Same-sex sexual desire as the natural, but not actualised, default (criticism of sexuality)

submitted by SexualityCritical from (self.GCdebatesQT)

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[–]Penultimate_Penance 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Eh, sexuality isn't a choice. I suspect a lot of bisexual people make the mistake in thinking their ability to be attracted to both sexes can be extrapolated onto everyone else. Tastes aren't a choice. You're either into something or you aren't. Some people love licorice, some people hate it. Some people are only attracted to the opposite sex, others are attracted to both sexes in varying degrees.

Heterosexuality and homosexuality are both natural. Having blonde, brown, red or black hair is also natural. Humans come in quite a few varieties.

[–]SexualityCritical[S] 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (1 child)

I hear this sentiment over and over again. It appears everyone's replying with the same general statement, 'You can't choose your sexuality. Yes, bisexual people exist, but they're still attracted to both sexes.'

See, I don't understand what's being said here. There are a variety of sexual things which a person can do, which are all actions. If one sits still, and never moves, they won't experience sexuality. If one grows up in an isolated chamber, and has no contact with anyone else, they'll never develop any kind of sexual feelings. Sexuality exists solely in a social context.

Having sex with another person of any sex requires a social environment. Sexual intercourse, after all, is a social act, not a private one. It involves two or more individuals in order to commence. If sexual intercourse is not a choice, it is rape. That's the only possible thing it can be. Masturbation is, however, a private act, as it almost always involves just one person. But, it is, too, a choice. If not, it is rape as well. Sexual fantasies, since they are internal, inside oneself, and not external, outside of oneself, are a private act, and can, unlike masturbation and sex, exist only as a private act. Anyone can fantasize about whichever sex they want. All their sexual fantasies could be about men, or all of them could be about women. And, as for consumption of erotica or pornography, it can be a social act, but also a private act. Regardless, unless one is being forced to look at sexual imagery, which is a form of sexual abuse, it is a choice.

So, how is sexuality not a choice? Well, according to those criticising political lesbianism and its familiarities, it's because people claiming they can be attracted to both sexes are, in fact, bisexual, and that, as a fact also, not everyone is bisexual. Now, I disagree with this notion. I don't consider sexuality to be real, a scientific phenomenon, but something society has made up. However, putting that aside for now, anyway, citing bisexuality here is a logical fallacy.

There is a difference between potentiality and actuality. Potentiality refers to the possibility of something occurring, that it might occur, and not that it has occurred (it hasn't occurred, at least yet). Actuality, in contrast, refers to something which is either happening currently, ongoing, or has happened, that it has, indeed, been actualised. My claim is that anyone can be sexually attracted exclusively to either one. Anyone can. Their love of a sex, in romantic and sexual terms, exists due to ideology. Clearly, no one thinks, 'Through an objective analysis, I find this sex repulsive, but nonetheless can't help myself from being attracted to them.' That makes no sense, and is a clear-cut contradiction. It is saying one's mind has been made up, that a sex is unattractive to them, but, simultaneously, they can't help being sexually attracted to them.

Just because someone can be sexually attracted to both sexes doesn't mean they are. They can still choose to be exclusively interested in one sex. Anyone can do this. It's not just something 'bisexual' people can do.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If one grows up in an isolated chamber, and has no contact with anyone else, they'll never develop any kind of sexual feelings. Sexuality exists solely in a social context.

No, sexuality is not social, but biological. If heterosexual man was in an isolated chamber since birth for 30 years and then released into the world, that man will be attracted to women and will be aroused by women. If same will happen with homosexual man - he will be attracted to men and will be aroused by men. You can't learn sexuality and you can't chose who you are attracted to. The only way to "overcome" sexuality is strong mental disorders, a lot of sexual abuse and/or strong paraphilias.

So, how is sexuality not a choice?

At first you said that "sexual act is a choice" and then equated sexual act with sexuality. Those are different things. Your sexuality exist even without any sexual acts. If you are a man who is attracted to women, but had no sex you are not "asexual", you are still heterosexual man. If lesbian was "correctivelly raped" by men, and it is her only sexual experience - with men, she is not becoming heterosexual, she is still homosexual, she is still lesbian, even thought she only had sex with men. Sexual act is not sexuality.

I don't consider sexuality to be real, a scientific phenomenon, but something society has made up.

It is not stopping to exist because someone believes in it or not. Sexuality exist for all humans and animals.

Post-modernism is just a philosophy, not a reality. You can't change reality by renaming something or thinking about something in a different way.

Just because someone can be sexually attracted to both sexes doesn't mean they are. They can still choose to be exclusively interested in one sex.

If bisexual marries someone and spend whole life with them, they are still bisexual, even thought they only had sex with their partner whole life. However, they still can be attracted to both sexes - when heterosexual and homosexual people can't. Even if gay man or lesbian will want to be with opposite sex, will really like that person and will want to spend life together - they will not be able to get sexually attracted and aroused by that person anyways. They just can't to chose to like opposite sex, regardless of how they personally want - their body will not listen. And it is not possible at all to start liking opposite sex sexually for homosexual people. Same for heterosexual people but about their own sex. If it was possible, I'd most likely would be heterosexual already, same as gay men and lesbians in Iran, who are murdered because they just can't love opposite sex, even after tortures and even in fear of death. It is just not possible to change your sexuality.

You are failing to understand that other people have different experience and that if you are bisexual that does not mean everyone is bisexual.