I don't think porn is perfect brainwashing that programmes people's brains to act in a certain way. The relationship details are unclear but a lot of it is serving desires not creating them.

Why do I think that? Because the pattern is so consistent and the pattern of changing people's desires through porn is weak.

Sounds like I do need to read you the plots to erotic that is popular with women. The lit is full of sexualized forms of masculinity.

Why does everything come back to erotica with you?

I was explicitly talking about the sexual elements of gender. It's literally the topic. Of course I'm going to talk about porn, erotica, sexual fantasies, desires and everything related.

Do you not see how gender norms exist outside of pornography?

Of course and I don't think sexuality all comes down to pornography. I think pornography reflects sexuality possibly more than it informs it because I don't think humans especially on drives likes sex are blank.

Disliking how someone presents their sexual proclivities in public isn’t dictating their sexuality.

This is basically back to "gay people need to keep in the bedroom stuff."

You think heterosexual conforming people don't show any sexuality in public? That there is no sexual display at all?

How is disliking it when a man wears a grown and calls himself strawberry lemonade and makes jokes about women being mean and awful dictating to him whether he is straight/gay/bi? Dresses is not a sexuality.

You are disingenuously mixing up dresses with misogyny here. They are different things.

By this reasoning everyone should be masculine.

We don’t comment on the sexual behaviour of anyone who doesn’t insert it into our lives when we don’t want it. It just so happens that men are the most invested in inserting their sexual behaviour into discussions and women’s spaces.

Again you are jumping between topics. Again this is a common socially conservative talking point. "Why won't the gay men stop inserting their perversion into our lives." You are using arguments used by social conservatives against gay people on trans people to complain about gnc males that aren't in women's spaces. Crossdressers do not identify as women. Billy Porter in a gown is not in women's spaces.

You don’t seem to recognise anything gnc that isn’t sexual and it’s so weird.

Yes I recognise non sexual gnc things. But we are discussing sexual aspects of gender.

You are also a person who likes to discuss sex and gender. That's why you are here.

Gendered socialisation happens to babies, saying boys like trucks and don’t cry. is that about a sexual kink? Can you talk about any topic without shoehorning it into sex and fetishes? It feels like you talk about that and nothing else.

We are discussing gender non conformity and sexuality is always going to be part of gender the debate.

When these topics come up gc puts it's blinkers on. All it can see is people doing things it doesn't like completely ignoring the majority of sexuality going on.

I'm here defending gnc men in their gnc sexuality. I'd also defend all gnc people and their gnc sexualities.