is turning one of them down at a bar, not wanting some ladyschlong after a date where someone claimed they were a woman, a dude leering at them in a changing room, etc. Then they'll see how it really works.

[–]fuckingsealions 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Or they'll starting marrying tims because we're terrible, haha. To which I say good luck.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)


[–]sosorreal 26 insightful - 2 fun26 insightful - 1 fun27 insightful - 2 fun -  (20 children)

same. almost broke up with my boyfriend last night over this. still might never see him again because I am so pissed/disappointed on his views of women and censorship.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 27 insightful - 1 fun27 insightful - 0 fun28 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Same. Broke up with mine (kinda?) this past weekend over his lack of critical thinking, unwillingness to learn or listen, and poor communication skills. He stands against JKR and can't say why. Message me if you want to commiserate about it.

[–]yishengqingwa666 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Men know that trans MRActivism is misogyny. They KNOW. That's why they support it. Women need to abandon men en masse, they are misogynists and parasites off of women's goodwill, kindness and labor (yes, including sexual and emotional labor). Let them date and fuck TIMs. They deserve each other.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I don't think they realize it. That's the problem. Once the mental gymnastic logic is planted in them, they decided that was their stance. Then that stance was validated by the masses of their peers. What did they have to lose? They have 0 skin in the game so they don't take the time to learn or stand up for us. They're afraid to step out and being called a bigot out of their own selfish preservation. They subconsciously think this will redeem themselves of the guilt of the racist patriarchy. "I'm one of the good bros".

[–]1nvar 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I'd take a structured approach to induction for vaguely reasonable people:

  1. should TIMs be allowed to compete in the Olympics against women? (point out the "world records" by formerly-mediocre males)

  2. should TIMs be allowed in women's prisons? (point out rapes, and how they almost always keep their penises)

  3. should TIMs be allowed in women's shelters? (^ as above)

Then move onto deeper truths like AGP, grooming/recruiting of vulnerable kids, homophobia (pakistan, tavistock), and misogyny (is a woman dressing in masculine clothing a man?).

[–]yoperreosola[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm gonna try this on, thanks!!

[–]flowerskull21 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Disagree. I think most know exactly what it is, especially the vocal ones online, and that is why they are such big supporters.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think they're too brainwashed to realize it's misogyny. My "boyfriend" is not vocal. He jumped on the bandwagon once or twice in conversation but is mostly apathetic to the debate.

[–]remquarkq 7 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 4 fun8 insightful - 5 fun -  (1 child)

Good for you. Maybe he can go try dating a trans woman now.

[–]Finnegan7921 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

HAHAHAHA, that's the funny part. Almost every straight guy who goes along with TWAW would never in a million years date a TiM. They may fuck around with them on the DL to get off to some fetish, but publicly ? No way.

[–]SameOldBS 18 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 0 fun19 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I guess I'm lucky. My husband doesn't try to defend male BS any more. He pretty much agrees with me on all of it now, because in his heart of hearts he knows what men can be like. But if he drops dead there is no way in the world I'd put up with anything less than wholehearted support on this from a man. I'd rather live the rest of my life alone than share a bed with someone who won't back women.

[–]Taralafya 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Me too, if something happened to my husband who supports my gc/rad leanings, or he left for some reason, I will not remarry or date men. I just don't want to take that chance.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They exist! I know it. Sounds like you have a smart man who is willing to learn and converse.

[–]dancing_with_durga 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

My husband cares about women and so he instantly saw how sinister transgender ideology is. He's now even more outraged than me (if that's possible). There are men out there who care about women. Don't settle.

[–]aldoushuxleyghost 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I’m sorry he’s being an asshat. Stick to your guns. It’s the truth.

[–]Heczed 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The anger has definitely been ramping up over recent weeks. So many women are are starting to speak up publicly because the balance of anger and self-preservation has started to tip.

[–]WinterWoman 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Wow theyre doxxing you for having an opinion? Horrible.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Not yet, but I am mentally preparing for it. I will never shut up.

