For people who think bathrooms should be segregated by birth sex, are passing trans men entitled to use the women's bathroom?

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[–]loveSloaneDebate King 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (36 children)

Threats of suicide are not much defense when stacked up against rapists. Suicide can be prevented by putting the person in appropriate psychiatric care. This is a more appropriate response than giving them the thing they threaten suicide over.

Yes. This. All of this.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (35 children)

Idk how the rest of the world doesn’t seem to get it. Suicidal people go to the hospital. There is no other reasonable response to suicide threats over anything else, why the hell would suicide threats over preferred bathroom usage be an exception?

It’s like they think if someone says they will kill them selves if they aren’t given an iPhone, the best thing to do is to drive them to the electronics store, because the lack of phone is the issue somehow.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I’m honestly very curious about how many trans people would keep threatening suicide if they got hospitalized instead of placated every time.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Probably the same amount of cluster-b personalities that do. Handful of really dedicated ones will but the rest find a new threat that gives them the control over others, and that’s all they really want.

[–]inkling 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (32 children)

It’s like they think if someone says they will kill them selves if they aren’t given an iPhone

The fact that you think this is comparable shows a disturbing lack of empathy...

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No it shows I’m aware of emotional manipulation and don’t fall for it

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (30 children)

What trans people are doing is actually significantly worse.

They are threatening suicide if other people’s rights, comfort and privacy are respected and maintained, because they can’t or don’t want to accept the truth of their sex.

The fact that you don’t understand that is what’s disturbing. The fact that they are getting away with this is what’s disturbing.

Where is the empathy in trans people for the people who’s rights they are undoing?

Where was the empathy from the dude at wii spa when he was swinging his dick in front of women and at least two young girls even though he had access to a safe unisex space?

Where’s the empathy from Karen white when he was raping other inmates?

Where was the empathy from Dana Rivers when he murdered two women and their son?

Where was the empathy for the many many women seeking help and safety when that rape shelter in Canada was shut down for acknowledging that women who had just been raped may want a space free of males while they seek help?

Where is the empathy when rape and murder threats are sent to women just for disagreeing with your ideology?

Where’s the empathy from Jessica Yaniv when he wanted women to wax his balls for validation even though the business I’m question only waxed females?

Where is the empathy when trans women waste gynecologist’s time with check ups for their male genitals when it’s already not always easy to even get those appointments when you have the required equipment?

Or is it only trans people who deserve empathy?

Do you genuinely not get that other people matter? It really seems that way.

[–]inkling 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (29 children)

Your whole argument seems to be whataboutism and no one said there wasn't empathy for these people anyway.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (28 children)

You mentioned lack of empathy. I asked about lack of empathy.

You want us to have empathy for people who think they are entitled to spaces and things they aren’t entitled to. You want us to have empathy for people who want to take from us, and who jump to use emotional manipulation and gaslighting to get what they want.

So I asked you about whether or not those same people had empathy for the countless people who their demands affect and screw over.

There isn’t any empathy for the millions of women who don’t want men in their spaces…

There was so little empathy for the rape victims who needed that Canadian shelter to stay open that in addition to the shut down, their crowdsourcing for money to assist rape victims also got shut down…

When women share the rape and death threats they get from the people you’re cape-ing for, tras say it was right to threaten to rape and murder them because after all, they don’t think a man is a woman…

Tras were more focused on making sure Rivers, White, and Yaniv were addressed with female pronouns than they were on addressing their crimes…

So, like I said, where is the empathy from trans people for the people I mentioned? And if they lack empathy for us, why the fuck should we have any for them?

[–]inkling 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (27 children)

So I asked you about whether or not those same people had empathy for the countless people whom their demands affect and screw over.

Youre so screwed over yet cant find a review of the evidence that proves this? If there are so many instances of you being screwed over surely there's data to back that up?

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

You need a study to say women who have been raped deserve empathy?

[–]inkling 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Holy strawman!

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

It’s literally what you said?

Sloane asked where your and tra supporters empathy is for women and you asked for a study proving women are ‘so screwed over’

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Do you, though?

Do you need me to link a study for you to understand what happened to the Vancouver rape shelter?

Im not sure such a study exists. Or why it would. Or how it would.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

This isn’t a study with data.

These are references to actual shit that happened. I don’t need to prove anything. The proof is that the shit happened.

A rape center for women was shut down. Because female rape victims didn’t want to be forced to share space with men and the shelter understood that and supported them. They then crowdsourced for funds to reopen so they could continue to help rape victims.

The gofundme got shut down. Because they didn’t allow men in the shelter. Because the female victims didn’t want men in the space.

What the fuck data do you want? Look. It. Up.

Surely you understand that rape victims having the only rape shelter they felt comfortable and safe going to be shut down screws them over?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I also said affect. Not just screw over.

Dana Rivers murdered a family. The effect is that three people lost their lives. He also shut down michfest before the murders.

Karen White raped inmates. Had he been treated as the man he is, that wouldn’t have happened. Him being allowed in a female prison had an impact on at least the women he raped.

Yaniv tried to sue that company. You don’t think that affected them?

You don’t think being sent rape and death threats affects people?

You don’t think men being given carte blanche to undo female right if they say they’re women has any effect on actual women?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Im sorry- isn’t our other comment thread talking about the several sources that HP linked?

But also, Dana Rivers, Karen White, Jessica Yaniv, the rape shelter in Canada, the many many murder and rape threats sent to women…

These things/incidents/crimes happened. They are easily looked up and I think pretty much all of the people who participate in this sub are well aware of who and what I referenced.

These aren’t hypotheticals or theoreticals… these are specific, easily looked up incidents.

There’s plenty of data to back this up. Because the shit actually happened. So, I guess I could just google their names and post links and link the terfisaslur site but honestly you’re probably the only person here who doesn’t get those references readily.

Eta- i went to link but actually a few of these were already linked by HP, so clearly you didn’t read what she linked or you did but don’t know how to argue around it

[–]inkling 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Im sorry- isn’t our other comment thread talking about the several sources that HP linked?

Yeah, so if you go to the subs homepage and click "comments" you will be able to see all the comments in the order in which they are posted. You have to go back to at least page two to see the relevant comments but you can see that I clearly asked for sources before being given any.

Lets just be very clear here though: you have no actual data, right? You have cherry picked anecdotes, and thats it.

Eta- i went to link but actually a few of these were already linked by HP, so clearly you didn’t read what she linked or you did but don’t know how to argue around it

I already addressed that comment.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

If i have to go back pages it usually means those comments are older than mine…

Regardless of when the links were linked- she did link them before we started going back and forth now. So you’ve had ample time to read those links and understand what I was referring to, since as I said, many if not most of the situations I referenced were linked by her. So if you’d like me to link them again I can, but whether I do or don’t, these things still happened and you’re deflecting and avoiding addressing the point by trying to focus on who linked what and when.

Let’s just be very clear- information on everything I referenced is easily found. I’m not making a scientific or academic claim. I’m referencing an incident(s). You can look them up for yourself if you don’t know what I’m referring to.

We are talking about empathy. What the fuck data does anyone have on empathy?

I gave examples, some specific, some generally recurring. Maybe I took for granted that you’d heard of the incidents I referenced, since everyone else here knows of them. But if you don’t, you can easily look it up.

There’s a difference between making a claim that needs to be backed up and referencing a commonly known incident.