[–]WinterWoman 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I hope they don't. And even if they do, be strong, this too shall pass. People cancel and forget once theyre bored of you. Stay strong. Sending hugs!

[–]yoperreosola[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks for the support. I'd rather live on the streets than be silenced.

[–]flowerskull21 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Agreed. Luckily I work in a fairly conservative environment (has its drawbacks at times), but I can at least feel comfort in that my coworkers agree with me about biological reality.

[–]AlissonHarlan 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yes of course we should speak up. The question is HOW. How interract with people (men) in a constructive way ? I mean, i don't want to be the good girl, but i don't think power is the right solution (you know, like when it's a family dinner, everybody yell at everybody, and nobody listen) I think one key is understanding. unfortunately, most people don't want understand. they want only lives in echo chambers. So that's where my reflexion is, now.

I'm on men subreddit, because i want to understand them, understand their point of view, what seems unfair for them, and how they suffer from patriarchy, too. I'm sure that some men do that,too, to see the women's side, but there is so much 'casual mysoginy' still... it's so normal for most of the people, they did not even realise... But yes,... today i ... i'm mad. About double-standards, about how much the typical redditor hate women, I feel so defeated as a women... i mean if reddit can do that, who can't ?

yeah sorry for the vant, so speak, yes, but with the right words, in the appropriate way (that's all the difficulty) to reach your public (men for the majority)

[–]writerlylesbian 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

look, that is an admirable goal. But men are not harmed by patriarchy. They benefit from it. Yes, even the ones who are lower down the hierarchy. If men wanted to change things, they would. They hold all the power in being able to bring about change if patriarchy were so bad for them. Men enjoy stringing women along and making them think that if things are explained just that little bit better, they'll see the light. They're wasting your time and energy. Sure, there may be common ground on things like being anti-censorship, since certain groups on the left and right are both suffering from that right now. There might be common ground around protecting children, protecting female-only spaces (even if the base reasons for doing so are different). That's fine. Just don't mistake any of that for supporting women's liberation.

[–]fogellegof 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My solution is to speak on a rational level. Most of my (closer) friends are somewhat political, but not 'SJW' or TRA. In the last 2 months, I had four very long talks with four of them; it organically came to the topic and then my rad fem introduction 101 began. All were lengthy talks, and each time, my friend(s) were pretty shocked about what it really means if there are no rights and there is no safety based on sex left. All of them had the usual position ("everyone should live their best lifes freely") before, like me and many others here, until I pointed out on which points the lines are crossed and that the safety concerns of 51% of the population are being ignored for catering mens feelings. Those were very emotional discussions and I peaked all of them, and now it is wonderful to speak freely with them. And now that I've opened their eyes, at least two of them often come to me with issues or observations and especially the JKR case re-peaked them, because they saw what's happening with their own eyes.

[–]Themagicalmidget 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Pretty much this, so many issues can be solved if people with different views stop attacking each other and just listen for a bit. But forming echo chambers won't help. We live all inhabit this planet together in real life, thus we should a bit online as well.

[–]yoperreosola[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That is my approach with people who genuinely want to learn, but it's really hard to explain my 5 years' worth of learning feminism to people who are just dipping their toe and have a short attention span. I feel like we have an even harder job because the majority is not on our side so we have to be super clear with these people. I won't stop though! I try my best not to sound angry and self-righteous.

All logic and reasoning goes out the window with people who say you deserve going to the gulag and incite violence. (happened to me today)

[–]veruscka8 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I think it’s possible for me to lose friends over this. Maybe there should be a thread on strategies for having a conversation with loved ones who are TRA supporters?

[–]yoperreosola[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I have lost acquaintances...FB "friends". You should start it! :)

[–]threefingersam 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah definitely. Even when I was talking to a close friend, I felt like I was treading murky waters. People can be on the sliding-scale of "live and let live" to neck-deep in TRA activism.